30br-30ppc.....30ppc-30br

jackie schmidt said:
No, the Grendal Case is too much smaller in diameter than the BR case. It is more like a longer body PPC case.

The reason I did not use the Grendal case is I just didn't want to. How is that for a reason.

But, it is an option, in fact, a good one. But I will let someone else do the testing on that. I think the combo of 4198 and the BR case at about 3000 fps will be hard to top.........jackie
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Your reasoning is fine with me.

It IS a long PPC. About .075" long, and necked up to 30 from 6.5, and Lapua makes very good brass for it with small primers and small flasholes.

I've been shooting it for a while now and have done lots of testing with it..and am very happy with it. 3000FPS is not a problem and my old, tired brass has 20 or more:eek: firings on it, so brass life is good. Capacity is pretty much smack dab between a 30ppc and 30br. If 3000 fps is the magic number and brass life is good and accuracy is good, what's not to like about a case that is .075 longer than a ppc and allows someone to shoot score, competetivly, by switching barrels on his PPC..HV or LV? A good 30BR IS hard to beat, but I don't feel like I'm giving up anything at all. JMO:)---Mike Ezell
 
"I think this is facinating stuff. We have all assumed that a 6PPC was the cats meow for 100-200 yard Benchrest. But these 30 calibers are just as accurate, and from what I have witnessed, might be a tad easier to keep in competitive tune. I based that on the fact that I shot the two 100 yardages on separte days, with a 30 degree temperature swing, and I changed nothing.

These are just some of my own observations. I know the 30 Cal rules score, but perhaps it might do just as well in group if enough good shooters are willing to dive into the deep end."

Jackie...WELCOME TO THE DARK SIDE"....:D


I have 2 30BRs and I think they will agg. with the 6ppc on the club level..


Eddie in Texas
 
Eddie...

eww1350 said:
"I think this is facinating stuff. We have all assumed that a 6PPC was the cats meow for 100-200 yard Benchrest. But these 30 calibers are just as accurate, and from what I have witnessed, might be a tad easier to keep in competitive tune. I based that on the fact that I shot the two 100 yardages on separte days, with a 30 degree temperature swing, and I changed nothing.

These are just some of my own observations. I know the 30 Cal rules score, but perhaps it might do just as well in group if enough good shooters are willing to dive into the deep end."

Jackie...WELCOME TO THE DARK SIDE"....:D


I have 2 30BRs and I think they will agg. with the 6ppc on the club level..


Eddie in Texas
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check out IBS webpage, match results, group, 2008, 200-300 IBS Group Nationals in Weikert, PA. 2nd and 3rd places for light and heavy gun agg was Dean Breeden and Hal Drake, both shooting 30 BR's in both weight classes. They do work sometimes.
 
steve stanley said:
I think you will have to cut the extractor groove too, I ground a cutter that does both at the same time. steve
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Yep. Without cutting the extractor groove the extractor traps the case inside the bolt face. The top of the rim is tight against the bolt and the case won't fall free.

I measured several cases and the PPC rim is .030 smaller but the extractor groove is only about .020 smaller.

I have an older drop port that has the coned bolt and a new version with the Rem bolt nose. On the older bolt the rebated case is a bit too close to the inner dia of the bolt nose. On the newer bolt the dia is just enough larger to eliminate this worry. Now that I know this I will have to try make another case with the rebated rim but leaving the groove full dia and see it it will work in the new action.

I also measured the neck area of the port which is app .395 and it probably should be about .340 for the 30 cal cases.
 
For whatever it is worth, I have some of Red Cornelison's brass that he took from 6br rim size to fit a small bolt face. It is severely rebated, but he had no trouble with safety with the brass.
Butch
 
For [30BR] barrels, on the old Time Precision ALV action, PPC bolt-face, I rebate the rims, and re-cut the extractor grooves - to a depth equal to what was removed from the rim diameter (the tool was easy enough to grind) - this works quite well. As Butch pointed out, doing this leaves a a LOT of barss around the primer pocket - compare it to a .222 case! :eek:;) RG
 
For a 30BR, if one were going to shoot only 100/200, in a LV format with 112/118 gr bullets, what would be the difference in an 18tw as oppose to a 17tw barrel?

Thanks,

curtis
 
Elvis has left he building

mwezell said:
Your reasoning is fine with me.

It IS a long PPC. About .075" long, and necked up to 30 from 6.5, and Lapua makes very good brass for it with small primers and small flasholes.

