The Energy Non-Crisis

[Phil Deese]

Vicvanb..You Can't read again and again and again!!

Divid Dittman was talking about spills by drilling...not spills by a drunk captain!! It also appears you don't know what your talking about concerning the caribou.

Here's what big Al posted.....he lives there....he knows.....you just got a Greenie" report from one of your liberal buddies!!

We have dumb a$$ greenies just like everywhere else. Just not as many. If I were to guess, I'd say the majority of the people are in favor. I see more of the "DRILL HERE, DRILL NOW" bumper stickers every day on the roads. (maybe as high as 80 to 90%)

The argument about the caribou being affected by oil drilling is a joke. Dis proven by 40 years of the Alaskan pipe line and the drilling on the north slope.

Our state government is in favor of drilling.

Let the people of Alaska vote...isn't that what you lib's are all about...every vote must count right??? ROCK THE VOTE!!

Drill Here, Drill Now!!!

Get you stories straight....don't listen to just one lib that doesn't know what he's talking about!!

 

[vicvanb]

And Again (It Never Ends!)

It also appears you don't know what your talking about concerning the caribou....

Sorry, Phil, what I posted about caribou is factual. If you think the Porcupine Caribou Herd was impacted by oil development, or increased 5-fold, you are getting your information from La La land!

 

[Big Al]

If memory serves, the Exxon Valdez spill was in 1989 (in Alaskan waters). If those cars in the Wal-Mart lots had seeped this much oil, the oil in the parking lots would be half way up the doors!

C'mon Phil, get it straight!

Parking lot and road remoal of snow has the requirement to not be dump except in areas where there is a no chance of getting into the water system (read as streams and lakes).

This is due to the high oil content.

 

[Phil Deese]

vinvanblab........................................ ........

Join Drill Here, Drill Now...Newt needs your support.....we're now up to 930,000 votes........don't listen to all those libs......they'll confuse you!!
Keep my Tahoe running!! You don't eat caribou anyway!!

ROCK THE VOTE!!!

 

[chino69]

The China Syndrome

I have heard that one of the biggest reasons that we have stopped making nuclear reactors is due to one movie, The China Syndrome. A 1979 thriller film which tells the story of a reporter and cameraman who discover safety coverups at a nuclear power plant. This movie stared none other than Jane Fonda as the reporter.

The China Syndrome is when all safty measures fail and the core melts it's way through the earth possibly to China. It was meant to scare the public and it did.

Concho Bill

Bill,
The Three Mile Island Accident happened around the same time The China Syndrome came out. TMI galvanized the nuclear industry, implementing major changes in operation, training, design, testing, maintenance, emergency preparedness, etc. It was the best thing that could have happened to the nuclear power industry because these changes were implemented in every operating reactor in the U.S., being mandated by law. Without going into all the technical detail, here's an interesting fact. Had the TMI control room operators allowed the emergency safety systems auto initiate, as designed, there would have been no accident. The low reactor water level would have tripped several set-points which would have auto started emergency core cooling pumps to keep the core covered with water.

I've seen films of camera probes into the damaged reactor core where the fuel bundles melted. In spite of this major accident, there was little or no release to the environment because the containment structure performed it's function.

As one who has worked in the nuclear industry for approx. 30 years I can tell you that The China Syndrome is a joke and only a Hollywood creation. The equipment, personnell, scenario, etc. is pure Hollywood. Unfortunately, some people's view of reality is not well grounded and will believe fantasy.
Chino69

 

[Hammer1]

Sometimes I wonder if the unbiased biologists without a dog in the fight are related to the unbiased Global Warming folks who want $45 trillion to solve global warming.

It's June and we're still wearing jackets here in Idaho. Some guests this morning from San Francisco were asking to borrow something heavier.


.

 

[vicvanb]

Not Out East!

It's June and we're still wearing jackets here in Idaho. Some guests this morning from San Francisco were asking to borrow something heavier.
.

Man, it sure was HOT on the East Coast about 10 days ago! Whew! Some guests from the Midwest would not leave the air conditioned house!!

