Action Trueness Test On My Old Remington 721 I Just Bought

G'day

I think this great thread will not be finnished until we have seen load development, and then the photograpgh of you standing beside a huge beast you have just flattened from 450 honest yrds, downhill, with a 20mph crosswind.
Seriously, I have watched this from the beginning, and have enjoyed ever minute.
Shoot it, and enjoy.

Thankyou for your time

harro
 
Jackie,
Nice looking rifle, something to be very proud of for sure. I enjoyed your thread it was a great read.

P.S from the pictures it looks like your machine shop has left you with a life time supply of shooting gongs (LOL)
Wayne.
 
Well, I spent the entire day at Tomball, shooting my '06

I broke it in with 5 rounds, cleaning after each shot, then firing two rounds three times, cleaning after two. The barrel cleaned up real nice.

I set up my 35P Chronograph, and loaded in 4350 untill it hit 2800 with the Hornady 178 grn A-Max. Conditions were pretty bad.

Results were not what I was looking for, 5/8 and 3/4 groups were the norm, I inched the load up, and nothing got better.

I switched to the 4831 Short Cut, and did the same thing, loaded to 2800, and went from there.

After about 30 rounds, it finally dawned on me that I was simply trying to shoot it too hot. I had it stuck in my head that with a 26 3/4 inch barrel, I should be hitting 2850 with a good accuracy node. Not so with this bullet.

I started loading the 4831 down untill it hit about the mid 2700 range, and the accuracy really started to improve. I also started backing the bullets back, untill I was jumping them about .020. That did the trick.

I settled in, and decided to take what ever time was neccessary to shoot three groups and see what it would do.

Even though it got to about 102 degrees temperature today, the Rifle acted very civil, the cases just fall out. I took my time and shot three groups, a .317, a .515, and a .280. The .515 actually had four shots in less than .300, but I lost one straight to the left with the condition.

I am just tickled pink. Regardless of how much effort you put into something such as a Rifle project, if the accuracy expectations are not there, then you feel less than satisfied. But I am very satisfied with this Rifle, shooting 178 grn A-Max's at an average 2780 with a three group agg in the .360 range is the proof that the effort, time, and money was worth it. THis is a pretty good shooting 30-06.

The final load is 59 grns of H-4831 SC, Federal Large Rifle Magnum Primer, .335 neck bushing with the .339 neck, (rounds have .003 overall clearance), 178 grn Hornady A-Max about .020 off touching. Average velocity about 2780 fps.

Next, I will get some of the new Hornady Match bullets in the same weight, some Bergers, and Sierras, and see what happens. But in all honesty, after shooting this thing 50+ times off the Bench today, I am ready to go back to a Benchrest Rifle.........jackie

I will get some pictures of the three groups posted,
 
G'day

Thanks Wilbur.
It's good news that it's back in action.
So has there been any new developments with this project????

Thankyou for your time

harro
 
Harro, my last post, just before the thread was locked ,was the first range outing. We worked both Sat and Sun this past week end, so I was not able to go to the range.

I will Post pictures of the groups.........jackie
 
Guys, I am trying to post pictures of the six groups I shot with my favorite load in the '06, I have put about 110 rounds through this thing in two range sessions, and my shoulder is ready to call the project "complete".

My problem is I can't get my computer to recognize the sim card out of my Wife's camera. As soon as I figure it out, I will post the groups, the load, and a few other items to wrap this project up.

I can say this. This is one fine shooting 30-06.............jackie
 
Thats good news jackie. its always a bonus when a project shoots like you hoped it would. I was just talking with a friend of mine the other night via text message, and the comment came up, that just because you use the finest components and spent 5 grand, and its all nice and new, doesn't mean it will shoot for a hoot. In your case, this doesn't apply and that is fantastic!!
As far as cameras go. I started talking all my pics with my I phone thingie and it is super easy to up load onto the lap top. I just plug it in and it does the rest darn near by itself! Its great. Takes good pics to!! Lee
 
Here are the 5-shot groups.

img0340eo.jpg

By jackiesaki at 2011-07-08

These were shot with 178 grn AMAX's, 59 grns of SC 4831, (weighed), bullet about .020 jump, Fed 215 Large Rifle Magnum Primer, .335 neck bushing with the ,339 neck, (loaded Lapua Brass has .003 clearance),. Average velocity, 2780 fps out of the 27 inch 1-10 twist Krieger. This is what you would call a 100 percent density load.

As a note, I cannot do much better than 5/8 groups with 4350, or the new Honady 168 grn Match Bullets. I can easilly get 2850+ out of the AMAX's with the 27 inch barrel, but groups open up to the 5/8 range as well. Great Hunting Load, though. I just need to work with the load a little more with the 4350, and get some of the new 178 grn Match Bullets.

If you have ever worked up an accuracy load for a Rifle such as this, it gets a little trying. Granted, an '06 is not a RUM, but even weighing at 12 pounds, it hits you hard enough do get your attention after about three groups.

Also, as a Benchrest Shooter, I am used to free recoil shooting where I can watch conditions to the nth degree. I have to hold on to this Rifle, I tried a couple of free recoil shots, and sorry, my 62 year old shoulder will not take that as many times as it takes to find what the Rifle really likes. I think all of my friends watching me shoot this thing all day long might think I am a tad nuts. Gene Bukys said since I seemed to be enjoying this so much, he had a new 338 Magnum that he would be glad to let me 'work with'.

The first group, on the upper left, was actually the last one I shot late Sunday, after everybody but a couple of shooters had left. The conditions died down, I got the POA dead on, and as carefully as I could, laid five rounds down range. I think it is at least 4x's.

