Your experience in shooting a 30 BR to
- Thread starter MRL
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jackie schmidt
New member
Mrl
In my opinion, 300 yards is the limit to a shooters ability to read flags with the precision that it takes to be competitive at Point Blank Benchrest.
There is no doubt that a 30BR has the accuracy potential to be just as successful at 300, as it does 100. In fact, several shooters have done quite well with well tuned 30's at big 300 yard matches.
I think any "advantage" that a 110 grn bullet at 3000 fps is a non factor when compared to a 68 grn bullet going 3350. Very few shooters have the skills to take advantage of such a small amount of advantage in BC.
In short, with the Rifles being equal, the best wind reader wins.
Of course, that statement, "the rifles being equal", is a big factor.
As for the 110 Berger, I would bet a 118 would be a tad better.
There are a lot of us who are "johnny come latelys" to the 30BR scene, but we are learning quick.
In my opinion, 300 yards is the limit to a shooters ability to read flags with the precision that it takes to be competitive at Point Blank Benchrest.
There is no doubt that a 30BR has the accuracy potential to be just as successful at 300, as it does 100. In fact, several shooters have done quite well with well tuned 30's at big 300 yard matches.
I think any "advantage" that a 110 grn bullet at 3000 fps is a non factor when compared to a 68 grn bullet going 3350. Very few shooters have the skills to take advantage of such a small amount of advantage in BC.
In short, with the Rifles being equal, the best wind reader wins.
Of course, that statement, "the rifles being equal", is a big factor.
As for the 110 Berger, I would bet a 118 would be a tad better.
There are a lot of us who are "johnny come latelys" to the 30BR scene, but we are learning quick.
Pete Wass
Well-known member
I am shooting
some 110 Bergers now in a 30 BR and I think they are shooting as well as any of the other bullets I have. I don't think I have ever been able to see an advantage, 118 vs 110's or 112's. They seem to shoot in the same place as far as I can see. As Jackie said, the 300 yd game is a different game. One must be aware of what the atmosphere is doing. I have done fairly well at 300 over the years but can't begin to tell you why because I don't know. I think it may be because I have shot a fair amount of 300 shoots over the past 7 or so years. Generally experience will give one something to use. I also hasten to add that, from my experience, Randy's 112 or 118 - 7's are as good as it gets for 30 cal bullets. I prefer the 7's over all the others because most of the barrels I have shot them in seem to digest them well. I will take 7's any day over all the others. I don't think the Berger 110's are 7's but they should be.
some 110 Bergers now in a 30 BR and I think they are shooting as well as any of the other bullets I have. I don't think I have ever been able to see an advantage, 118 vs 110's or 112's. They seem to shoot in the same place as far as I can see. As Jackie said, the 300 yd game is a different game. One must be aware of what the atmosphere is doing. I have done fairly well at 300 over the years but can't begin to tell you why because I don't know. I think it may be because I have shot a fair amount of 300 shoots over the past 7 or so years. Generally experience will give one something to use. I also hasten to add that, from my experience, Randy's 112 or 118 - 7's are as good as it gets for 30 cal bullets. I prefer the 7's over all the others because most of the barrels I have shot them in seem to digest them well. I will take 7's any day over all the others. I don't think the Berger 110's are 7's but they should be.
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I shot a .30 BR at the Southeastern Regional 300 yard matches in HV for a couple of years, and did reasonably well. Some top 10s, which is good for me. The only win I had at 300 HV was earlier, with a 6 PPC, but my next PPC barrel wasn't as good as my .30 BR. This is group shooting, BTW.
I figured the 6PPC and .30 BR are close enough in performance that how good an individual rifle (barrel) is was the best way to choose which to shoot. Still feel that way. I was using BIB 118 10-ogive, but will go along with the others that at this distance, any slight improvement in BC isn't gong to matter near as much as reading the conditions.