What do these things mean? Nadda!

The only thing that counts are long term average temps and they clearly show a warming trend in recent years.

 

[cntryboy1289]

Vic, how do they compare to the warming trends the earth has had over the centuries? Do a comaparison and put it up here so we can actually see just what the difference is if you will.

 

[vicvanb]

Don't Be Too Sure!

You don't eat caribou anyway!!

Everytime you post there are false claims!

 

[vicvanb]

Vic, how do they compare to the warming trends the earth has had over the centuries? Do a comaparison and put it up here so we can actually see just what the difference is if you will.

Of course there have been warming (and cooling) trends in the past. These have produced huge swings in climate. There is no debate about this.

The only thing that is important now is that there is a warming trend and it's caused by greenhouse gases. The debate is over among reputable climate scientists. I stress reputable. Yes, there are those who try to debunk it--just like the tobacco industry produced "scientists" who claimed smoking was not harmful.

 

[chino69]

Smoking commercials

Yes, there are those who try to debunk it--just like the tobacco industry produced "scientists" who claimed smoking was not harmful.

This quote brings to mind the cigarette commercials of the late 50's. Remember the one where the actor was dressed like a doctor and was selling Kools, as if they had a medicinal value?
Chino69

 

[vicvanb]

This quote brings to mind the cigarette commercials of the late 50's. Remember the one where the actor was dressed like a doctor and was selling Kools, as if they had a medicinal value?
Chino69

Yes, I do remember it.

Back then TV was chock full of cigarette commercials. If you wanted to be part of the "in crowd" you just had to smoke. Somehow I was not convinced and never got hooked even though my father was a chain smoker for 50 years! I didn't have to smoke--there was enough second hand smoke in the house for everyone!

 

[Rock63]

Of course there have been warming (and cooling) trends in the past. These have produced huge swings in climate. There is no debate about this.

The only thing that is important now is that there is a warming trend and it's caused by greenhouse gases. The debate is over among reputable climate scientists. I stress reputable. Yes, there are those who try to debunk it--just like the tobacco industry produced "scientists" who claimed smoking was not harmful.

Warming or cooling can be scientifically measured.
When you add "AND it's caused by" then you have departed from science and moved into opinion, conjecture, or loony land.

Try these links please.
http://www.petitionproject.org/index.html
http://icecap.us/

 

[Phil Deese]

vinvanb........................................... ...............

67% want to drill................that's all I care about!! Maybe you and Al Gore need to start a traveling team on the environment and let the rest of us save the countries economy before it's too late. If you do like caribou start raising them in your back yard and let the rest of us do what's right for the majority of Americans!! I'm not going to wait until we're all riding bicycles to what jobs are left!! I have heard both sides of the global warming argument and your side doesn't make much sense to me!! Show me all of the evidence from your side and I can counter it from our side, that still doesn't put gasoline in my tank or the majority of Americans that agree with me. If you think your going to get the majority of the people on this forum to accept your argument your wasting your time. We're tired of paying the "Pelosi Premium" for these 2 years of "Do Nothing" democrats.
DRILL HERE, DRILL NOW!! before it's too late!!
All of the arguments you make aren't really accepted by most logical thinking people!! MOVE ON!!

 

[chino69]

Cigarette commercials

Yes, I do remember it.

Back then TV was chock full of cigarette commercials. If you wanted to be part of the "in crowd" you just had to smoke. Somehow I was not convinced and never got hooked even though my father was a chain smoker for 50 years! I didn't have to smoke--there was enough second hand smoke in the house for everyone!

I remember my parents sitting in front of the television watching Gunsmoke, Have Gun Will Travel, The Rebel, Wagontrain, and the living room being filled with smoke. Dude, we're showing our age!
Chino69

 

[Paul Fielder]

Man, I hate you....

Sometimes I wonder if the unbiased biologists without a dog in the fight are related to the unbiased Global Warming folks who want $45 trillion to solve global warming.

It's June and we're still wearing jackets here in Idaho. Some guests this morning from San Francisco were asking to borrow something heavier.


.

