Odd problem with a trigger

D

DSM

Chuck
I am having a trigger issue that I can't pinpoint. It does it maybe once in 20 rounds.

It's hard to explain but will give it a try. What it is doing seems like a delay when it fires. It almost reminds me of how a flintlock fires, but much faster though. I can feel it happening and when that shot fires, its like an inch or so from my group. Its very annoying and unpredictable. I've had the trigger out and cleaned it. I can dry fire it over and over again and can't replicate the problem.

Anyone have similar experience with a trigger? Any suggestions?
 
A few more details are required.

Which rifle and trigger for a start ?


Glenn:)
 
It's a custom trigger on my center grip xp-100. Come to think of it al, it may be the primer. I had the same exact thing happen a couple times along with misfires in my one Panda using Wolf primers. I totally quit using the primers in my Pandas and they have been sitting on the shelf. I decided to try them out in my 6BR XP and seemed to work ok and was not giving me any misfires. I doubt any groundhogs will mind a hang fire,lol. I figure I have 5k of them and might as well use them. I should run a different primer to see if I can isolate the problem.
 
There was certainly at least one lot of Wolf primers that had issues. I had about a 10% FTF with one action/chambering (BAT/.30BR), and about 4% with a different one -- a Factory Savage in .223. Others have reported this too.
 
Is the sear releasing or hanging up? I had a trigger that use to hang up. The problem was not enough trigger back lash.
I would pull the trigger and it would delay letting off. Is that whats happening?
 
DSM
The Russian Primer needs to be sensitised for them to work properly. After the primer seats intro the pocket you need to seat a bit more and get that crush for ignition.

Clarence
 
GerryM said:
Is the sear releasing or hanging up? I had a trigger that use to hang up. The problem was not enough trigger back lash.
I would pull the trigger and it would delay letting off. Is that whats happening?
Click to expand...

Yes, sounds like what is happening to me, but not sure if its the primers or the trigger itself. I will try a different primer to see if it is indeed the primer.

How do you adjust trigger lash?
 
trigger lash?

Trigger movement after the trigger fires.

You need always need some because of temperature change.

In cold weather hunting the parts will shrink enough to change that clearance.

Some back this adjustment out all the way and then the trigger doesn't hit a hard stop.

If you have to ask "how" then it sounds like you need a good gunsmith .

Glenn
 
That problem Stonewall refers to in line three...............

has been cured since I started using this:

http://www.metal-wear.com/

Wrap it and pad it well, pay the shipping, and drop in 5 bucks. It's the cheapest fix I've found.

It works. And if you can install and adjust a trigger by reading the instructions, you shouldn't need a gunsmith.

Cryo, plus cleaning the interior of the bolt, looking for fragments, debris, etc. first, will go a LOOOooong way to getting things carefree in the trigger/weather dept; Now don't forget, in the summertime, all those trigger parts that were shrinking in the cold, are now expanding in the heat. Proper cryo stabilizes the materials, ending those problems, and Rick is a good guy to know, he supports the shooters with prizes on a 'space available' basis. Get it in by Thursday, it will most likely be shipped on Tuesday, unless it gets put in on a Helium run, )chill( but they're few and far between. :D

And, he doesn't charge cards until he's ready to SHIP! :eek:
 
I have about 5000 Wolf primers that are complete junk, I'ver had hangs with 3 different powders in three different chamberings.

al
 
brian roberts said:
has been cured since I started using this:

http://www.metal-wear.com/

Wrap it and pad it well, pay the shipping, and drop in 5 bucks. It's the cheapest fix I've found.

It works. And if you can install and adjust a trigger by reading the instructions, you shouldn't need a gunsmith.

Cryo, plus cleaning the interior of the bolt, looking for fragments, debris, etc. first, will go a LOOOooong way to getting things carefree in the trigger/weather dept; Now don't forget, in the summertime, all those trigger parts that were shrinking in the cold, are now expanding in the heat. Proper cryo stabilizes the materials, ending those problems, and Rick is a good guy to know, he supports the shooters with prizes on a 'space available' basis. Get it in by Thursday, it will most likely be shipped on Tuesday, unless it gets put in on a Helium run, )chill( but they're few and far between. :D

And, he doesn't charge cards until he's ready to SHIP! :eek:
Click to expand...

What you seem to be saying Brian is that IYO freezing steel changes it's expansion coefficient?

"proper cryo stabilizes the materials"

Is this what you're claiming?

al
 
What brand of trigger do you Have? The popular one most of us use? Jewel?
It's called the over travel adjustment screw. It works in conjuction with the sear.
 
Yes Al, I'd guess that's......

the only conclusion I can come up with. It has ended the problem of follow-down (as you close the bolt) in the colder winter weather. Even down to 11 below, which ain't much, compared to some other areas of the country, I know. We have had some recent winters w/lower temps, but there hasn't been much organized shooting in that weather, so I hadn't the opportunity to check on it in lower temps. I figured that if there was a problem at +20, w/a clean trigger, and all that was done was to have it processed, and the next time it was checked after installation was during similar temps w/no problems, and checked AGAIN at -11, and no problems, I'd think the "problem" was gone.

As far as Jewell triggers, no, I haven't used one of those, yet, something else, new, always seems to get in the way ;).

I've even used it on the standard Shilens I've installed, they work well, too.
I also noted BEFORE I had installed a couple Canjar LPs, that it solved the same problem in the standard 700 Remington triggers friends had complained about. That problem never came back again; and I know the quality of the raw materials in the Remington triggers, probably isn't anywhere near even the standard Shilen.

Just MY experience. Almost forgot, I do know what the OTA screw is, I use it, too. ;)
 
Speaking of triggers:

I have often wondered why someone hasn't or didn't buy out Canjar and continue making them. They made triggers for some rifle models that don't exist elsewhere and I believe there is still a market for triggers like the Canjar.

Also, I wonder why someone hasn't made copies of some of the Kenyon triggers. They would or could bring a Hansom Ransom I believe. ( for all those shops out there who are down on work)
 
Primers that are not fully seated can cause that "click.......bang." Lee auto-prime tools that don't get periodic lube on that white-metal cam are notorious for wearing and causing this.
Also Re: Cryo treatment altering the thermal expansion rates?.....I do not believe that for one minute, and if one does the thermal expansion calculations, the dimensional changes over a 100 ' temp differential are extremely small.
 
The simple truth is that no one could properly diagnose the problem with the information that has been given. The best that can be achieved are suggestions areas to investigate. One thing that has not come up is that mid grip pistols have additional linkage that a rear grip or rifle does not have. Also, do the primers of the regular an delayed shots look identical?
 
I am happy to report back that the problem is indeed the Wolf primers. I swapped them out for CCI 450s and shot 20 rounds with superb results. It's a shame I have over 4k primer that are crap!

The winds were 8 gusting to 32 and switching. Shooting under 3 Graham flags. I did manage a 3 shot group in the high 1's and a 10 shot group in the high 3's. Not bad for a pistol shooting off my BR rest in windy conditions. Oh, to boot, i'm shooting Hornady 65 V-Max straight from the box.
 
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