If it make you feel better, the .30 BR has at least one win at a 600 yard match, though it is hardly ideal. For that matter, I believe Chechako used a the 6 PPC for some wins at 600 too.
I figured the 6PPC and .30 BR are close enough in performance that how good an individual rifle (barrel) is was the best way to choose which to shoot. Still feel that way. I was using BIB 118 10-ogive, but will go along with the others that at this distance, any slight improvement in BC isn't gong to matter near as much as reading the conditions.
If it make you feel better, the .30 BR has at least one win at a 600 yard match, though it is hardly ideal. For that matter, I believe Chechako used a the 6 PPC for some wins at 600 too.
I guess I was muddled in my question. Is this a viable thing to do or am I wizzin in the wind. I have and have been shooting a 30 in score matchs locally but have a chance to shoot it in a match to 300yds. I have other rifles 6BR, 6PPC, etc...that shoot just as well but wanted to try the 30BR. I am just trying to figure out if I am wasting my time. Thanks.
Dick Grosbier
Club Coordinator
Humble Henry
New member
30br
Just had to chime in, hands down the 30BR will and have done well in the 300yd matches, have won a couple my self. When I started shooting the 30BR people asked how many times do you have to skip the bullet to get to 300 yds. Have went through the 30BR grave yard signs and the 30BR loading room on the head door, but my how time changes things!!!!
HUMBLE HENRY
Just had to chime in, hands down the 30BR will and have done well in the 300yd matches, have won a couple my self. When I started shooting the 30BR people asked how many times do you have to skip the bullet to get to 300 yds. Have went through the 30BR grave yard signs and the 30BR loading room on the head door, but my how time changes things!!!!
HUMBLE HENRY
Henry...
Yes, those signs. Weren't they a hoot! ".30BR Graveyard" at the entrance to Thurmont range about 7-8 years ago, then ".30BR Loading Room" on the outhouse at the Nationals at Mainville, PA. Took wuppin up on them before they got the message. Now they are wuppin up on us! --Greg
Yes, those signs. Weren't they a hoot! ".30BR Graveyard" at the entrance to Thurmont range about 7-8 years ago, then ".30BR Loading Room" on the outhouse at the Nationals at Mainville, PA. Took wuppin up on them before they got the message. Now they are wuppin up on us! --Greg
R. G. Robinett
New member
Hey, Greg,
I've still got that Mainville 'out-house sign' !
Al Nyhus and I were the last people to leave the range, and it was still hanging on the O-H door, so, I helped myself to the souvenier . . . as Paul Harvey. "and now, you know the rest of the story!"
Oh, on topic, the frist time I shot my Ronnie Long smithed/Morrison barreled 30 BR during a 300 Yd. (group) match, it made for a third place finish, which pulled me up, three or, four places to third place in the Grand Agg (100/200/300) too. That seems a LONG time ago - it was at prairie Dog Traget Club, Porcupine, SD, a.k.a. 'Deckerts' . . . about 1999 - we didn't have any VfS events out here back then.
Yep, prior to the 30 BR hammering some downright respectable groups, the PPC toters were really laughing and wondering if I was any good at, "skipping them in there?" !! All good natured ribbing of course, but THAT's what makes memories!
And, then, everyone either forgets, or, simply 'writes-off' Hal Drakes IBS Long Range (200/300) NATIONAL (group) CHAMPIONSHIP VICTORY, using a thirty . . . and that Dean Breeden, also shootin' a thirty Cal., finished second at that event! Wasn't THAT just last year??? RG
I've still got that Mainville 'out-house sign' !
Al Nyhus and I were the last people to leave the range, and it was still hanging on the O-H door, so, I helped myself to the souvenier . . . as Paul Harvey. "and now, you know the rest of the story!" Oh, on topic, the frist time I shot my Ronnie Long smithed/Morrison barreled 30 BR during a 300 Yd. (group) match, it made for a third place finish, which pulled me up, three or, four places to third place in the Grand Agg (100/200/300) too.