Share some it stingy!! Just kidding of couse but we're melting.

It's 103 right now almost 3:30 and I have an all starr gameat 5:15!!

sigh.....it's only gonna get hotter too.


Global warming is a bunch of jibber-jabber......haven't been keeping track long enough to know for certain. It's all speculation.

pf

 

[Mr. D]

Phil,

You are not discussing the issue again. Just taking shots at everything you don't like.

Although there are many that don't believe Global Warming exists, there are many brilliant scientist that do. If those scientists are wrong and we try to reduce Carbon Emissions we will wind up with cleaner energy even if Global Warming is a myth. On the other had if we ignore the issue as a myth we maybe heading for disaster if it turns out to be true.

 

[Rock63]

Although there are many that don't believe Global Warming exists

This is accurate but incomplete.

More accurate would be: There are many who do not believe that Man is the direct cause of global warming.

here are many brilliant scientist that do.

Brilliant? What scientist lacks that quality? You are mincing words without meaning in favor of one side.

More accurate would be: Scientists are found on both sides of this debate.

If those scientists are wrong and we try to reduce Carbon Emissions we will wind up with cleaner energy even if Global Warming is a myth.

If you want to work towards cleaner energy, then please do so. Do not wrap the discussion in the debateable condition of global warming.

Cleaner energy at what cost? Is it worth spending 25% of US gross domestic product on this pursuit? What level of inflation would be acceptable if you were able to get cleaner energy? What level of unemployment?

The air quality samples being pulled from California National Parks are finding pollution of the type not generated in California. This is because much of the California air quality problem is being provided by our good friends in China where the air is brown all day.

So take all the us cars off the road, and the brown air still comes here from China. How will your murcury filled CFL solve this problem and save the planet from destruction in your lifetime?

On the other had if we ignore the issue as a myth we maybe heading for disaster if it turns out to be true.

Disaster? What disaster? When will it happen? Most of the air and water pollution that is taking place on the globe today is in China, India, and Africa. Go find out where the battery raw materials for your Prius are being mined and you will find pollution that is beyond belief.

Yes, the Prius is responsible for massive levels of devistation, yet somehow it is a "Green" "Environmentally Sensitive" vehicle......

 

[Phil Deese]

Mr "D"

There are also many BRILLIANT scientist that feel it's not true!! The majority says drill.....so what are waiting for.....or who is preventing us from drilling??
Could it be a group of people with "D" by their names?? You be the judge!!

I think at this point most Americans could care less about global warming....if they did the ones that approve of drilling wouldn't be in the majority!!

Drill Here, Drill Now!!

ROCK63......looks like you figured it out!! "D" sounds like Oberman on MSNBC!!

 

[Rock63]

I believe that this planet has seen wide swings in surface temperature over the ages.

I believe that those historic swings are part of a cycle.

I believe that our miniscule historical perspective has allowed us to decide that the temperature of a certain era is the "ideal" or "normal" temperature, when in fact that era was simply a passing thru point between extremes.

Where I live there is a cave that yielded a significant collection of fossils.
Cave Bear (from heavy forest)
Sloth (from rain forest)
Mammoth (from ice age)
Camel (from arid times)

This cave is formed in a mountain of limestone (which forms as a sea floor deposit) containing fossil fish and invertibrates. The invertibrates are those normally found in a shallow warm water ocean.

I have also personally dug up petrified dawn redwood in Nevada, from when that region was on the oceans edge.

So I live:
1. Next to a volcanoe (spewing sulpher and carbon dioxide)
2. where it was desert
3. where it was forest
4. where it was glacier covered
5. where it was an ocean
6. where it is now over 500 feet above sea level

Now I ask, which of those conditions/tempertures is the "right one" that should be sought after and preserved at all costs?

Additionally I would ask; what makes anyone think that man is so significant that he has the capability to change the world?

Don't forget that the largest quantity greenhouse gas in our aptmosphere is none other than water vapor!

In short, if you want to stop the warming, you need to stop exhaling all that co2 and water vapor. The greenies themselves can solve their perceived problem by removing themselves from the equation.