P
PPP MMM
Guest
Thanks Lynn
It looks very impessive. How the bullets hold up passing through 36"?
Shoot well
Peter
It looks very impessive. How the bullets hold up passing through 36"?
Shoot well
Peter
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I tried to stay out of this too, but since it is still up here I felt a need to reply.
First, 4mesh, who the hell is Herman? I searched back through the posts and couldn't find a Herman
fleetus
You say if you are a hunter your interested in becoming a woodsman.
I have no interest in becoming a woodsman. Being from Nebraska I had to look it up (1. Also, woodman. a person accustomed to life in the woods and skilled in the arts of the woods, as hunting or trapping.
2. a lumberman.)
What the hell good would that do me on the prairie? Granted in my younger years I did do some trapping, but I don't get the connection between cutting wood and trapping coyotes but then again your the expert.
For you guys against long range hunting I thought I would try to help you out so I was going to post a link to buyaclue.com but unfortunately the registrar has elected to not provide any information or even set up a website so unfortunately your out of luck.
I would like to know who decides at what point it isn't unethical. Is it 100 yards 300 yards 301 yards 400 yards. Who is the self proclaimed person who gets to decide.
By the way the deer I shot this year was at around 420 yards (I forget exactly but I do recall that I estimated it at 390 and that was a little short, I later ranged it from the deer back to the point I shot from and 420 is what sticks in my mind) off hand, he dropped immediatly. Was that unethical? I had 100% confidence in my shot or I wouldn't have taken it.
Guys that shoot game at 1000yds use a rest and rear bag or a bipod and rear bag and practice, practice, practice so that when the time comes they will know where the shot will land or they don't take the shot, as Lynn has said.
It however takes no skill to sit in a tree stand on a deer trail and wait for the deer to come along so you can ambush it at 20 yards with your trusty 30-30, unless your totally incompetent.
James
First, 4mesh, who the hell is Herman? I searched back through the posts and couldn't find a Herman
fleetus
You say if you are a hunter your interested in becoming a woodsman.
I have no interest in becoming a woodsman. Being from Nebraska I had to look it up (1. Also, woodman. a person accustomed to life in the woods and skilled in the arts of the woods, as hunting or trapping.
2. a lumberman.)
What the hell good would that do me on the prairie? Granted in my younger years I did do some trapping, but I don't get the connection between cutting wood and trapping coyotes but then again your the expert.
For you guys against long range hunting I thought I would try to help you out so I was going to post a link to buyaclue.com but unfortunately the registrar has elected to not provide any information or even set up a website so unfortunately your out of luck.
I would like to know who decides at what point it isn't unethical. Is it 100 yards 300 yards 301 yards 400 yards. Who is the self proclaimed person who gets to decide.
By the way the deer I shot this year was at around 420 yards (I forget exactly but I do recall that I estimated it at 390 and that was a little short, I later ranged it from the deer back to the point I shot from and 420 is what sticks in my mind) off hand, he dropped immediatly. Was that unethical? I had 100% confidence in my shot or I wouldn't have taken it.
Guys that shoot game at 1000yds use a rest and rear bag or a bipod and rear bag and practice, practice, practice so that when the time comes they will know where the shot will land or they don't take the shot, as Lynn has said.
It however takes no skill to sit in a tree stand on a deer trail and wait for the deer to come along so you can ambush it at 20 yards with your trusty 30-30, unless your totally incompetent.
James
Chisolm
James you hit the nail on the head.Back in the old days you ran around with a knife in your teeth and chased the deer until it ran out of energy.
In more modern times you used a string and a stick to hit him with a crooked arrow and a piece of stone on the end of it.After he was hit you tracked him for 12 hours.
After the rifle hit the market you shot up to 75 yards then took the bullet out of the deer and re-melted it and made another in the dirt.
With the more modern centerfires the range got increased so the average weekend warrior didn't have to walk too far and wouldn't work up a sweat.
With the latest in technology today what has happened is many of the 150-225 yard shooters never progressed and still have the ways of OLD in there minds.They don't hunt and can hardly walk but still remember back to there trusty 25-35 or 30-30 days when a long shot was 200 yards.As time progresses we see a definite trend forward that is faught by the old timers tooth and nail.It is a natural occurance.
Lynn
James you hit the nail on the head.Back in the old days you ran around with a knife in your teeth and chased the deer until it ran out of energy.
