scratch on neck with Redding bushing? why?

I had the same problem....

...on the first Harrell's die I got. Apparently it was made to size a turned neck, and it left these marks on my unturned 6BR brass when I tried to size it. I just used a drill and, holding the bit in my hand, went inside the die and gave it a little twist...cleaned right up.

Jim
 
Bjs6

Bryce you can size a 6BR neck in a 22BR die if you simply swap out the bushing.That is how much clearance there is.My dies are Redding Competition Seaters.
Good luck.
Lynn
 
Bushing Problem

This past weekend Jackie Schmidt was testing the new Beggs
case at Tomball. He borrowed one of my Redding bushings
and had a similar problem with scratches.

I think the problem was that Redding machined the bevel on same side
the numbers are printed on. It should be the other end.

Jackie fixed the problem by inserting the bushing number
side down. It fixed the problem.

He also said it was a isolated incident, but after reading
this tread I'm not so sure.

Maybe Jackie will chime in tonight and add some insight
to this problem.
 
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I still say the necks need to be turned. I just opened a new box of Lapua 6BR brass and randomly selected one case. The neck had a minimum thickness of .0125 and a maximum of .0138. This produces a neck which is not concentric. The bushing is trying to push the case neck to one side so that it can line up the neck with the bushing. This is not going to happen easily. Thus,the neck should be turned before I size it down.
 
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All the Redding bushes I have (about 25 I guess) have a nice radius on both ends of what is supposed to be a parallel hole with no taper. To the naked eye there appears to be no difference at either end.
 
Here Is What I Found

Last week end, while getting ready to test the .269 neck 6mm Beggs,I discovered that I had left my .265 neck bushing at home. Vic Smith had one, the yellow nitrided one, and loaned it to me.
I installed it, numbers up, and sized all 12 cases. They all had similiar "splines" on them as you seein the photo, although not quite that bad. I took the bushing out, and it appeared to be clean and burr free. But, I noticed that the side with the numbers had a much larger radius than the other side. I installed the bushing "numbers down",and the problem was solved.
The best I can figure, Redding miss stamped the die. It works perfect when installed up side down.........jackie
 
At first, I was leaning to the side of the guys who say it must be dragging in the die body, because the scratches are so far down the case........then I went back and re-read the original post. He states that 5 or 6 cases went through before the scratches started to appear. It sounds like the entry side of the bushing might have a sharp edge, which picked up enough brass after sizing several cases to cause the grooves. I don't think it has to do with the starting chamfer, because the scratches are very shallow right at the mouth, and get bigger in a very short distance.

-Dave-:)
 
rcheek said:
I still say the necks need to be turned. I just opened a new box of Lapua 6BR brass and randomly selected one case. The neck had a minimum thickness of .0125 and a maximum of .0138. This produces a neck which is not concentric. The bushing is trying to push the case neck to one side so that it can line up the neck with the bushing. This is not going to happen easily. Thus,the neck should be turned before I size it down.
Click to expand...

The bushing should be floating in it's bore, so it would have no trouble at all accomodating a neck that is not perfectly centered on the case body. Also, I see no relationship between the concentricity of the neck wall and whether the neck is coaxial to the case body or not.

Even if the bushing were in a fixed position within the die (it isn't supposed to be), and we were to assume that the inside of the neck is coaxial to the case body (it isn't), that .0013 variance in wall thickness would only put the outside .00065 out of center......that sure ain't going to upset things to cause those marks. And if it did, they wouldn't be even all the way around the case.

-Dave-:)
 
That was my other thought Dave.

" One possibility is if the bush is used with no lube and has picked up brass and the brass adhering to the inside of the bush is doing the damage. "

Like you said, having read the original post again, if it did it only after 5 - 6 cases it seems that brass must have picked up on the bush for some reason, either no lube or a sharp/rough edge on the bush or both.

You'd hope that if the bush was rough or sharp and/or had brass on it the poster might have noticed that and mentioned it. ????

Bryce
 
A Few Questions

Why do some of you guys think the scratches go too far down the neck? How far are you sizing the necks on your cases? Also how are seeing the scratches deeper on the bottom than the top from the picture provided?
Lynn
 
Lynn said:
Why do some of you guys think the scratches go too far down the neck? How far are you sizing the necks on your cases? Also how are seeing the scratches deeper on the bottom than the top from the picture provided?
Lynn
Click to expand...

Because a bushing die typically does not size the entire length of the neck. These ones going as far down as they do supports the idea of a sharp entry into the bushing...the bigger the radius on the bushing, the shorter the length of the sized area.

The neck diameter is larger near the shoulder than it is at the mouth....that is why the scratches are deeper toward the shoulder.

-Dave-:)
 
Dave Short

Daves thanks for your reply.I only shoot longrange and always adjust my Redding dies so they size the neck just like in the picture.I never knew you guys only sized a small portion of your necks.We try and keep the boattail to bearing length junction about 0.050 in front of the neck/shoulder junction on a fresh barrel and then chase the lands.
I also thought you were seeing something in the picture that actualy showed deeper scratches rather than basing it off of a very small amount of taper so they must be deeper theory.
Good Luck
Lynn
 
wow, 3 pages! thanks for all the input and help.



1.the bushing was floating in the die.

2.die body is ok, when neck goes through die without bushing, it does not touch the shoulder part.

3. redding bushing IS tapered! I can tell it by turning the bushing upside down.

4. number on the bushing has nothing to do with which size is up or down. it is randomly stamped on. (my .267 and .268 can prove this)

5. brass is used in a 272 chamber, I don't turn neck.

I kinda fix the problem by 1. turning the bushing up side down, still scratches, but the area near shoulder gets better. 2. polishing the bushing, I used dremel tool. 3. using case lube, I don't have neck wax. the neck looks normal now.

thanks again!
 
First off, Redding buttons are not tapered, the sides of the bushing are parallel. Wilson bushings are the ones with the tapered walls. Looks like you have a die with an under sized clearance hole. Like someone earlier suggested, run a case in with the bushing out and you should'nt get any mark.
 
Gerry Jajowka

Gerry if you read the post before yours he has solved the problem and it has nothing at all to do with the clearance hole.
Lynn
 
Simple test. If it will not go in the die full length without the bushing in the die it is the die body. If it DOES go full length with no marking it is the button. I have never seen a Redding die body, when used with the marked caliber, with the neck hole to small. AND the marks don't go clear to the shoulder/neck junction. They stop at about the bottom of the bushing hole. Simple test, easy fix either way.

Mike Swartz
 
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Scratched Neck

i can tell you exactly what the problem is. It is not the bushings. The die you have does not have enough opening in the the neck area before it enters the bushing. Lap out the opening and your problems are solved.
 
Three of the four posts after he said the case neck clears the inside of the die and that he found the bushing to be the problem.............we're still looking for the problem and focusing on the clearance hole in the die.

And...............in his original post he said the problem didn't show up until he'd sized a half-dozen cases.

Stay after this problem a little longer, and it'll be so fixed it'll be broken again...............

-Dave-:)
 
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