What Happened to RBA? what will happen?

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cadillacjack

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I understand when RBA was formed it was supposed to be an organization of Shooters,for Shooters, by Shooters. It appears that membership has significantly dwindled and the number of places shooting RBA has decreased in the last few years. Why Is This? Could it be the complete lack of communication between the President and the members?(When was the last time you heard from Bob Collins?) Could it be the secretive way in which Bob Collins Runs The Organization?(When was the last time you saw or were sent a copy fo the financial condition of RBA? When were you told or shown where where YOUR mempership fees are or how they were spent? When were you told or shown where the $1.50 You pay per target is or where it was spent? Did you see the message Bob Collins Posted On This Forum of the PROPOSED RULE CHANGES? Did you see and join in the discussion Bob Collins encouraged members and RBA shooters to engage in PRIOR TO THE SECRATIVE VOTE MAKING THESE RULE CHANGES? Did YOU even know there were propossed rule changes? Did you know Bob Collins HAS A PISTOL HE WOULD LIKE TO SHOOT IN WHAT USED TO BE THE 10.5 CLASS? Did you Know that YOUR CURRENT SPOORTER WOULD BECOME OBSOLETE WITH THE RULE CHANGE? Did you Know Tradition means absolutely nothing to Bob Collins? Did you know Bob Collins runs the RBA like he owns it? Did you know membership in IR50/50 is growing during these troubled times for RBA? Did you wonder why the dues were increased? Did you wonder what Plans Bob Collins has for these fees? DOES IT LOOK LIKE THE END OF RBA TO YOU? LASTLY, BOB COLLINS, IF THE RBA IS PAYING SHOOTERS EXPENES TO ITALY, SIGN ME UP!!!! Hey Bob Collins, Why don't you start running RBA for the members as a whole and not your special little interest group? If you agree with the aforementioned please post: if you disagree with the aforementioned please post. Lets ALL take part in the future of RBA. These are just MY thoughts. FRED LEEDS
 
I saw a TV program last night about "happiness". I think rimfire benchrest shooters were near the bottom of the list.

Hose
 
My Thoughts

You asked for thoughts, so here are mine. They are not directed at anyone and the pronoun, "someone", does not reference anyone.


This is a situation that happens all of the time.

Someone is dissatified with something or somebody and decides to vent. After whining, moaning and groaning about it, they then sit on their dead hands and wait for someone else to make things right.

If you don't like it, change it. Create your own organization, make your own rules and run it as you see fit. Surely, with you in charge, everyone will be happy and your organization will flourish.

Put your money where your mouth is and run local, regional and national matches that meet with your approval. This cannot be too much for someone like you to handle.

Ultimately, your success and leadership will unify all rimfire shooters under one shooting organization for decades to come.

I will be the first to not hold my breath.
 
I have a question,Bob or whoever ,hopefully can get me a answer,The Sporter class has been changed again,I am kinda neutral on this because in one way,its easier & less money to build a sporter without the clips Or Safteys.I currently hold the Indoor sporter record in Meters,It was shot in the old Tuckertown Barn quite a number of years ago when wood stocks,Clips,Safteys & rould bottom stocks were being used,Before all the rule changes,Now,MY Question,Should a sporter of the newer rules be allowed to break my record,if so you RBA Boys are going in the wrong direction,Even the 2 gun records ,will be at risk.For every action there is always a reaction,Thanks & I am looking forward to a reply. BILL
 
I did put my money where my mouth is

Hulk, in the last 3 months I invested (bad term)(bought, better term) two new sporters costing in excess of $6,000. Had the President informed me or anyone else of the rule changes forth comming, I would not have had these guns built. If this is whining: so be it. Why don't you put your money where your mouth is and and buy these two guns then I'll will quit what you call whining. I won't hold my breath. Fred
 
What?

CJ,

First, it is whining, so be it. You are not the first, nor will you be the last to invest/purchase something that had a limited payback/lifespan due to circumstances beyond our control.

I am completely confused by your wanting me to put my money where my mouth is and purchase your rifles to stop your whining. I do not care if you whine until the next Ice Age. Nevertheless, if it will help, I will bid $3.00 each for your rifles.
 
If everytime there is an advance or improvement in guns,tuners,triggers,ammo ,barrels and we wanted to make a record stand forever we would be making a lot of records changes. If the guns are same weight and have same scopes then it does not matter if it has a safety or a magazine which is not used. A single shot has little or no edge over a clip fitted repeater.
The whole plan is to increase accuracy for less cost and compete more for the same dollars and get more shooters involved for less dollars. Screw tradition if it does not do these things.
If Bob is using RBA for his own personal toy then the members will wake up and leave or change leadership.
If anyone wants to shhot a Calfee pistol against a 10.5 lb rifle more power to him, I think he will lose regularly as the pistol are shot now.
The moneys should be accounted for in all cases to the membership no exceptions.
 