In more modern times you used a string and a stick to hit him with a crooked arrow and a piece of stone on the end of it.After he was hit you tracked him for 12 hours.
After the rifle hit the market you shot up to 75 yards then took the bullet out of the deer and re-melted it and made another in the dirt.
With the more modern centerfires the range got increased so the average weekend warrior didn't have to walk too far and wouldn't work up a sweat.
With the latest in technology today what has happened is many of the 150-225 yard shooters never progressed and still have the ways of OLD in there minds.They don't hunt and can hardly walk but still remember back to there trusty 25-35 or 30-30 days when a long shot was 200 yards.As time progresses we see a definite trend forward that is faught by the old timers tooth and nail.It is a natural occurance.
Lynn
4
4Mesh
Guest
Lynn,
I'm not quite certain of the meaning there and that question could be taken two different ways that I see at a distance... I'll assume it's my first impression.
"Earth Shattering". I take that to mean, vast, exhaustive, compelling... Well, I've learned more variations of spelling and grammar than any mortal should be exposed to. Given the practice I get here, I bet I could speedread novels that had no capitalization, no punctuation, and no structure. I've learned that the education system in the United States has failed miserably.
I don't actually try to learn anything on forums. I enjoy discussion and I pass time with the board when I'm forced to be in front of a pc. Most times, it's relaxing. I spend an inordinate amount of time in front of computers and much of it is during work where I have many small periods of time where I just pace like a caged tiger. That's one of the pitfalls of automation being an obscession. Now I just stand around waiting to leave.
There's plenty to learn but I don't believe anything can be "learned" here. All you can do is be guided in the right direction and go test and find your own conclusion. Fact is if you do just do something because someone else told you to, you've done yourself a dis-service in this game. Most every time they're wrong. Even if they're right for their own situation, they're probably wrong for yours.
I've learned that there's folk here who think I'm opinionated... from time to time. I don't understand that...
I have not learned how to make this browser stay logged in. I've manually edited cookies and still can't make it work. I log in for every post two times. I have learned how to do that faster too!
Most of all, I have learned that things which sound really cool but which have absolutely no basis in fact whatsoever, are far more widely accepted than irrefuteable facts which are simple and uninteresting.
Holy cow, while that post was answering a question, was it ever off topic... Ah, that's ok. This topic isn't supposed to be here anyhow...
I'm not quite certain of the meaning there and that question could be taken two different ways that I see at a distance... I'll assume it's my first impression.
"Earth Shattering". I take that to mean, vast, exhaustive, compelling... Well, I've learned more variations of spelling and grammar than any mortal should be exposed to. Given the practice I get here, I bet I could speedread novels that had no capitalization, no punctuation, and no structure. I've learned that the education system in the United States has failed miserably.
I don't actually try to learn anything on forums. I enjoy discussion and I pass time with the board when I'm forced to be in front of a pc. Most times, it's relaxing. I spend an inordinate amount of time in front of computers and much of it is during work where I have many small periods of time where I just pace like a caged tiger. That's one of the pitfalls of automation being an obscession. Now I just stand around waiting to leave.
There's plenty to learn but I don't believe anything can be "learned" here. All you can do is be guided in the right direction and go test and find your own conclusion. Fact is if you do just do something because someone else told you to, you've done yourself a dis-service in this game. Most every time they're wrong. Even if they're right for their own situation, they're probably wrong for yours.
I've learned that there's folk here who think I'm opinionated... from time to time. I don't understand that...
I have not learned how to make this browser stay logged in. I've manually edited cookies and still can't make it work. I log in for every post two times. I have learned how to do that faster too!
Most of all, I have learned that things which sound really cool but which have absolutely no basis in fact whatsoever, are far more widely accepted than irrefuteable facts which are simple and uninteresting.
Holy cow, while that post was answering a question, was it ever off topic... Ah, that's ok. This topic isn't supposed to be here anyhow...
4Mesh
Phil you answered the question as intended and in good fashion.
I know some very good shooters who won't post here due to a former poster thinking he was annointed grammar police chief.I don't let anything grammatical bother myself.I am looking to take a small piece of learning out of a post if possible and help if I am able.
I am aware this is a accuracy board but surely we can take a minute or two out of our busy schedules to answer a question on 1000 yard hunting.It rarely comes up.
I feel for your computor problem as I type with an IR keyboard across the room.If something gets in front of the keyboard it drops letters.If the battery gets weak it drops the letter "H".
I'm going unting just doesn't sound right.
