Rifle for Airgun Benchrest?

For Sale

Brian,
I have a new (less than 50 pellets) Air Arms EV2 MK2 that I need to sell. Complete with scope, custom base and air tank ready to go. If interested please email me at mike.tirrell@sbcglobal.net and I will send pics.

Thanks, Mike
 
The AGBR project gun, the saga continues.

I took the Air Arms S400SL-XTRA in the new laminated BR stock to the June 6th AGBR Indoor Match at Holbrook and was not disappointed. (gun pictures in post #33 of this thread). The gun feels and shoots great, first target was a 244-2X:
Jun6_U1s.jpg


As I started the second target, my confidence in the new gun was growing, I was doing better with it and then I reached bullseye #19.

At this point something shifted, the POI moved up about 3/8" relative to the POA and repeated to the same shifted POI on bullseye #20. At this point I shifted up to a sighter bullseye and the same shift still happened so I finished the target trying to use a bit of hold off to compensate however the gun was shooting POI erratically and the target ended up being a 242:
Jun6_U2s.jpg


At this point I put the gun away figuring troubleshooting would happen at home on my own range after the match and I shot the third target with the AA S400MPR-FT and ended up with a 248...

Later at home after firing a number of test targets while using the chronograph, I discovered two important things, first was that as the pressure in the air reservoir tube dropped, the tube shifted ever so slightly in the stock, evidently a bedding issue and second, the chronograph revealed what I suspect is erratic operation of the inner shot charging valve until some critical level of pressure in the reservoir is reached at which point the shot pressure starts dropping at which point it becomes more stable. This appears to have something to do with the power control setting however the first fifteen shots or so are always indicating more erratic velocities regardless of power setting and fill pressure:
Str3-10_061509s.jpg


Since the June 6th match, I've changed the bedding and the gun is shooting more accurately without the sudden shift as seen in the target above and the shot charging valve issue is still under scrutiny. At the moment, I'm conducting tests to see if an intermediate setting of the power control combined with adjusting the fill pressure will minimize the erratic velocities however I'm considering the best solution is to send the gun to Steve at PAG and have his needle valve modification installed in place of the power control valve. The logic to this is that the power control valve is simply a hole drilled through a shaft which rotates when the knob is turned restricting the airflow to some extent by miss aligning the hole in the control shaft with the port it passes air to. As with the existing conntrol, all control from minimum to maximum is in one quarter turn, using the needle valve modification done by PAG improves this control range to become 4 turns with an Allen wrench/hex key and is a more reliable control setting less likely to change once set.

However, for all this, I'm quite pleased with how the gun is performing, for a project started in mid February, to be now at the tweaking stage of the game with it is very gratifying...

Happy Shooting, Y'all...
Mitch & Shadow...
 
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Re: AA S400SL Benchrest gun project

Back home following the June 6th Match at Holbrook, once I'd made the necessary fixes mentioned in my previous posting, I spent a lot of time shooting the gun on my test range with the chronograph. As the date for the Holbrook June 21st outdoor match approached, mainly the week before the 21st during which I spent a lot of time trying different fill pressures coupled with different power control settings of the gun power control.

What I discovered was that at certain settings, the power control seemed to change settings while firing. With the power control setting advanced to 50% or 60% of its range, the gun shot well and velocities were very consistent and the change of velocity with change of pressure was greatly reduced as compared to the chronograph tests I had done previously with the control set to maximum, i.e. against the stop.

However during this recent series of tests at reduced power, when I advanced the control to 65% or higher, velocities became more erratic and seldom would velocities of shot strings repeat or track each other and in one instance, each of a set of four 30 shot string velocities would be an average of 10 to 15 fps higher for each consecutive string.

At this point for a test trying to identify what was happening, I tore the gun down, set the power control to about 70% of its range, locked the control shaft with the friction setscrew as tight as I dared set it, and set about another series of chronograph tests. The results of locking the power control shaft showed a drastic improvement.

For comparison purposes, here is the graph of velocities from the week previous testing:
Str3-10_061509s.jpg



And here is a graph of velocities after locking the control valve at 70% of its range:
Str13-16_062009s.jpg



And at the Father's Day Match on June 21st, the improvement was most evident. Shooting this gun with the locked power control, I shot highest scoring target, managed to win the second and third targets, and came in third overall in aggregate score. Regrettably, dismal windblown rainy conditions made shooting very difficult and I really messed up the first of the three targets and dropped 21 points by missing one bullseye completely and double shooting another.

