So just why does the PPC shoot so well?

afrench said:
Re: loaded round clearance

it's kind of hard to see in static pictures but...

left 2 cases, ~1 thou clearance per side,

right 2 cases, about 2 tenths more clearance per side.

Click to expand...

The ones on the left only have one firing? That doesn't agree with what I typically see, if so. Burn rate and neck tension may also play a role.
 
Mike, no. the ones on the left have 3 firings, the right, 2.

the left cases never gave the sine wave, just the flat line you see.
 
Ted Manning

Ted Manning uses brass w/no neck tension,, no matter what powder.. T-8208,, t-32,, VV 133. I've witnessed Ted ,, winning 4 gun , 2 gun @ 100 & 200,, and win several class 1st place aggs. Twice , I've seen him win 4 gun agg @ 100, w/4 different barrels on the same rifle,,, all w/-0- neck tension. Many shooters in the southeast region have been witness to same.
Fretka said:
When starting out recently with load development I found what most already knew........the PPC likes high pressures and high neck tension and possibly jamming the lands. Really makes me wonder what the mechanics are.

My guess is that the burning process inside the case has progressed quite far before we get bullet movement into the bore. It would seem that we get a positive, increasing gas pressure wave early which accelerates the bullet all the way to the muzzle without undergoing any " slowing-accelerating" jerkiness to the bullet travel. In other words the reservoir of gas pressure from burnt charge is enough to provide smooth, even positive pressure without oscillating positive/negative waves caused by pressure spikes from a large unburnt reservoir of powder that is still building as the bullet exits the muzzle.

Whaddaya think?
Click to expand...
 
I don't mean to hijack the thread or anything, but real down & dirty; what does carbon blow-by in one form or another mean other than slow sealing? What is the sine wave telling?
Thanks
 
mikecr said:
I don't mean to hijack the thread or anything, but real down & dirty; what does carbon blow-by in one form or another mean other than slow sealing? What is the sine wave telling?
Thanks
Click to expand...

Mike, here is what Mr. Boyer had to say about it in his book. page 149.

"Another way to tell if the case necks are too thick is to look at the carbon deposit on the outside of a fired case. if fired at least 3 times and there is a clear horizontal line of carbon going all the way around the middle of the neck, then the neck is too tight and may be causing unexplained flyers. a wavy pattern indicates that, as the bolt lugs settle on the receiver lugs, the brass has contracted enough for some gas to escape."
 
HFV said:
Ted Manning uses brass w/no neck tension,, no matter what powder.. T-8208,, t-32,, VV 133. I've witnessed Ted ,, winning 4 gun , 2 gun @ 100 & 200,, and win several class 1st place aggs. Twice , I've seen him win 4 gun agg @ 100, w/4 different barrels on the same rifle,,, all w/-0- neck tension. Many shooters in the southeast region have been witness to same.
Click to expand...

And witness to HFV and CCBW doing that same no-neck-tension loading.

The first time I ever shot beside Ted was at Roanoke, I was shooting a LPRB Panda and he was shooting a black action RBRP (40X?). As I was loading my 3rd round, shooting fast, Ted was taking his bolt out. If Ted would have shot the whole BR circuit like TB I'm confident he would be way up there in HOF points.

But then again, what does TB know about carbon rings? He only has as many HOF points as the next 4 HOF members combined??


.
 
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Y'all know I'm mostly a "good barrel" guy, but there's something to this carbon deposit thing. I've seen a single exception with a barrel I had but it wasn't a clear exception. I was kinda glad when that barrel gave out because it had to have new cases every match and that just wasn't my kind of barrel. The carbon ring would form as if it were made purposely - a clean dark line about a third down the neck and absolutely nothing past that line. That barrel would shoot well enough to win two out of three matches. When it didn't shoot well, it was awful!

I'll add that terrible barrels produce fired cases that look the same as great barrels and I suppose we're talking about the load and neck clearance here....but I still don't know why that barrel produced cases that looked like that.
 
HFV said:
Ted Manning uses brass w/no neck tension,, no matter what powder.. T-8208,, t-32,, VV 133. I've witnessed Ted ,, winning 4 gun , 2 gun @ 100 & 200,, and win several class 1st place aggs. Twice , I've seen him win 4 gun agg @ 100, w/4 different barrels on the same rifle,,, all w/-0- neck tension. Many shooters in the southeast region have been witness to same.
Click to expand...


Another beautiful theory slain by an ugly fact!

I'd be interested to know what primers he was using.
 
HFV said:
Ted Manning uses brass w/no neck tension,, no matter what powder.. T-8208,, t-32,, VV 133. I've witnessed Ted ,, winning 4 gun , 2 gun @ 100 & 200,, and win several class 1st place aggs. Twice , I've seen him win 4 gun agg @ 100, w/4 different barrels on the same rifle,,, all w/-0- neck tension. Many shooters in the southeast region have been witness to same.
Click to expand...


Some years ago, they had a Registered BR match, one time only, at a range in Thibadeaux La. One particular shooter was doing very well, (for the life of me, I can't remember his name, big heavy set fellow in overalls), but in one match, as he was going to the line, he dropped his cartridge block. Quite a few of the bullets just fell out of the loaded cases. Everybody took notice.

Maybe someone else who was there knows who I am referring too.
 
There's some standard stuff we all do and have done in an attempt to shoot well. You have to NOT do something for a whole weekend, when it counts, to prove to yourself that it's not worth doing. First, you have to believe somewhat that it's not worth doing or you're wasting time. Secondly, last place is probably doing the same stuff that mid-pack and first place is doing so that should tell you something.
 
jackie schmidt said:
Some years ago, they had a Registered BR match, one time only, at a range in Thibadeaux La. One particular shooter was doing very well, (for the life of me, I can't remember his name, big heavy set fellow in overalls), but in one match, as he was going to the line, he dropped his cartridge block. Quite a few of the bullets just fell out of the loaded cases. Everybody took notice.

Maybe someone else who was there knows who I am referring too.
Click to expand...


I was shooting beside Lester B at Kelblys one time and he dropped his loading block off the bench...same thing...he grinned and said don't tell anybody.

.
 
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