Lyn
Phil you answered the question as intended and in good fashion.
I know some very good shooters who won't post here due to a former poster thinking he was annointed grammar police chief.I don't let anything grammatical bother myself.I am looking to take a small piece of learning out of a post if possible and help if I am able.
I am aware this is a accuracy board but surely we can take a minute or two out of our busy schedules to answer a question on 1000 yard hunting.It rarely comes up.
I feel for your computor problem as I type with an IR keyboard across the room.If something gets in front of the keyboard it drops letters.If the battery gets weak it drops the letter "H".
I'm going unting just doesn't sound right.
Lyn
Since this thread has relegated to anything but he original question.
Lynn
Will you be coming to Byers to any matches besides the Nationals?
I am sure I will make the first one, March 30th I think (my first 1000yd match) but beyond that I am not sure. I am almost certain I will not make the Nationals since that will be right in the middle of Fall harvest and wheat planting.
The reason I ask is you are in the group of people who post on BR central that I would like to meat.
James
Lynn
Will you be coming to Byers to any matches besides the Nationals?
I am sure I will make the first one, March 30th I think (my first 1000yd match) but beyond that I am not sure. I am almost certain I will not make the Nationals since that will be right in the middle of Fall harvest and wheat planting.
The reason I ask is you are in the group of people who post on BR central that I would like to meat.
James
4
4Mesh
Guest
I tried to stay out of this too, but since it is still up here I felt a need to reply.
First, 4mesh, who the hell is Herman? I searched back through the posts and couldn't find a Herman
Chisolm, Post 60, BountyHunter
Chisolm
I will only be going to Byers for the nationals if all works out well at the 600 yard nationals here in april.I am changing offices again on tuesday the 5th of february as my position has me jumping all over the place.We have been playing with the Calfee type heavy tuners and hopefully we have a decent handle on how these things work.
I just got my heavygun back from Jim Borden today and I want to shoot it real soon.The weather has been giving us some trouble lately out here in sunny california.
Herman as 4Mesh pointed out is none other than The BountyHunter.He shoots IBS and does very well.
Lynn
I will only be going to Byers for the nationals if all works out well at the 600 yard nationals here in april.I am changing offices again on tuesday the 5th of february as my position has me jumping all over the place.We have been playing with the Calfee type heavy tuners and hopefully we have a decent handle on how these things work.
I just got my heavygun back from Jim Borden today and I want to shoot it real soon.The weather has been giving us some trouble lately out here in sunny california.
Herman as 4Mesh pointed out is none other than The BountyHunter.He shoots IBS and does very well.
Lynn
T
TheConstitution
Guest
Not Sportsmen at all? Hmm.. I've got deer within 500 yards of my Lazy-Boy on any given day. I'm good enough to put a bullet in them from there too! I don't even need a 36" barrel and mechanical rest. Think of all the time and money I could save. I wouldn't have to get up at O'dark:30, shower with scent free soap, put on Camo, spray scent eliminator on my clothes and boots, trudge through woods full of them dang crunchy leaves, and
actually spend a day in the deers' home trying to play hide and seek! All I really need to do to be a TRUE SPORTSMAN is to put the TV remote down for 5 seconds, lean out the window from my Lazy-Boy and squeeze off a shot at that trophy buck. Now I can brag about the size of that 10 point rack to my buddies because I am a great HUNTER and TRUE SPORTSMAN! I sure showed my huntin prowess with that rifle shot!Now previously, Chisolm asked where do you draw the line, 200, 300, 400 yards? Well, that's a dang good question! Only each one of us can answer that individually from one moment to the next. I can make a 500 yard shot comfortably with a 7 pound hunting rifle if I have a solid rest, low wind, animal is not moving at all and I'm not shivering my cajones off. But take away any of those comforts and my range decreases greatly. So can you average pie plate groups at 1000 yards and do it for accuracy to a bullseye every day? How do you know the animal won't take a step as you pull the trigger? When shooting 1000 yard deer, do you have all the comforts afforded the firing line where you get those pie plate groups? I don't think you could call it 1000 yard hunting. Deer target shooting maybe? Can't you just draw a deer outline on paper? Does your "hunting" bullet even perform as it should at its 1000 yard velocity? Do you need to bet against wounding the deer for some reason? Is that an easy bet for you to wager?