However, at the end of the match, my aggregate score was only 8 points below the winning score and if I'd managed to not screw up that first target as I did, a score of 5 on one messed up bullseye and 4 on the other or better on each of those two bullseyes would have won the match...

Ah, well, there will be a next time...

Happy Shooting Y'all,
Mitch & Shadow...
 
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Rifle for Airgun Benchrest - revised...

As I'm having a quiet summer meaning having lots of time to spend in the workshop, for me being an inveterate tinker, I simply can't leave well enough alone.

My Air Arms S400SL-XTRA in .22 caliber as shown in post #33 of this thread has now been joined by this S400SL-XTRA in .177 caliber mounted with Mueller Optics new 8X-32X 44mm side focus AO target scope:
DSCN0222r.jpg

DSCN0223r.jpg

DSCN0224cr.jpg


Having just finished assembling this gun so far I've only been able to test this gun/scope combination on my 10 meter indoor range and its a winning combination as far as I can tell at this point. Its produced a 250-22X target on its first shooting using my 44% scale reduced AGBR type target and this coming week I plan to shoot it a lot more however based on the way my other two Air Arms S400 guns shoot, I'm confident this gun will not be a disappointment.

Update, 20 Aug: 7 targets 44% scaled AGBR type targets have now been shot with this gun and all are 250-18X or better...


A mention of the new Mueller scope is in order. This scope is a brand new target model for Mueller Optics and is just coming onto the market. Rich Schlampp, owner of Mueller Optics, tells me that this scope has been two years in development and in talking with Rich in late July, I learned that on August 3rd. Mueller would begin shipping this new model so I placed an order for one of the first.

Murphy's law, wouldn't you know, when it arrived via UPS at the end of the first week of August, the new scope had been buggered up by rough handling in shipping and and Saturday I sent an e-mail to Rich explaining the problem and asking him to advise me as to dealing with the problem.

Monday AM when I turned my computer on, in my incoming e-mail was a response from Rich at Mueller Optics that stated simply, "I am going to send a replacement out today (Monday) and in the box I will include a "UPS return label".. When you receive the replacement please use the label to return the scope"

And this past Thursday, UPS delivered a new scope in immaculate condition and I used a set of B-Square "Airsport" 30mm high rings to mount the scope and started testing the gun.

I'm impressed... Both with Rich at Mueller and the new gun and scope combination. I'm really impressed that Rich, as owner of Mueller Optics gets on the phone and talks with his customers and his conviction to provide a quality product including his intent to stand behind what he sells.

As to the scope, its a very solidly made instrument with quality optics and shows a strong influence in its design of what I consider to be tactical in nature. Its heavy as compared to my other scopes which some might consider a drawback if you are trying to meet a weight requirement of a sporter class gun however this scope is very ruggedly made with large target knobs for adjustments in 1/8" @100yds clicks and it has a crosshair/dot target reticule that I find very easy to use with my 67 year old eyes.

What is most important to me and what interested me in this scope is that the AO of this scope focuses sharply on my 10 meter range. Finding a high power scope that I can mount on a gun and use it on both my 10 meter range as well as in competition beats having to swap scopes every time I want to test on my indoor range. And I have tested this scope at both 10 meters and 55 yards over the past couple days and find it to be quite satisfactory so far...

In the pictures above, and for initial testing, I had borrowed the stock from the S400SL BR gun in .22 caliber. Since these initial pictures were taken, I've since finished making the stock for this S400SL .177 caliber gun for unlimited class shooting. Its big and heavy and very stable in the Von Ahrens rest:
CherryBR_033c.jpg

CherryBR_035c.jpg

CherryBR_034cc.jpg

Now that's a fine chunk of furniture, Black Cherry to be precise...

Happy Shooting Y'all,
Mitch & Shadow...
 
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New Cherry Benchrest stock photo slideshow...

While making the Black Cherry benchrest stock for my latest Air Arms S400SL, I took a series of photographs to document various stages of the stock as it evolved. I have put 16 of these pictures into a slide show for those who are interested.
http://s282.photobucket.com/albums/kk270/CapeRadio/Cherry BR stock/?albumview=slideshow

Slideshow updated October 14th to add start of FX Royale 400 benchrest stock being made of black cherry wood.