Who owns RBA ?

Is it the members, or is it Bob Collins and a few of his
friends. If RBA is a real Association with membership cards and such, and run by the way members vote then you may have something to whine about.

If it's owned by Bob Collins and a few of his friends then you don't really have much to whine about, you will have to go with the way he wants it or go, or go somewhere else to shoot.
S/S
 
Directed at 'SOMEONE"

If you don't like it, change it(someones quote)

Apparently someone doesn't get it!! The whole purpose of my post was to bring about some intelectual discussion about about the changes, Then if the majority of RBA shooters agreed with my thoughts the old rules could be reinstated. All shooters would be made aware of the changes and a vote could be had to determine what the shooters prefer. Hopefully, someone understands this, but probably not.

Ray Charles could see I am the someone to whom your orginal post was directed. If you haven't the intellect or courage to rationally discuss the issue, why waste your time,mine and all RBA's shooters with your rambeling banter concerning the important issue I brought to light.

Though you may not agree with my thoughts, I am by no means sitting on my hands. If you don't agree with my method of bringing about change so be it. At least I'm being pro-active and positive unlike yourself. The point is the circumstances are not beyond our control. Hey Hulk, Have a Great Day. Fred
 
This was their intent

RBA was designed by rimfire benchrest shooters, for rimfire benchrest shooters. Our goal is to enjoy the fellowship of shooters from across the country as well as test our skills against other countries around the world. Matches are contested in three classes - 7.5 lbs, 10.5 lbs and Unlimited at 50 yards and 50 meters. We cordially invite anyone to participate in our sport. Please join us in developing this discipline and help us promote shooting sports.
 
Who owns RBA?

Singleshot, It is my understanding RBA IS owned by the shooters and NOT Bob Collins. Thanks for your input. Fred
 
RBA is chartered in North Carolina as a Not-for-Profit Corporation. Bob Collins is the elected President by the Board of Directors which consist of all the Match Directors of RBA chartered clubs. Individual shooters have a voice to represent them through the Match Directors of the clubs where they shoot. The BOD (Match Directors) are the ones that make rule changes by a majority vote.
 
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Rba

Let me weigh in here, as the RBA match director of Oregon last year, I would like to make a couple points. First I am always disappointed when I find out more information from this website than is shared with the MD’s from RBA. It is unfortunate that there are not more individuals willing to participate in the management and operations of these organizations. I for one voiced my opinions and opposed most of these rule changes as I do not see the need to fix something that isn’t broken.

Unfortunately I was unable to attend the annual board meeting and because I was given approximately five days notice of what was being proposed as changes I did not have time to prepare much of a case.

I have not been informed of the results from the meeting or seen minutes but was told all 10 items passed. I understand there where six MD’s and according to Bob Collins all 22 had input? I know for a fact that the four from this side of the country were against the rule changes.

I think it is poor management to change the rules of an entire organization for just a few and I think that is what this amounts to fir these two issues.

The rule change for the Sporter class eliminates Sporter completely. Now we have a 7.5 pound custom class. The only argument I have heard for the change was to save money. Well if you have to pay $50 more for a trigger with a safety and a $100 more for a magazine well and clip on a custom sporter that is a drop in the bucket. If you think the masses are suddenly going to run out and have a custom sporter built because they can save $150 you are way off base. There are a few people that want to use an action with a solid receiver and make it qualify in sporter class. That is not fair to the current sporter owners that have built according to the rules, and the prior record holders.

The issue on pistols is exactly the same thing. This has always been a rifle contest and I am impressed that there are a few people that can shoot a customized pistol well enough to compete with rifles. But these four or five people can shoot in unlimited already why make special rules for one or two people, especially if those two people happen to be on the board of directors.

I run matches and try to make as many people happy as I can. I think there is a problem here but I am not sure anyone cares enough to get involved to make a correction.

No whining just my thoughts.

Wes King
 
cclfn said:
Let me weigh in here, as the RBA match director of Oregon last year, I would like to make a couple points. First I am always disappointed when I find out more information from this website than is shared with the MD’s from RBA. It is unfortunate that there are not more individuals willing to participate in the management and operations of these organizations. I for one voiced my opinions and opposed most of these rule changes as I do not see the need to fix something that isn’t broken.

Unfortunately I was unable to attend the annual board meeting and because I was given approximately five days notice of what was being proposed as changes I did not have time to prepare much of a case.

I have not been informed of the results from the meeting or seen minutes but was told all 10 items passed. I understand there where six MD’s and according to Bob Collins all 22 had input? I know for a fact that the four from this side of the country were against the rule changes.