I've read plenty of other posts where the members of this forum wax poetic about the great difficulty in shooting at 1000 yards. (reading wind, vertical stringing, cold barrel, ambient temperature, elevation etc) So which is it? An extremely difficult proposition where small changes can greatly affect your accuracy? or an easily controllable situation where the differences between a good shot and bad shot are easily within say, the "kill zone" at any given time?
The way I was taught, hunting is a PRIVILEDGE not a right. That priviledge is afforded us mostly by non-hunters who any year now could vote to REMOVE that priviledge from our comfortable lives. I for one am in an every day battle with liberals that I know and am forced to deal with, who do not really understand hunting. Many of them do not understand why I feel the need to hunt. I try to explain to them that my hunting party stresses ethics. I try to explain that it really isn't like you see on TV where there seems to be a trophy animal standing broadside over every ridgeline. On TV where they seem to just take an easy rifle shot and then commence to celebrating their victory. I try to explain that we NEVER fire on an animal unless we are sure its a one shot kill. That we pass up seemingly easy shots because there was some doubt. I explain that it is not about the "kill", it is really about the many many hours spent learning about our environment on a level that the average hiker never sees.
So next time you decide to speak to people in public about hunting, remember the people listening to the conversation may be the votes that decide whether you are ALLOWED to continue to do it. If your method of hunting doesn't sound good amongst your gun shooting peers, how's it going to sound to some neutral person who may be "on the fence" about shooting sports and hunting? Hopefully this concern is as important to you as it is to me. God Bless.
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TheConstitution
Constitution the way we try and do it around this forum is to read all of the previous posts and add something to the conversation if possible and usually first hand knowledge is best.
As this is your FIRST POST well atleast under this name and I hope I'm not sounding skeptical about who you really are.It is best to read how something is done before you speak of it.
Obviously from your posting you have never shot longrange at all but thats not a bad thing as atleast you found the right forum.You also don't understand how to properly hunt at longrange so please visit the website www.longrangehunting.com and find out how to sucessfully do it.
The internet also has many chat rooms available to non-hunters and anti-gun folks like yourself.You can go there and visit the Sarah Brady Foundation or the Violence Policy Center were like minded people abound.
If you decide there is truly a wealth of good information over here and decide to stay that is just wonderful.Please remember however that we use guns,bullets,primers and gun powder in most of our conversations.If this offends you it is best to stay on one of the quilting websites were needles are the most offensive weapons used.
Lynn
Constitution the way we try and do it around this forum is to read all of the previous posts and add something to the conversation if possible and usually first hand knowledge is best.
As this is your FIRST POST well atleast under this name and I hope I'm not sounding skeptical about who you really are.It is best to read how something is done before you speak of it.
Obviously from your posting you have never shot longrange at all but thats not a bad thing as atleast you found the right forum.You also don't understand how to properly hunt at longrange so please visit the website www.longrangehunting.com and find out how to sucessfully do it.
The internet also has many chat rooms available to non-hunters and anti-gun folks like yourself.You can go there and visit the Sarah Brady Foundation or the Violence Policy Center were like minded people abound.
If you decide there is truly a wealth of good information over here and decide to stay that is just wonderful.Please remember however that we use guns,bullets,primers and gun powder in most of our conversations.If this offends you it is best to stay on one of the quilting websites were needles are the most offensive weapons used.
Lynn
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4mesh,
Since YOU brought it up, what exactly is an "obscession"........is this some form of brain rot? (I woulda' NEVER but you used the concept of as a plank in your post, paragraph 2)
TheConstitution,
While you may be content to lay low and try to HIDE from that time when we'll go quietly into the night............your apologetic attitude, your insistence that we exist only at the behest of the "real power" (liberals? Anti's?) simply disgusts me. I am An AMERICAN!!! What YOU actually are, or what you stand for I don't rightly know but to come on here using the handle "The Constitution" and snivel feebly about how we're "only here by the Grace of The Liberal Establishment" is more than I can stomach.
THESE quotes are yours.......
---"The way I was taught, hunting is a PRIVILEDGE not a right. That priviledge is afforded us mostly by non-hunters who any year now could vote to REMOVE that priviledge from our comfortable lives."
---"the people listening to the conversation may be the votes that decide whether you are ALLOWED to continue to do it. "
SAD!
On the surface your wimpy approach seems tenable............it's the EXACT same line that the liberal groups believe/sell........."let's just all get together and talk it out. I'm sure that if we all can sit down and share views then war will just go away"........ I wasted 15yrs of my life debating with liberals, giving them "credence". Read the new Clarence Thomas book "My Grandfathers Son" to see what we're REALLY up against.