Second slideshow added 30 Oct, 2009, 12 pictures of FX Royale BR stock inleting in process:
http://s282.photobucket.com/albums/kk270/CapeRadio/FX_Royale Stock Inleting/?albumview=slideshow


Third slide show added 4 Nov.2009, 4 pictures of FX Royale BR stock with final shaping and sculpting completed, first coat of urethane sealer, and action/barrel/air bottle mounted...
http://s282.photobucket.com/albums/kk270/CapeRadio/FX_Royale BR Stock/?albumview=slideshow

Happy Shooting,
Mitch & Shadow...
 
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Lately, with a number of interested shooters coming to the matches, the question keeps coming up, What gun should a fellow buy to get started?

Nearly a year ago, last January, I started this thread as I'd become interested in Airgun Benchrest shooting. At that point in time all my experience with pellet guns was with Co2 guns, a Chinese AR2078 and a Crosman 2300 series silhouette pistol, both in .177 caliber. With over 58 years of gunpowder shooting experience including years of NRA position match competitions, somehow, until just recently, pellet airgun shooting had eluded me...

The key question I was looking for an answer to, "what is available for an "out of the box" airgun capable of the accuracy to be reasonably competitive for a person with little to no experience with airguns, to get started in this sport?"

That was what I was asking when I started this thread and I found plenty of good answers to my question, the best answers coming from visiting the Holbrook Sportsman's Club Indoor AGBR match Feb. 7th, 2009. After a chance to see and try a number of guns, and talk to the shooters at that match, following the match, I purchased an Air Arms S400MPR-FT and its turned out to be an excellent choice. Yes, I have moved on to more exotic guns in the year since but the AA S400MPR-FT remains the gun I compare all other airguns to for shootability and is the gun I would recommend to a shooter asking this same question.

DSCN0363.jpg

DSCN0369.jpg


Briefly, the Air Arms S400MPR-FT is a clone of the Air Arms S400MPR 10 Meter match gun but with higher velocity/power as its designed for the longer range Field Target competitions instead of 10 meter match competitions... The S400MPR-FT is amazingly accurate, with it, for me as a new precision airgun shooter, when shooting it, I have managed to win a few targets and manage to place in the top three finishing positions with it on more than one occasion.

A couple of the strong points of the Air Arms S400MPR-FT airgun as a first gun is its shoot ability right from the box and its top notch trigger. This trigger is a three lever trigger design and is fully adjustable for either single stage or two stage operation at very sensitive trigger pressure levels in the 1 to 1.5 oz. range which is ideal for benchrest shooting.

The only accessory that I would recommend for a first time user, is to contact Jeff Madison at www.mwerksllc.com for a front rest plate for the S400MPR-FT. Jeff does not list this plate in his listing of plates he makes however he made an excellent one for me that works great. This plate is machined from a solid block of aluminum, is 3" wide, and comes with T-nuts that fit the accessory rail on the underside of the forearm of the MPR stock. With this plate, the S400MPR-FT is as solid and stable as any benchrest gun in either a front rest/rear bag setup or in a one piece rest such as the von Ahrens rest that I use:
DSCN0368.jpg

DSCN0367.jpg

DSCN0366.jpg


Of all the rifles I've shot to date both in AGBR matches as well as practice sessions, for an "out of the box" gun, for both quality and accuracy, the AA S400MPR-FT is without a doubt, my favorite...

Happy Shooting,
Mitch & Shadow...
 
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AA S400 Black Cherry BR stock #3

After making the first of my BR stocks of black cherry for the Air Arms S400SL-XTRA in .22 caliber which has turned out very successful as it is very stable with very little tracking error, I found myself dealing with an FX Royale factory made synthetic stock which was flexing and bowing sideways when shooting from a rest. I decided that by modifying the design of my original S400 cherry stock to fit a front bottle type airgun, I could make a similar stock of black cherry for the FX Royale that would solve the lack of stiffness problem. This required a drastic redesign of the original cherry stock and the end result is a stock very stable in the rest and forgiving of the human factor while shooting the gun in the rest.

Due to a difference in geometry of the two different makes of guns, the FX Royale having the rear of the action closer to the trigger, one of the necessities was redesigning the shape of the pistol grip and how the top of the grip area of the stock flows up to the top of the stock behind the action. This redesign worked out very well and I find the redesigned stock for the FX Royale to have more eye appeal to me as a designer and so the concept of making a third black cherry stock was born...

