Pete Wass
Well-known member
I find most often
The area just below the shoulder/ case body junction is where a lot of the tightness comes from. For some reason, this area seems to expand more or doesn't spring back as much as the other areas.
I have a number of barrel stub gauges. I use them. I guess for a person who can't acurately use their measuring tools the "Feel" method probably isn't a good thing, in retrospect.
For only measuring headspace, A stub gauge could be made up by drilling a hole through a piece of round stock and beveling an area on one end that the shoulder would seat on. As long as everything is reasonably square, I think the thing would be workable. I also think one of the comparitors that are secured to the caliper jaws, with big enough hole for the case neck to fit through could be used. It won't be as accurate as a gauge made by one's Gunsmith but it will be close enough I think.
The area just below the shoulder/ case body junction is where a lot of the tightness comes from. For some reason, this area seems to expand more or doesn't spring back as much as the other areas.
I have a number of barrel stub gauges. I use them. I guess for a person who can't acurately use their measuring tools the "Feel" method probably isn't a good thing, in retrospect.
For only measuring headspace, A stub gauge could be made up by drilling a hole through a piece of round stock and beveling an area on one end that the shoulder would seat on. As long as everything is reasonably square, I think the thing would be workable. I also think one of the comparitors that are secured to the caliper jaws, with big enough hole for the case neck to fit through could be used. It won't be as accurate as a gauge made by one's Gunsmith but it will be close enough I think.
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chillippr
Guest
I have been shooting my first real benchrest rifle for a little while now. It is a used rifle made with quality components, but there is no headspace "gizzy" for any of the three 6PPC barrels it came with. I'm familiar with measuring techniques, but have only a Stoney Point headspace gauge to set my bump. So far I have not detected any problems. How bad off am I compared to measuring over a dedicated "gizzy"?
Boyd Allen
Active member
You should be just fine with what you have. I have both.
JerrySharrett
Senile Member
As Boyd said, you should be fine with what you have as long as you pay attention to what you are trying to accomplish.
What you are needing to do to make accurate and safe loads is just sizing the brass barely enough to where it will rechamber without disturbing the gun on the bags. If you size too much you are over working the brass and in addition the bad fit in the chamber can cause the bullet to engage the lands irregularly round to round and this amounts to varying bullet seating relative to the chamber.
It is very doubtful, even with commercial factory dies, that you can oversize the brass to an unsafe point. But significantly oversizing, say 0.003" 0 0.006" will work harden and fatigue the brass causing premature failure.
The problem I have with the LNL Hornady/Stony Point/ Whitetail tool is that the shoulder does not always stay in a perfect conical shape. Sometimes the center of the cone swags uneven some since it is not reinforced like the neck/shoulder and body/shoulder intersections. The place on the cartridge shoulder that is engaged by this LNL tool is at that point.
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WHOAHHhhh DAWGieeeee, I just can't let that go! 
Quote......"It is very doubtful, even with commercial factory dies, that you can oversize the brass to an unsafe point. But significantly oversizing, say 0.003" 0 0.006" will work harden and fatigue the brass causing premature failure."......unquote
I gotta' disagree there Jerry, this IS BRC.
For all of you readers out there that haven't yet had this experience, do NOT take over-sizing lightly! Sizing your brass ".003-.006" absolutely WILL cause a head separation within just a few reloads. Fah'GIDDabout fatigue, the friggin' case will pop in half.....
Not might, not maybe, WILL.............It's in every reloading manual on the planet. Some like the Hornady book have nice photo pictorials of the process.
First you'll grow a big ol' donut.....then you'll notice that your cases are looking raggedy on the end and you'll trim them to length and wonder where all that brass came from. Then they'll bust right off at the end. This is precisely why fitted FL dies and custom gizzies exist.
Head separations are like flat tires.............most of the time just "PSsssssss" and a coil of stink. But the odd one that gives you a three-day sunburn outlining your safety glasses is the one you remember. You'll remember it even longer if your WEREN'T wearing those safety glasses ........................
al
Quote......"It is very doubtful, even with commercial factory dies, that you can oversize the brass to an unsafe point. But significantly oversizing, say 0.003" 0 0.006" will work harden and fatigue the brass causing premature failure."......unquote
I gotta' disagree there Jerry, this IS BRC.
For all of you readers out there that haven't yet had this experience, do NOT take over-sizing lightly! Sizing your brass ".003-.006" absolutely WILL cause a head separation within just a few reloads. Fah'GIDDabout fatigue, the friggin' case will pop in half.....
Not might, not maybe, WILL.............It's in every reloading manual on the planet. Some like the Hornady book have nice photo pictorials of the process.
First you'll grow a big ol' donut.....then you'll notice that your cases are looking raggedy on the end and you'll trim them to length and wonder where all that brass came from. Then they'll bust right off at the end. This is precisely why fitted FL dies and custom gizzies exist.
Head separations are like flat tires.............most of the time just "PSsssssss" and a coil of stink. But the odd one that gives you a three-day sunburn outlining your safety glasses is the one you remember. You'll remember it even longer if your WEREN'T wearing those safety glasses ........................
al
JerrySharrett
Senile Member
This is BRC but many who will read this thread are not shooting a BR spec gun. Get a commercial rifle with maximum chamber dimensions (like many AR-AK clones especially) and then get yourself a commercial small base die and you will be closer to 0.008".
The point I am making is that average Joeshooter will be doing considerable massaging of their brass and in most cases their brass will not last over 4-5 reloadings anyhoo. How many hunter/reloaders even own a case length trimmer even though they are shooting cartridges that grow 0.005" ir so per firing?
I wholeheartedly agree with Al on wearing good safety rated shooting glasses, preferrebly with lense of Lexan Polycarbonate.
(pi$$ingcontestoff)
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nonliberal
Guest
Interesting info
I have a question to go along with this. I have been playing around with headspace adjustment and have been getting consistant measurements, but when I chamber the round I notice that some are harder to close the bolt on than others. I started off bumping the shoulder back .0005 then it went to .0010, .0015, and now im up to .002 just to let the bolt close with soft/moderate force. Even though the die is locked down tight each piece of brass "feels" a little different than the next in the chamber (no ejector).
Is this normal? Whats the best way to correct? Is this just springback Im dealing with? They all come out of the chamber the same but dont seem to be resizing exactly the same.
The caliber im seeing this on is a 6br, Lapua brass is on 6 firings now, load is not max but it is on the warm side.
Thanks.
I have a question to go along with this. I have been playing around with headspace adjustment and have been getting consistant measurements, but when I chamber the round I notice that some are harder to close the bolt on than others. I started off bumping the shoulder back .0005 then it went to .0010, .0015, and now im up to .002 just to let the bolt close with soft/moderate force. Even though the die is locked down tight each piece of brass "feels" a little different than the next in the chamber (no ejector).
Is this normal? Whats the best way to correct? Is this just springback Im dealing with? They all come out of the chamber the same but dont seem to be resizing exactly the same.
The caliber im seeing this on is a 6br, Lapua brass is on 6 firings now, load is not max but it is on the warm side.
Thanks.
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