What THIS Nation needs is a few more Nugents who'll STAND UP on their hindfeet and ROAR!!! That we are PREDATORS! We eat MEAT! We have forward facing eyes and over developed canines for a PURPOSE! And WE make the policies because WE are the ones getting it done!
It really IS about Power Tools, Grunting and Using Enough Gun! Alla' that stuff we've been being slowly weaned off of is REAL! And BTW, this whole "99.9% sure of a kill" thing is total CRAP! YES we try hard, but it's absolutely NOT a crime if we lose the occasional animal! WE HUNTERS and Sportsman buy and own each and every animal in the woods! If it wasn't for WE HUNTERS the ecosystem would be ruined. And the LAST thing we need is to have another gov't agency trying to control the animal population through some PC means like spending billions redistributing the over-abundance of game using heli-freaking-copters! Or feeding the little lady deers birth-control pills........
Welcome to the board TheConstitution May you do our Founding Fathers proud here!
If you're ever in SW Washington (state), roll down your car window and lissen for the sweet sound of chainsaws, hear the rolling echo's of Big Bore Thunder tolling from the peaks and KNOW that now you're in America! I think I'll go down to my range and shoot some dynamite targets with my boys, because I CAN!!! And because slapping a pound of HE with a high velocity bullet and counting the echo's is FUN! Ain't nuttin quite so cool as off-handing a 100yd target the size of a baby-food jar and feeling the blast-wave tugging ay your pant legs when you connect...........HIDE???? Cower in fear while I wait for the whiners to vote my rights away???? I don't THINK SO!!! Deep inside every whining pit-smelling liberal male is a MAN trying to get out! I've PROVEN it.......I bring folks out all the time.
We have to learn that we've got nothing to apologize for.
al
Since YOU brought it up,
what exactly is an "obscession"........is this some form of brain rot? (I woulda' NEVER but you used the concept of as a plank in your post, paragraph 2) TheConstitution,
While you may be content to lay low and try to HIDE from that time when we'll go quietly into the night............your apologetic attitude, your insistence that we exist only at the behest of the "real power" (liberals? Anti's?) simply disgusts me. I am An AMERICAN!!! What YOU actually are, or what you stand for I don't rightly know but to come on here using the handle "The Constitution" and snivel feebly about how we're "only here by the Grace of The Liberal Establishment" is more than I can stomach.
THESE quotes are yours.......
---"The way I was taught, hunting is a PRIVILEDGE not a right. That priviledge is afforded us mostly by non-hunters who any year now could vote to REMOVE that priviledge from our comfortable lives."
---"the people listening to the conversation may be the votes that decide whether you are ALLOWED to continue to do it. "
SAD!
On the surface your wimpy approach seems tenable............it's the EXACT same line that the liberal groups believe/sell........."let's just all get together and talk it out. I'm sure that if we all can sit down and share views then war will just go away"........ I wasted 15yrs of my life debating with liberals, giving them "credence". Read the new Clarence Thomas book "My Grandfathers Son" to see what we're REALLY up against.
What THIS Nation needs is a few more Nugents who'll STAND UP on their hindfeet and ROAR!!! That we are PREDATORS! We eat MEAT! We have forward facing eyes and over developed canines for a PURPOSE! And WE make the policies because WE are the ones getting it done!
It really IS about Power Tools, Grunting and Using Enough Gun! Alla' that stuff we've been being slowly weaned off of is REAL! And BTW, this whole "99.9% sure of a kill" thing is total CRAP! YES we try hard, but it's absolutely NOT a crime if we lose the occasional animal! WE HUNTERS and Sportsman buy and own each and every animal in the woods! If it wasn't for WE HUNTERS the ecosystem would be ruined. And the LAST thing we need is to have another gov't agency trying to control the animal population through some PC means like spending billions redistributing the over-abundance of game using heli-freaking-copters! Or feeding the little lady deers birth-control pills........
Welcome to the board TheConstitution
May you do our Founding Fathers proud here!If you're ever in SW Washington (state), roll down your car window and lissen for the sweet sound of chainsaws, hear the rolling echo's of Big Bore Thunder tolling from the peaks and KNOW that now you're in America! I think I'll go down to my range and shoot some dynamite targets with my boys, because I CAN!!! And because slapping a pound of HE with a high velocity bullet and counting the echo's is FUN! Ain't nuttin quite so cool as off-handing a 100yd target the size of a baby-food jar and feeling the blast-wave tugging ay your pant legs when you connect...........HIDE???? Cower in fear while I wait for the whiners to vote my rights away???? I don't THINK SO!!! Deep inside every whining pit-smelling liberal male is a MAN trying to get out! I've PROVEN it.......I bring folks out all the time.