I've been shooting it for a while now and have done lots of testing with it..and am very happy with it. 3000FPS is not a problem and my old, tired brass has 20 or more:eek: firings on it, so brass life is good. Capacity is pretty much smack dab between a 30ppc and 30br. If 3000 fps is the magic number and brass life is good and accuracy is good, what's not to like about a case that is .075 longer than a ppc and allows someone to shoot score, competetivly, by switching barrels on his PPC..HV or LV? A good 30BR IS hard to beat, but I don't feel like I'm giving up anything at all. JMO:)---Mike Ezell
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Mike,
What you have found and know is what we have found.
David
 
cwood3 said:
For a 30BR, if one were going to shoot only 100/200, in a LV format with 112/118 gr bullets, what would be the difference in an 18tw as oppose to a 17tw barrel?

Thanks,

curtis
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Curtis................ None.

Get what ya can get..... In other words...If.. Say, Bruno has the contour you want in a 17... Get it... If the said contour is in 18, get it....

Even if you were to shoot 125gr 7-8 ogive pills, the 18 twist is fine.

Nice and stable.

Detectable torque difference between the 17 twist and 18 twist is academic... In a 10.5 30BR, the torque MAY be jussssst a tad less in a 18 twist.... Recoil WILL be the same...:D

cale
 
cwood3 said:
For a 30BR, if one were going to shoot only 100/200, in a LV format with 112/118 gr bullets, what would be the difference in an 18tw as oppose to a 17tw barrel?

Thanks,

curtis
Click to expand...

With flat-base bullets of up to 1.050" long (this will cover most thirty caliber bullets of up to 125 Gr.), you will find no "practical difference" in AGGING potential. The 18" twist rate will impart a gyroscopic satbility factor (Sg) of 1.4+; so, the 17" twist will provide a LARGE Sg safety-net, with no measurable down-side. For comparison, using the same data/methods, the 6mm (68 Gr. FB at 0.845" long) / 14" twist model results in a meager Sg of 1.3. :eek:;)

Via a 17" twist, the BIB 112;116;123 Gr. FB bullets (all based upon the 0.925" long jacket, and measuring < .950" long), exit the muzzle with Sg of 1.9 - the UPPER END of the precision window!:eek: Ideally, bullets of this length should deliver nearest to their FULL potential via a 1:19" twist, which, at sea-level, and standard conditions, and 3000 FPS MV, resulst in Sg of 1.5!;)

But, I'm splitting frog hairs - again . . . still, the GURUS are/were correct: the MAGIC lies in Sg between 1.4 and 1.9. :D RG
 
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Twist

I have been shooting 1-17, but after talking to Randy the other day, I decided to call Amy at Bruno's and she has me a LV taper coming in 1-18.

If it shoots just as well as the 1-17 I have on the LV-Sporter now, it might tame it down just a little. Probably won't notice the difference.

For what it is worth, I had Lester order me a 1-17 Unlimited Barrel, (1.450 diameter), from Krieger. Might as well see what it will do in my Rail Gun.

Oh, and Randy R. You will be getting a small package in a day or so. I sent you a 30BR case as it comes out of my Fireform rig, and a finished neck turned case. Just so you could see what I am doing.....jackie
 
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30ppc/30br

Jackie in reading this post you mention useing the 220 Rus or the 6ppc for the basis of the 30ppc. I'm curious as to why not the use of the Lapua 7.62x39 case instead ? What forming issues or other problems (too much taper fire forming etc).would preclude useing this case ? Or was it just the materials on hand ? TIA ....Roger T
 
Roger

Just the materials on hand. I have never laid eyes on a Lapua 7.62x39.

Heck, a 7.62X39 "improved" might have been the way to go, it would have probably ended up looking just like the 30 Grendel, with a large rifle primer.........jakie
 
small/large primer

I'm not sure which primer the 7.62x39 uses either. I'm haveing issues with opening PDF files at the moment (My bad).
 
The 7.62x39

Jackie, I fire formed some Winchester 7.62x39 brass in the 30 Major chamber and you are right, it's just a modified version of a 30 Grendel. I have some Lapua 7.62x39 on order (or backorder) like everything else.
Billy Stevens reamed my chamber with his version of the 30 Grendel, he calls it the 30 Eargle, it’s very close to the 30 Major if not one and the same. I’ve been shooting it for about 6 months and I’m amazed how accurate it is. The guys I shoot with are shooting 30 BR’s and they are hard to beat, but I get lucky at times.
I think all 7.62x39 brass has large primers. Mike Ezell told me he had some old Remington 7.62x39 that used the small primer but have changed to the large. James
 
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