My centerfire friends.

Ben

Mr. Calfee is more than just a fellow shooter. He comes on this Forum, makes statements in the absolute, and more or less tells everybody that untill we finally come around to his way of thinking, we will be sitting in the mediocre cheap seats.
All of that from someone who doesn't even shoot Centerfire Benchrest.
The only reason it is of any concern to us is because this Forum represents a place where shooters can come and get the real scoop on Centerfire Benchrest. These shooters are ready to spend their time and money on what they learn here. It is our responsibility to see that if someone is going to demand to be believed, sooner or later they need to offer more than just ideas.
I am sorry that the proof we demand is a little stringent. But, in our world, the thing that counts is how ideas play out and perform in the real world of Competition.......jackie
 
With all due respect

benconrad said:
I been reading this site for 2 years. I followed all the tuner postings. There is some rudeness by people that is not called for. I think if Jack will re read what he said and explain why it was not a rude comment to a fellow shooter then Ill pull off my post. For some reason some shooters think they are the best. I didn't read their names in the big shoots, period, winning or not and I read PS and NBRSA news both.
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Jackie was not being rude---Just telling it like it is. As previously stated, you probally dont know all of the history.I have shot next to and shared benches with Jackie and he is one tuff competitor,has plenty of wins and is almost always in the top third.He has done as much experimenting in our disicipline as anyone and knows of what he speaks. He has tried many different aids and techiniques and knows what works. If you had been shooting with us you would know what I mean
 
Jerry Dailey said:
Jackie was not being rude---Just telling it like it is. As previously stated, you probally dont know all of the history.I have shot next to and shared benches with Jackie and he is one tuff competitor,has plenty of wins and is almost always in the top third.He has done as much experimenting in our disicipline as anyone and knows of what he speaks. He has tried many different aids and techiniques and knows what works. If you had been shooting with us you would know what I mean
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It was still put rudely. Since when does how well a shooter shoots have to do with being respectful. Does this mean only top quality-the greatest- need apply:confused: IS it only for hof shooters:confused: Is this Jack hof shooter:confused:
 
Hal D

I have no fixation with anybody on this forum.Mr Calfee came here and told everyone how to properly set-up a tuner but they would rather argue than do the testing.I even made an offer to Gene to supply the tuner but never even got a response.
We have one poster who thinks MrCalfee should give him personal blueprints on a particular combination without doing any leg work at all.
I am actually not to impressed with alot of the posters here whom I thought had it altogether.
I actually believe some of the posters here wouldn't get it if Mr Calfee built them a complete rifle.
His stopped muzzle type tuner is really very easy to set-up and tune if you read his posts.
Lynn
 
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Lynn,
I may have missed your post on this, but have you, or anyone you know of built a muzzle stopping tuner/barrel setup for a 10.5# 6PPC that has done what has been claimed could be done? (serious question) I for one would like to see some pictures of targets shot with different loads that all grouped without touching the tuner.
 
Lynn said:
I have no fixation with anybody on this forum.Mr Calfee came here and told everyone how to properly set-up a tuner but they would rather argue than do the testing.I even made an offer to Gene to supply the tuner but never even got a response.
We have one poster who thinks MrCalfee should give him personal blueprints on a particular combination without doing any leg work at all.
I am actually not to impressed wit alot of the posters here whom I tought had it altogether.
I actually believe some of the posters here wouldn't get it if Mr Calfee built them a complete rifle.
His stopped muzzle type tuner is really very easy to set-up and tune if you read his posts.
Lynn
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Lynn,

I have no idea if Mr Calfee's tuner design will work in centerfire rifles, although I have no reason to doubt that it can. One thing I do know is that it will be extremely difficult to set up a LV(10.5lb) rifle with a tuner that weighs around a pound. I am struggling currently to make weight with a tuner less than half that weight. I've done it, but I've had to alter my setup drastically. This is the Centerfire BR forum, where we 100/200 guys come to hash out idea's, not the 1000yd or RF forum. What works for us under the rules/weight limits, may have no bearing on what works for LR or RF shooters and vice versa. Believe me, I would love to have a tuner that I never had to touch, but I just don't see it happening yet. I will eventually get around to making a heavy tuner and testing out the possibilities of its use, but for now the equipment I have won't allow its use.
 