Even though there are multitudes of combinations to try, I really can't see anything shooting much better in this particular combination than the 4831 and the 178 GRN AMAX.

I still want to take the three pieces of 1949 vintage Lakewood City Brass that German Salazar sent me, and put this accuracy load in, and shoot a group.

I think I have succeeded in doing what I started out to do, taking a fine old Rem 721 action that was born the same year as me, (1949), and mating it with todays components and my own truing operations, and making a great Rifle, a blend of the old, and the new.

Like I said, a pretty good shooting '06, and a worthy project ..........jackie

dsc00603fn.jpg

By jackiesaki at 2011-06-11
 
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I feel for you on the recoil... many years ago I shot a 10 pound hunter class 308 with 168 grains... it just beat the hell out of you...

Throw away the biggest group and the smallest group and you have an agg of .342"... it doesn't get much better...
 
Dennis, I did not know the '06 was such a popular round, I have a ton of e-mails wanting to know how I am making this thing shoot like this.

I know that everybody is ate up on 4064-4350 burn rate powders for the '06, but I have always found 4831 to be just right for it, especially with a longer tube. The charge looks just like a 133 load in a 6PPC.........jackie
 
Jackie, I've followed your thread with interest, but not closely. I do not remember whether or not you've worked any with primers. As someone who works up accuracy loads with larger chamberings for 1,000 yard competition, I've found testing with primers for individual barrels an accuracy factor (Sorry German, my results don't completely agree with yours).

For reference, here is one experience with a smaller .300 magnum wildcat, very similar to the old .308 Norma but without the belt. Case capacity is 88 grains water, smaller than a .300 Win Mag. IIRC, the .30-06 is right at 70 grains water.

I've had four barrels with two different rifles using this chambering. With two of those barrels, and any of the Reloader series powders, magnum primers improved accuracy. But with the two other barrels, magnum primers hurt accuracy. Further, with one of them (only checked one), switching from Rel-22 to N-560 -- another double-base powder -- also meant going from 215s to 210s for best accuracy.

Using H-4831-SC, my HG preferred regular 210s. With the same barrel, with either Reloader 22 or -25, 215s shot better. Go figure.

BTW, I'm not talking .050 here. Significantly bigger.

So primer selection is now on my "don't assume, have to check" list for each barrel and powder.

Now if this is a hunting rifle where you're working up a load to use when it's below freezing, probably stay with the magnum primer. But if your shoulder has left and you have some 210s to hand, it might be worth your while to give them a try. May have to adjust the charge a bit.

* * *

Last Friday, I went to the range to work up a load for a .338 on the 404 Jeffry case. 300-grain bullet, with a charge of 90-grains of Reloader 25. Two things: Most important is that rifle/barrel/powder preferred 210s. Not important but fun is that even with a 17-pound rifle, muzzle brake, and shotgun-style recoil pad, testing -- shooting a lot of groups -- is an exercise in deferred gratification. Calculated recoil in that configuration is 26.5 foot pounds.

* * *

Enjoyed the thread. You have a fine rifle, and one christened roughly when you were!
 
G'day

I have watched this thread from the beginning, and all I can say is" well done" .
What plans do you have for this rifle???
Please don't just let it sit in your gun safe.

Thankyou for your time

harro
 
jackie,
how well does the 06 brass fit the back of the chamber prior to fire form ?
one trick with 06 brass is to lay a layer of tape around the base to center the case in the chamber before fire forming..then just neck size the second time with no tape.
its all about keeping the case centered in the chamber.
mike in co
 
Charles,
Did you look at the velocity differences of the same load in the different barrels? Jim Borden has said that he thinks that tune is velocity specific. If your various barrels produced different velocities with the same load, then their differing primer preferences may simply have been because different primers produced different velocities., and since the contours and lengths may have been quite similar, adjusting powder charges so that the velocities were the same might have been interesting. In the past, my tests, and in all published tests that I have read have ignored this issue. They have shown the variations in velocities produced, which were significant, but in trying to hold all but one reloading component constant, they virtually guaranteed that there would be significant differences in velocity, and tune.
Boyd
 
Charles,
Interesting article...thanks. To be more specific though, I would think that for CF applications, primers would be better compared as to their accuracy potental if minor corrections in powder charge were made to hold a uniform velocity, with everything else constant, bullet, seating depth, type of powder and lot, as well as case mfg., lot, number of firings, and method of sizing. It would also probably be a good idea to note loaded round concentricity, to take that variable into account. I the past, I have done my own tests in the usual manner, and thought that I had learned something. Now, I think that I would proceed differently. Just an opoinion.....
Boyd
 
Charles, I have not worked with any primer but the Federal 215 Magnum Match. With the load I shot the groups I posted with, I doubt I could get much better results. The velosity is good, extreme spread was within 2O fps.

I think with 4350, which I did not get as good of results, a different Primer might work.

The big problem is finding out. I put about 100 rounds through this thing over a two week end period, and I am not going to lie, it wrecked my shoulder. Sitting down at the bench with a full loaded '06, even at 12.2 pounds, can get a little taxing. The damned thing kicks.

Remember, I am still a wimpy "point blank" Benchrest Shooter.

Part of my Winter project schedule is to work up loads with different combo's. That is, if work slows down enough so I can at the very least get to the range. My shooting has suffered something bad due to the fact that we are simply snowed under with work. Been on 10 hr days, 6 and 7 day weeks just about all summer........jackie
 
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