That seems a LONG time ago - it was at prairie Dog Traget Club, Porcupine, SD, a.k.a. 'Deckerts' . . . about 1999 - we didn't have any VfS events out here back then. Yep, prior to the 30 BR hammering some downright respectable groups, the PPC toters were really laughing and wondering if I was any good at, "skipping them in there?" !!
All good natured ribbing of course, but THAT's what makes memories! And, then, everyone either forgets, or, simply 'writes-off' Hal Drakes IBS Long Range (200/300) NATIONAL (group) CHAMPIONSHIP VICTORY, using a thirty . . . and that Dean Breeden, also shootin' a thirty Cal., finished second at that event! Wasn't THAT just last year???
RGRandy..
Somewhere I have a pic of that. Probably on a crashed hard drive. The "graveyard" sign at Thrumont(Bud Pryor) I refered to was an expression of the prevailing opinion at the time regarding the vaunted PPC and the lowly 30BR punkin roller. That opinion, at the time, was as American as apple pie...if you know what I mean? That particular year Dennis Collins won it with a PPC at 750 and something. The next 3 or four places were 30BR though. About 10 years ago when I converted my PPC to a 30BR a bunch of us met at a restaurant one day for lunch in the winter time. I had a dummy loaded round with me. Two guys asked me what I was going to shoot beyone 100 yards ! --Greg
ps just got my hunter gun back from Gary with new chamber based on my Henriksen reamer(.30x6.5x47 Laupa). You speak with Hugh regarding dimensions of the case body? That reamer by the way, specked out at no more than +.0002 variation on any critical dimension. Most were spot on. He can make some of the best imho! Hope I can do it justice!!!
I've still got that Mainville 'out-house sign' !
Oh, on topic, the frist time I shot my Ronnie Long smithed/Morrison barreled 30 BR during a 300 Yd. (group) match, it made for a third place finish, which pulled me up, three or, four places to third place in the Grand Agg (100/200/300) too.
Yep, prior to the 30 BR hammering some downright respectable groups, the PPC toters were really laughing and wondering if I was any good at, "skipping them in there?" !!
And, then, everyone either forgets, or, simply 'writes-off' Hal Drakes IBS Long Range (200/300) NATIONAL (group) CHAMPIONSHIP VICTORY, using a thirty . . . and that Dean Breeden, also shootin' a thirty Cal., finished second at that event! Wasn't THAT just last year???
Somewhere I have a pic of that. Probably on a crashed hard drive. The "graveyard" sign at Thrumont(Bud Pryor) I refered to was an expression of the prevailing opinion at the time regarding the vaunted PPC and the lowly 30BR punkin roller. That opinion, at the time, was as American as apple pie...if you know what I mean? That particular year Dennis Collins won it with a PPC at 750 and something. The next 3 or four places were 30BR though. About 10 years ago when I converted my PPC to a 30BR a bunch of us met at a restaurant one day for lunch in the winter time. I had a dummy loaded round with me. Two guys asked me what I was going to shoot beyone 100 yards
! --Gregps just got my hunter gun back from Gary with new chamber based on my Henriksen reamer(.30x6.5x47 Laupa). You speak with Hugh regarding dimensions of the case body? That reamer by the way, specked out at no more than +.0002 variation on any critical dimension. Most were spot on. He can make some of the best imho! Hope I can do it justice!!!
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R. G. Robinett
New member
Somewhere I have a pic of that. Probably on a crashed hard drive. The "graveyard" sign at Thrumont(Bud Pryor) I refered to was an expression of the prevailing opinion at the time regarding the vaunted PPC and the lowly 30BR punkin roller. That opinion, at the time, was as American as apple pie...if you know what I mean? That particular year Dennis Collins won it with a PPC at 750 and something. The next 3 or four places were 30BR though. About 10 years ago when I converted my PPC to a 30BR a bunch of us met at a restaurant one day for lunch in the winter time. I had a dummy loaded round with me. Two guys asked me what I was going to shoot beyone 100 yards
ps just got my hunter gun back from Gary with new chamber based on my Henriksen reamer(.30x6.5x47 Laupa). You speak with Hugh regarding dimensions of the case body? That reamer by the way, specked out at no more than +.0002 variation on any critical dimension. Most were spot on. He can make some of the best imho! Hope I can do it justice!!!