While the original black cherry stock is very functional an a pleasure to shoot with, I find my artistic eye is a bit put off by the long angles of the forearm of the original stock running back above the pistol grip and trigger to the rear of the action. When making the FX Royale stock I acquired a couple of large radius router bits for milling out the air bottle pocket in the FX Royale stock. Also, due to the increase in size of the forearm of the FX Royale stock needed to fit the air bottle in, I had changed the shape of the sides and not run the transition angle all the way back but instead stopped it several inches ahead of the trigger opening. On the new cherry stock #3, I planned to use the large radius router bit to make a cove instead of an angle running the length of the side of the forearm above the flat gun guide surfaces hoping this would give the stock more pleasing lines to my eye. I decided that a third design combining what I liked of the FX Royale stock and the original cherry stock made for the AA S400SL gun was feasible and I set to work by gluing up another blank of five cherry boards. I have just completed this third stock and I'm quite pleased with how its turned out. Another change is from the polyurethane varnish I used on the previous stocks is to use a hand rubbed tung oil finish on this stock. I think it looks a lot better with the oil finish which enhances the color of the cherry more than the polyurethane does...

Please view the four pictures and tell me what you think of how its turned out:
http://s282.photobucket.com/albums/kk270/CapeRadio/Cherry BR stock no_3/?albumview=slideshow


Thanks,

Happy shooting,
Mitch & Shadow...
 
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ShadowChaser said:
Lately, with a number of interested shooters coming to the matches, the question keeps coming up, What gun should a fellow buy to get started?

Nearly a year ago, last January, I started this thread as I'd become interested in Airgun Benchrest shooting. At that point in time all my experience with pellet guns was with Co2 guns, a Chinese AR2078 and a Crosman 2300 series silhouette pistol, both in .177 caliber. With over 58 years of gunpowder shooting experience including years of NRA position match competitions, somehow, until just recently, pellet airgun shooting had eluded me...

The key question I was looking for an answer to, "what is available for an "out of the box" airgun capable of the accuracy to be reasonably competitive for a person with little to no experience with airguns, to get started in this sport?"

That was what I was asking when I started this thread and I found plenty of good answers to my question, the best answers coming from visiting the Holbrook Sportsman's Club Indoor AGBR match Feb. 7th, 2009. After a chance to see and try a number of guns, and talk to the shooters at that match, following the match, I purchased an Air Arms S400MPR-FT and its turned out to be an excellent choice. Yes, I have moved on to more exotic guns in the year since but the AA S400MPR-FT remains the gun I compare all other airguns to for shootability and is the gun I would recommend to a shooter asking this same question.

DSCN0363.jpg

DSCN0369.jpg


Briefly, the Air Arms S400MPR-FT is a clone of the Air Arms S400MPR 10 Meter match gun but with higher velocity/power as its designed for the longer range Field Target competitions instead of 10 meter match competitions... The S400MPR-FT is amazingly accurate, with it, for me as a new precision airgun shooter, when shooting it, I have managed to win a few targets and manage to place in the top three finishing positions with it on more than one occasion.

A couple of the strong points of the Air Arms S400MPR-FT airgun as a first gun is its shoot ability right from the box and its top notch trigger. This trigger is a three lever trigger design and is fully adjustable for either single stage or two stage operation at very sensitive trigger pressure levels in the 1 to 1.5 oz. range which is ideal for benchrest shooting.

The only accessory that I would recommend for a first time user, is to contact Jeff Madison at www.mwerksllc.com for a front rest plate for the S400MPR-FT. Jeff does not list this plate in his listing of plates he makes however he made an excellent one for me that works great. This plate is machined from a solid block of aluminum, is 3" wide, and comes with T-nuts that fit the accessory rail on the underside of the forearm of the MPR stock. With this plate, the S400MPR-FT is as solid and stable as any benchrest gun in either a front rest/rear bag setup or in a one piece rest such as the von Ahrens rest that I use:
DSCN0368.jpg

DSCN0367.jpg

DSCN0366.jpg


Of all the rifles I've shot to date both in AGBR matches as well as practice sessions, for an "out of the box" gun, for both quality and accuracy, the AA S400MPR-FT is without a doubt, my favorite...

Happy Shooting,
Mitch & Shadow...
Click to expand...

I have been lurkin around a bit here at BC and decided to check on your hobby, air guns. What a suprise, It is not the old pump benjemins i was exp-ecting to say the least. Jack C
 
Howdy Jack,

Good to hear from you...

I'm not sure I know what all guns the catagory "old pump benjemins" covers however there is a fellow in Eastern NY State that comes to our matches that shoots a RWS 54 and has set several records with it. He often shoots in the mid 240's of a possible 250 score with it...

Happy Shooting,
Mitch & Shadow...
 