We have to learn that we've got nothing to apologize for.
al
P
PPP MMM
Guest
Lynn and other long range buddies
Thanks to you, I've learned something here what I didn't know. I didn't know that one actually can shoot around a deer to sight his/hers rifle in, but according to Lynn, Joe Salt and the Long/range/hunting website that's apparently how it's done. So with the extra information I'm not going to dispute it.
Even if the deer I"ve ever known is the deer that it'll be spooked by the slightest anusual noise, such as crack of broken stick under a foot, cycling bolt at 60-100metres distance. Grazing herd has one or more spotters and they listen, watch and sniff, while the rest of the herd is grazing.
As Lynn said, there is a progress in the hardware technology, bullets etc. If one can sight/zero in at 1K the way as described, has the skills and the hardware/software that's capable of putting not just one, but 10 shots into 5-6" circle at 1K it makes me seriously to rethink my opinion about long range hunting.
Will I do it? NO. I don't load for 0.1-0.2" accuracy, I don't have the equipment nor the skills to read the wind.
With having all the facts I know about long range hunting now on the table, I've to be fair and say: With the right skills, equipment, and attitude 1K hunting is not too much different to my 250metres max. hunting. With any type of hunting there is always a percentage element of risk.
Group 5-6" counts for the same if it's shot at 20metres or 1000metres.
We are all here to learn something and I did just that.
Shoot well
Peter
Thanks to you, I've learned something here what I didn't know. I didn't know that one actually can shoot around a deer to sight his/hers rifle in, but according to Lynn, Joe Salt and the Long/range/hunting website that's apparently how it's done. So with the extra information I'm not going to dispute it.
Even if the deer I"ve ever known is the deer that it'll be spooked by the slightest anusual noise, such as crack of broken stick under a foot, cycling bolt at 60-100metres distance. Grazing herd has one or more spotters and they listen, watch and sniff, while the rest of the herd is grazing.
As Lynn said, there is a progress in the hardware technology, bullets etc. If one can sight/zero in at 1K the way as described, has the skills and the hardware/software that's capable of putting not just one, but 10 shots into 5-6" circle at 1K it makes me seriously to rethink my opinion about long range hunting.
Will I do it? NO. I don't load for 0.1-0.2" accuracy, I don't have the equipment nor the skills to read the wind.
With having all the facts I know about long range hunting now on the table, I've to be fair and say: With the right skills, equipment, and attitude 1K hunting is not too much different to my 250metres max. hunting. With any type of hunting there is always a percentage element of risk.
Group 5-6" counts for the same if it's shot at 20metres or 1000metres.
We are all here to learn something and I did just that.
Shoot well
Peter
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Not Sportsmen at all? Hmm.. I've got deer within 500 yards of my Lazy-Boy on any given day. I'm good enough to put a bullet in them from there too! I don't even need a 36" barrel and mechanical rest. Think of all the time and money I could save. I wouldn't have to get up at O'dark:30, shower with scent free soap, put on Camo, spray scent eliminator on my clothes and boots, trudge through woods full of them dang crunchy leaves, and
Now previously, Chisolm asked where do you draw the line, 200, 300, 400 yards? Well, that's a dang good question! Only each one of us can answer that individually from one moment to the next. I can make a 500 yard shot comfortably with a 7 pound hunting rifle if I have a solid rest, low wind, animal is not moving at all and I'm not shivering my cajones off. But take away any of those comforts and my range decreases greatly. So can you average pie plate groups at 1000 yards and do it for accuracy to a bullseye every day? How do you know the animal won't take a step as you pull the trigger? When shooting 1000 yard deer, do you have all the comforts afforded the firing line where you get those pie plate groups? I don't think you could call it 1000 yard hunting. Deer target shooting maybe? Can't you just draw a deer outline on paper? Does your "hunting" bullet even perform as it should at its 1000 yard velocity? Do you need to bet against wounding the deer for some reason? Is that an easy bet for you to wager?