Boyd Allen said:
Lynn,
I may have missed your post on this, but have you, or anyone you know of built a muzzle stopping tuner/barrel setup for a 10.5# 6PPC that has done what has been claimed could be done? (serious question) I for one would like to see some pictures of targets shot with different loads that all grouped without touching the tuner.
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Boyd,
I have done it, or I should say I think I have done it in a 17 lb 1000K rifle. I have a recently purchased 10.5 lb PPC that came with 2 barrels. I may experiment with one of those using an out front heavy tuner which if successful could be used as a 13.5 lb rifle. I could put some weight in the butt to keep the rifle balanced. I think it may not be practical to do a heavy tuner for a 10.5 lb rifle. To take that much weight out of the barrel may cause other undesirable issues like barrel overheating. I'm just speculating and would not argue the point one way or another.

Joel
 
Joel,
When you say that you have done it, what exactly do you mean? Do you have a tuner set up that never needs adjustment after finding the proper one? Is your rig more accurate than a tunerless one? What is your tuner doing for you?
Boyd
 
Boyd Allen said:
Joel,
When you say that you have done it, what exactly do you mean? Do you have a tuner set up that never needs adjustment after finding the proper one? Is your rig more accurate than a tunerless one? What is your tuner doing for you?
Boyd
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The rifle I am referring to performed very well in the 4 1K competitive events it was used. At 100 yards loads varying as much as 75 fps all go into a nice little bughole. This tuner is a muzzle brake tuner combination. The overall length is about 4 inches with the first 2 inches near the muzzle being a muzzle brake. The moveable weight is 4 oz. and the other part is 5 oz. so the whole tuner/muzzle brake weighs 9 oz. The barrel is a PA taper barrel (29" long). This arrangement moves the "dead spot" to the muzzle the best I can tell listing to the barrel when "ringing" it. The adjustment is 32 threads per inch and just 1/4 turn (.008") of movement makes a very noticeable difference in the group. It was really surprising to me that such a small amount of movement has such great effect. I have installed a similar tuner/brake on another rifle but have not had a chance to take it out for testing.
 
I wouldn't think 9oz was enough for one of Calfee's heavy tuners. He uses more weight than that on those wimpy rimfire barrels.
 
Roy in NC said:
I wouldn't think 9oz was enough for one of Calfee's heavy tuners. He uses more weight than that on those wimpy rimfire barrels.
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Roy,
Here's a quote from a rimfire shooter recently "Interesting side note: the heavy barreled Hall Took less weight to tune then the lighter barrel ULA. I’m still trying to figure that one out."
I suspected all along that it may take a heavier tuner on a lighter contour barrel but I personally have not had a chance to prove it. This seems to be what this rimfire shooter experienced when tuning 2 different barrels of different contour. What do you think? I know my long heavy 1K BR barrels don't seem to need as much weight as the shorter .8" rimfire barrels. Given enough time to experiment we'll figure this out.

Joel
 
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Joel,

Thanks for the info. I just finished a new 8oz adjustable tuner to try on my BR rifle. I will try to post a pic when I get the barrel threaded to fit the tuner.

Roy
 
Roy,
Sorry I forgot to add the quote from the rimfire thread. I have now added it to my post.

Also it seems reasonable to me that the further you get the weight in front of the muzzle the less weight will be required. I'm just thinking simple leverage. My tuner movable weight is 3 inches in front of the muzzle because I have the muzzle brake portion first nearest the muzzle. I don't think the distance in front of the muzzle has been addressed in most discusssions on the forums. Any thoughts in this regard.
 
I thought along the same line as you. You could get by with less weight by extending further beyond the muzzle. The first tuners I tried extended about 4-5" beyond the muzzle. I quickly found out that these were a royal pain when cleaning, which we do A LOT of in short range BR. Patches sticking in the bore of the tuner, solvent buildup, etc. My current tuners are designed to work behind the muzzle. 6-8 oz tuners are still effective on a LV contour barrel behind the muzzle.
 
Tuner for 1K Light Gun

Attached is a picture of the tuner I just built for a rifle that Charles Ellertson is building. The moveable weight portion may be reduced in length if required to properly tune the barrel. This type tuner - muzzlebrake is removed during cleaning just as any muzzle brake is normally removed. You just place a rod through the muzzle brake portion to use as a lever to tighten and loosen the device.
 

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  • Tuner - muzzle brake.zip
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Nice work, Joel! I really wouldn't want to take it off 15 times a day if we could use muzzle breaks though ( 10 matches + practice ).
 
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