Hi Mitch , seasons greetings. The RWS 54 is a contra piston type unit ( 2 pistons spring driven, one is a slave and acts to negate the recoil of the other). The old Benjimen/ Sheridan units are pneumatic, 1-8 strokes to charge the the pressure vessel contained with in. The Benny is a 177 or 22 cal unit the Sheridan is a 20. In the old days two seperate companies, all one now.
 
ShadowChaser said:
Howdy Jack,

Good to hear from you...

I'm not sure I know what all guns the catagory "old pump benjemins" covers however there is a fellow in Eastern NY State that comes to our matches that shoots a RWS 54 and has set several records with it. He often shoots in the mid 240's of a possible 250 score with it...

Happy Shooting,
Mitch & Shadow...
Click to expand...

Well i have a lot of reading and catching up to do! thanks for all the info, Jack C
 
Blades, your description of the RWS 54

More accurately describes the RWS /Diana Model 75 10M Match rifles, which is proll the model you meant.

The Model 54 is a high powered single piston rifle that (also) has greatly reduced recoil by means of a system that floats the action in the stock in the manner of the old FWB 300 10M rifle.
 
shadowchaser

Shadowchaser,
how common are .25 inch groups at 100 yards outdoors for a 22lr.
ifldned
 
ifldned said:
Shadowchaser,
how common are .25 inch groups at 100 yards outdoors for a 22lr.
ifldned
Click to expand...

That is a question better asked in the rimfire benchrest forum. However, as I also shoot rimfire benchrest, its my experience that groups that size with a .22LR at 100 yds are not very common...
 
Air Rifle Benchrest set up

ShadowChaser said:
Hi Ray,
I couldn't agree with you more however I see Saturday as the catalyst and evolutionary step of a plan several months in the making rather than as an instant success...

Coming home Saturday after shooting Paul's Theoben and picking up my Chinese air rifle on my own indoor range quickly put everything back in perspective...

The good thing about Saturday was it being the catalyst I needed to push me over the edge as far as the decision making process of my plan to get involved with AGBR and as they say, the rest is now hinged on the arrival of the brown box truck and how well I have made the choices of the items I have selected... Only time will tell...

As to costly equipment, I'm no stranger to that, I like quality equipment, you can get an idea of where I'm coming from here:

http://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=244608

http://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=247306

The following link takes you to a thread that I added some pictures and comments:

http://rimfireshooting.com/index.php?showtopic=2147&st=0


This last was my project gun for last fall...

Also, I recognize my success on Saturday quite realistically I believe, its going to take a lot of hard work for me to be able to repeat that success with all new gear... However I am optimistic that at some point in the future it will happen again and if it doesn't, I will not be disappointed, I am all too familiar with the variables along the way... One big variable for me will be learning how to read wind flags better for out door shooting, that is my Achilles tendon at this point... But now that I'm fully retired, I have the time to put into practice and learning...

Thanks for your interest and happy shooting,

Mitch & Shadow...
Click to expand...

G'day From Australia I have a FWB P70 but looking to get a 12 ftb Rapid Air TM Benchrest. A a number of our top RBA shooter have ordered them to qualify for the 2015 worlds. A number had Air arm and are going for the Rapid air Tm Benchrest, talk to Bill Collaris on this site he is a world clas shooter and great Bloke, He is one of the group that is getting the Rapid TM's I have Shoot Harry Fullers TM 1000 and it is world class thats is why I am looking ? saving for a TM. I am also a 52 Win man 2 D's 1 E & 1 B- regards Phill
 
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Phyl thanks for the accolades mate :eek: to be clear the air rifles we have ordered are the RAW BM500 in Lightweight .177 for LV Class as that is what we mostly shoot down here, though also looking at th HV Version for the future in .22, the BM seems is specifically built for benchrest, in saying that there is nothing wrong with any of the others listed here and the Air Arms new super gun is being released soon if not already out that will be interesting. Martin Rutherford is the guy to deal with at RAW an absolute pleasure to deal with.
 
I keeep looking

for a rifle in the $400 to $500 range that is a good platform to get folks started, a rifle that is user friendly and reasonably accurate with a good light trigger and adaptable for either Benchrest or Field Target. I think the cost of rifles is a major hurdle for getting more new people involved. I know I swallowed pretty hard when I bought my EV2, not knowing if there would actually ever be real matches to attend, etc. To that end, I'm still not sure there will be.

I can see all sorts of possibilities but the Makers must get involved here is we are to ever have something more affordable for those interested, IMHO>
 
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