Greg, I received a 30x47 Lapua reamer from Hugh about 18 months ago - haven't cut a chamber with it yet, as I had just chambered a couple of barrels, using my original Dan Green (Forgreen's Reamers) 30x47 HBR reamer before the Henriksen reamer arrived . . and I've been too busy to wear those two out! And, this summer, I've been messing with a 25x47 LAPUA, for which Hugh also made the reamer. Essentially, the 6.5x47 LAPUA case is a clone of the 30x47 HBR, I believe, the brain child of Guy Chism, Danny Jarvais, and Larry Smart, way back about 1986/7 - HUNTER competitors have been on point for a LONG time!
The only significant differences between the Forgreen's 30x47 HBR and the 'new' 30x47 Lapua are the web diameters, and the neck-lengths, thus OALs: following necking-up, to thirty caliber, the Lapua case is closer 46MM in length.
The bolt-face to shoulder DATUM dimensions are within 0.001", and, both feature 30 Deg. shoulder angles. The only REAL difference is that the Lapua brass is already "made" - just neck it up, trim, turn to the desired neck-wall thickeness and go shootin'!
Oh, and my original reamer was compatable with either .308 Rem. UBR or, Winchester .300 Savage brass - that is, the chamber diameter, at 0.200" ahead of the bolt-face, is .267" (these cases usually mic .0.4635-0.4640" just above the extractor-groove), as opposed to the .4715" on my Henriksen reamer, which will be compatible with the larger diameter LAPUA brass; my virgin [LAPUA] brass measures 0.469" just above the extractor-groove.
And the small primers work GREAT - they've never failed to deliver - ya just have to make a big enough port for the FIRE to get through!
RG
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Greg, I received a 30x47 Lapua reamer from Hugh about 18 months ago - haven't cut a chamber with it yet, as I had just chambered a couple of barrels, using my original Dan Green (Forgreen's Reamers) 30x47 HBR reamer before the Henriksen reamer arrived . . and I've been too busy to wear those two out! And, this summer, I've been messing with a 25x47 LAPUA, for which Hugh also made the reamer. Essentially, the 6.5x47 LAPUA case is a clone of the 30x47 HBR, I believe, the brain child of Guy Chism, Danny Jarvais, and Larry Smart, way back about 1986/7 - HUNTER competitors have been on point for a LONG time!
The only significant differences between the Forgreen's 30x47 HBR and the 'new' 30x47 Lapua are the web diameters, and the neck-lengths, thus OALs: following necking-up, to thirty caliber, the Lapua case is closer 46MM in length.
The bolt-face to shoulder DATUM dimensions are within 0.001", and, both feature 30 Deg. shoulder angles. The only REAL difference is that the Lapua brass is already "made" - just neck it up, trim, turn to the desired neck-wall thickeness and go shootin'!
Oh, and my original reamer was compatable with either .308 Rem. UBR or, Winchester .300 Savage brass - that is, the chamber diameter, at 0.200" ahead of the bolt-face, is .267" (these cases usually mic .0.4635-0.4640" just above the extractor-groove), as opposed to the .4715" on my Henriksen reamer, which will be compatible with the larger diameter LAPUA brass; my virgin [LAPUA] brass measures 0.469" just above the extractor-groove.
And the small primers work GREAT - they've never failed to deliver - ya just have to make a big enough port for the FIRE to get through!
Randy,
What do you recomend opening up the flash hole to? Are you using standard small rifle primers or magnum? Do you expand in one step from .264 to .308?
Larry