Sorting brass by water volume..HOW?

I think the reason so few short range guys sort cases by capacity is the same reason so many long range shooters don’t. And that reason is that affordable scales capable of doing the job weren’t common till only recently. And it is not so much fun to do either.
 
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al,
how does one tune for a variation in case to case volume when throwing charges that vary by plus or minus 0.2 ??? thats has to be one large sweet spot in the tune ...

if ya see my point....
mike

Doesn't matter the root cause of the velocity variation (powder charge/case volume/primer variation/moon phase) it's just that short rangers use barrel whip to compensate for velocity variations.

Obviously total effect of +- a couple tenths PLUS case volume variation still stays within the compensation parameters.



IMO



:)





al
 
Well, there is alot of good info out there on this issue.

My main intent for the question has to do with the variations in brass manufacturing. The cause for some of the variation in brass weight has to do with the area of the extractor cut. If this varries, then the weight of the overall brass will varry.
There are other factors as well, like overall brass thickness, base thickness, primer pocket consistency.

if one weight sorts brass by just putting the shell on the scale and sort them that way, that doesn't address consistent internal capacity, which is where all the magic happens.

So, how do you measure the internal capacity? If you don't use the same single item to block the flash hole, then you lose consistency in measurement.

i realize that it can't be perfect, and maybe it doesn't matter. Another side to this is shell handling at the bench. If a case isn't filled to a compressed load and there is some air space in the case, then how the powder lays when you throw it into the gun may affect velocity.
Assuming a similar airspace in each shell, then dependant on how the shell was handled may have the powder lay to the rear of the shell, the front near the bulltet, flat on the bottom, or some variation of all of these. that would then theoretically affect when the powder gets hit with the primer flash and begins it's deflagration process (burning).

OR...Does it matter at all???? There have been products in the past to put in a shell over the powder to keep it in place that claimed increased accuracy. Where did that ever end up? Any testing?

BUT, if everything in the sorting, loading, handling, etc process isn't the same with eliminating as many variables as possible, then why do any of it to any degree of madness?

Wolfdawg
 
well you posted on a BENCHREST FORUM...so we will play by benchrest reality.

you will find most br loads are so close to full case that the air space/powder position is a non-issue.

you DO NOT need the same object for the primer pocket......you need to fill the hole and then weigh the case, add water and weigh again. the difference is the water volume.

mike
 
if a benchrest case is fully prepped...trimed to length, flash hole deburred, primer pocket uniformed, sized( fire formed, fl what ever) then the outside of the case is uniform,with the noted exception of the really odd case where ONE PERSON found extractor cuts not uniform. so when one weighs a case, in nearly every case it is representative of the case volume. again read my lips..we are talking benchrest competion brass.......................
i have not done enough work with 220 russian brass to have a data set that says it varies by X AMOUNT. the fact that some suppliers sell weight sorted 220/6ppc brass, means there is a noticable variation in lots of lapua 220 russian brass.
so this winter ,with nothing to do...why not weight sort your brass and see what happens ???.....
of course your gonna need a decent scale...oppssssssssssss

mike in co
do not whine at me about brass density variation...bs is my answer.
cartridge brass is AN ALLOY. it is commonly listed as 70/30. i am sure each make fine tunes thier alloy.......but no variations in the same case lots.
 
I have long felt

that cases were only the container that holds the things that truly matter to accuracy, not unlike a soda bottle, beer bottle, lipstick tube or medicine bottle. I have over 1000 prepared match cases for three different rifles. Is it realistic to sort them? Do I see big differences in the way the loaded rounds perform? NO, never have in the many years I have been shooting.

Spent the time learning to read your windflags. That will provide you with a helluva lot more accuracy in the end.
 
peter,
how much shooting will you be doing this winter in lovely maine ?
gonna have some down time ??
so why not prove us all wrong, sort those cases and shoot them and see how it goes.
i'm not sure that 330 per gun is statistically enough brass....but do it.
find/beg/borrow a very good scale and sort them......
prove us wrong....
mike
 
Sorting Brass by Water for Weight Variation

At the Nationals in Midland I saw Ron Hoehn leaving his loading trailer with a bag and quickly get into his car being very sneaky about the whole thing. So I followed him and he pulled in the local laundry mate. I got out my binoculars and watched him dump out a bunch of ppc brass on the counter, and then I saw him pull out a scale and fill each brass case full of water and weight it and put the ones he weighed in a different piles. When he was done he took and put the brass in separate washing machines then when they were done he put them in separate dryers, put them back in there boxes and went back to the range.
The next day I saw a big sign on his loading trailer “ON SALE WEIGHED BRASS”

That’s my story and I’m sticking to it.

Have a great day.
 
tom ..
thats what that desert air and california politics does to ones sleep...you have been having dreams again......
i told you...stay away from those catus buttons....
mike in co
 
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