I think it is poor management to change the rules of an entire organization for just a few and I think that is what this amounts to fir these two issues.

The rule change for the Sporter class eliminates Sporter completely. Now we have a 7.5 pound custom class. The only argument I have heard for the change was to save money. Well if you have to pay $50 more for a trigger with a safety and a $100 more for a magazine well and clip on a custom sporter that is a drop in the bucket. If you think the masses are suddenly going to run out and have a custom sporter built because they can save $150 you are way off base. There are a few people that want to use an action with a solid receiver and make it qualify in sporter class. That is not fair to the current sporter owners that have built according to the rules, and the prior record holders.

The issue on pistols is exactly the same thing. This has always been a rifle contest and I am impressed that there are a few people that can shoot a customized pistol well enough to compete with rifles. But these four or five people can shoot in unlimited already why make special rules for one or two people, especially if those two people happen to be on the board of directors.

I run matches and try to make as many people happy as I can. I think there is a problem here but I am not sure anyone cares enough to get involved to make a correction.

No whining just my thoughts.

Wes King
Click to expand...

Wes, You hit the nail on the head IMO!
Dave Burton
 
I agree with some of the comments made by Fred.

I have been a member of the RBA for several years now. During this time I have never had the opportunity to vote or been ask about what I thought of any changes. All shooters in the RBA should be aware of purposed changes and allowed to vote yea or nay. We are Paying Members therefore we should and must be involved in making the decisions.

Fred K
 
I have no dog in this fight, but let me say it sure makes interesting reading for us folks who are looking to get started (or started again, in my case) and are wondering which discipline to shoot.

Mike
 
If I didn't know better I would suggest you should come on over to IR 50/50. But, I can't! The reason is that at our last nationals in N.Y., during the meeting, this same issue was brought forth, and thankfully Wilbur tabled the discussion. The problem is; you and I both know that next year it will be brought up again, and with more push for its happening where RBA has made the change.

I think that maybe we should concider this: if you like the idea of having a 7.5# Class instead of a Sporter Class, then maybe you should consider shoot RBA and leave IR 50/50 well enough alone! But, if you don't like the idea, then come on over to IR 50/50 and leave your excess baggage behind.

Wilbur, if you are reading this, please, please remember that you DO OWN IR 50/50 and can tell everybody who wants to change it to either shut up or move along!

Dave Shattuck
 
If the members do not know what is going on in an Association that they joined it's either there own fault for not paying attention or poor communications between the officials and the members.

Like Fred K said,
"I have never had the opportunity to vote or been ask about what I thought of any changes. All shooters in the RBA should be aware of purposed changes and allowed to vote yea or nay. We are Paying Members therefore we should and must be involved in making the decisions."

If this is the way it is maybe it's time that Bob C. and some of the other officials come forward and explain why the members seem to be in the dark about what is happing to "their" Association.
S/S
 
Dave Shattuck said:
If I didn't know better I would suggest you should come on over to IR 50/50. But, I can't! The reason is that at our last nationals in N.Y., during the meeting, this same issue was brought forth, and thankfully Wilbur tabled the discussion. The problem is; you and I both know that next year it will be brought up again, and with more push for its happening where RBA has made the change.

I think that maybe we should concider this: if you like the idea of having a 7.5# Class instead of a Sporter Class, then maybe you should consider shoot RBA and leave IR 50/50 well enough alone! But, if you don't like the idea, then come on over to IR 50/50 and leave your excess baggage behind.

Wilbur, if you are reading this, please, please remember that you DO OWN IR 50/50 and can tell everybody who wants to change it to either shut up or move along!

Dave Shattuck
Click to expand...

That's a pretty large oversimplification of events at the nationals. After LOTS of talk and comment it became quite clear no substantial majority wanted any change and THEN Wilbur brought it to an end.
The point, I think, is that there was plenty of time to kick it around and Wilbur did not subvert that.
Frankly, trying to second guess what happens in a year is less than productive.
 
I don't have a dog in the fight anymore, but Yes RBA is owned by the membership. All rules changes were to be brought up at the Nationals and published to give time for the Match Directors to have discussions with the shooters to find out what the shooters wanted, then the Match Director was to take the majority vote to the BOD meeting in person or proxy. The game was born out of some problems with IR 50/50 to give the shooters the say in how the game was run and which direction it would take instead of how a dictator wanted it to be run and go in what direction. I will be the first to say that RBA has never been run perfectly as it was designed and we knew that allowing everyone to have a voice in the direction of the game would cause some problems, but we thought that it would still be the best game for the shooters.

Again, I do not have a dog in the fight, but ALL the shooters do, and they can change it whenever they want.

Thanks,

Scott
 
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