I've read plenty of other posts where the members of this forum wax poetic about the great difficulty in shooting at 1000 yards. (reading wind, vertical stringing, cold barrel, ambient temperature, elevation etc) So which is it? An extremely difficult proposition where small changes can greatly affect your accuracy? or an easily controllable situation where the differences between a good shot and bad shot are easily within say, the "kill zone" at any given time?
The way I was taught, hunting is a PRIVILEDGE not a right. That priviledge is afforded us mostly by non-hunters who any year now could vote to REMOVE that priviledge from our comfortable lives. I for one am in an every day battle with liberals that I know and am forced to deal with, who do not really understand hunting. Many of them do not understand why I feel the need to hunt. I try to explain to them that my hunting party stresses ethics. I try to explain that it really isn't like you see on TV where there seems to be a trophy animal standing broadside over every ridgeline. On TV where they seem to just take an easy rifle shot and then commence to celebrating their victory. I try to explain that we NEVER fire on an animal unless we are sure its a one shot kill. That we pass up seemingly easy shots because there was some doubt. I explain that it is not about the "kill", it is really about the many many hours spent learning about our environment on a level that the average hiker never sees.
So next time you decide to speak to people in public about hunting, remember the people listening to the conversation may be the votes that decide whether you are ALLOWED to continue to do it. If your method of hunting doesn't sound good amongst your gun shooting peers, how's it going to sound to some neutral person who may be "on the fence" about shooting sports and hunting? Hopefully this concern is as important to you as it is to me. God Bless.
First off, my spelling and grammar is far from perfect, but I am easy to understand. I do not agree with some views posted here, most of which being yours at the top of the list. I feel hunting is not a priviledge, but a right, and that right has been afforded to us by anyone but the anti-hunters, you are very WRONG with that statement in my opinion. What have you done to promote hunting? what do you do now? Who do you contribute to? Do you support hunting? How many people are neutral on this topic in your opinion? I would guess it would be very few. Al in his post is 100% spot on in my opinion. Thanks Al for putting some very good words on paper! I have another question for constitution- Why not sign your name to what you type here? Ron Tilley
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4Mesh
Guest
4mesh,
Since YOU brought it up,
al
Well Al, that is when you are investing so much of your attention in somehting, you forget how to spell! LMAO, good pick! Had I gone back to proofread better, I'd probably have edited that but hey, life goes on and now, it's a great konvrsaashion peese! Whoops.
Just be glad you don't have to type a question here for all the ones you find, or you'd NEVER have time to shoot!
A
AlanF
Guest
Speak for yourself Alinwha - you're suggesting we should act more according to primal instincts and less from conscience - pretty selfish don't you think? If we all thought that way, the world would be a very primitive and uncivilised place.
Alan
4
4Mesh
Guest
Peter,
As you guessed earlier though, the deer do not stay there EVERY time. Sometimes they do run off when they hear the snap. When that happens, it's just that deers lucky day! He's smarter so he lives! Keep in mind, at long distance, the sound of the bullet is not very loud and is a very short snap. It's not a kaboom and an echo like you hear at the gun. They don't mind the gun sound from longer distances either. The sound the deer hears is not as loud as a 22 rimfire and sounds very similar. The gun sound is barely heard at all. When in the pits pulling targets in a match at 1000 yards, you hear the bullet plainly, but you almost never hear the gun. On videotape you seem to notice it more than when you are standing there. Also, when in the pits pulling targets, the bullet is only 1 meter from your head so it can't get much louder than that. That same sound from even 30 meters is quite a lot less noise.
Alan, you have to get to know Al for a while and you'll see he's really quite a good egg. Al's a lot like me in some ways, too fast to say what he's thinking! For that reason I like him, but others may not. Welcome to the internet. After a while, you'll see that you really do like Al's opinions, even if thought you disagreed. Truth is we could use a few more Al's.
PPP MMM and Alan
Peter we hunt mostly blacktailed deer were I live and you have described there behavour very well.At 600 yards a 6mm bullet at 3000 fps over the top of them won't generaly spook them.A 30 caliber hit below or very close on either side will definitely spook them.At 1000 yards a 30 calber hit needs to be left or right 20 yards to avoid spooking them during the rut.If they are on a doe nothing bothers them but if you spook the doe they are gone as well.If the doe walks downhill 25 yards and through a small slot the buck will do exactly the same thing even if the terrain is perfectly clear and they can visually see each other the whole time.
That is a major advantage when you sight in on your buck.If you put 2 or 3 shots into a slot and the doe walks through it the buck will surely follow and your all set.
If the buck is walking you can use a fawn call to stop him in his tracks.That little bit of info takes the average hunter years to figure out and it has just been handed to you.99% of the serious longrange hunters start out just like you and progress into it.It is done in baby steps not leaps and bounds.
Alan
Tell us what happened in Australia after your guns got taken away with regards to knives,swords and crime?
In your world everything was roses correct?
Nobody acted uncivilised correct?
Nobody reverted back to the ways of our ancestors correct? If you refuse to answer what happened I will post a link.
Lynn
Peter we hunt mostly blacktailed deer were I live and you have described there behavour very well.At 600 yards a 6mm bullet at 3000 fps over the top of them won't generaly spook them.A 30 caliber hit below or very close on either side will definitely spook them.At 1000 yards a 30 calber hit needs to be left or right 20 yards to avoid spooking them during the rut.If they are on a doe nothing bothers them but if you spook the doe they are gone as well.If the doe walks downhill 25 yards and through a small slot the buck will do exactly the same thing even if the terrain is perfectly clear and they can visually see each other the whole time.
That is a major advantage when you sight in on your buck.If you put 2 or 3 shots into a slot and the doe walks through it the buck will surely follow and your all set.
If the buck is walking you can use a fawn call to stop him in his tracks.That little bit of info takes the average hunter years to figure out and it has just been handed to you.99% of the serious longrange hunters start out just like you and progress into it.It is done in baby steps not leaps and bounds.
Alan
Tell us what happened in Australia after your guns got taken away with regards to knives,swords and crime?
In your world everything was roses correct?
Nobody acted uncivilised correct?
Nobody reverted back to the ways of our ancestors correct? If you refuse to answer what happened I will post a link.
Lynn
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PPP MMM
Guest
Shooting for a joy
My 1st rifle I've bought was a Weatherby Mark V .460WM. I shot that rifle for several years everywhere and on everything pulverizing rocks, blowing up water filled cans, hunting/culling pests etc. The load was 500gr. Hornady soft or full jacket round nose at 2680- 2720fps. After about 1000 rounds through it, I've realised that it may not be the best option, so I went on and bought a ZKK .375H&H. From there I've kept going on and went through 41 other rifles. 43 rifles all up ever a period of two decades. One of them was 6mm Rem. the rest was .308W and bigger. I had several .460WMs, .450AI, .458W, .375H7H, 300WMs. I shot them all and I've enjoyed them all. So one can hardly can call me an antigun/antihunting prick.
I'm not going to prevent/stop anyone from whatever they believe in or whatever they like doing or owning. If you like semis, machineguns, pistols, .50BMG bolt or fully automatic and feel that you need to have ten of each them, go and buy them. If it makes you feel happy, so be it.
Some people enjoy a classic music, I enjoy a gun blasts and the smell of burning powder. I don't believe in God, I don't follow any religion or any political party, but if you do, so be it. Enjoy whatever do you believe in and do when you can and what you can see and can do now and don't deppend on to what will happen to you later.
Shoot well
Peter
My 1st rifle I've bought was a Weatherby Mark V .460WM. I shot that rifle for several years everywhere and on everything pulverizing rocks, blowing up water filled cans, hunting/culling pests etc. The load was 500gr. Hornady soft or full jacket round nose at 2680- 2720fps. After about 1000 rounds through it, I've realised that it may not be the best option, so I went on and bought a ZKK .375H&H. From there I've kept going on and went through 41 other rifles. 43 rifles all up ever a period of two decades. One of them was 6mm Rem. the rest was .308W and bigger. I had several .460WMs, .450AI, .458W, .375H7H, 300WMs. I shot them all and I've enjoyed them all. So one can hardly can call me an antigun/antihunting prick.
I'm not going to prevent/stop anyone from whatever they believe in or whatever they like doing or owning. If you like semis, machineguns, pistols, .50BMG bolt or fully automatic and feel that you need to have ten of each them, go and buy them. If it makes you feel happy, so be it.
Some people enjoy a classic music, I enjoy a gun blasts and the smell of burning powder. I don't believe in God, I don't follow any religion or any political party, but if you do, so be it. Enjoy whatever do you believe in and do when you can and what you can see and can do now and don't deppend on to what will happen to you later.
Shoot well
Peter
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PPP MMM
Guest
A knowledge
Is a very valuable commodity, whatever it may be.
Shoot well
Peter
Is a very valuable commodity, whatever it may be.
Shoot well
Peter
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