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Big Al
Guest
Maybe you folks should start a new thread and title it "The ZEN Of Rimfire" ?
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KEN HARPER
Guest
If that's the "case" then why is there so much variation in ammo from lot to lot when obviously the manufacturers buy or make brass in lots that number in the zillions? I had a problem with erratic ignition in one gun that was caused by the firing pin dragging on the trigger sear (I think I said that right). The gunsmith did some magic to the firing pin and problem was solved.
Unless of course you realize that there are many actions out there that suffer from insufficent ignition, which is why, I think, Calfee has some interesting new posts in a different thread, which is why it would seem..... you're..... a.......wrong again. Reread some of the stuff in this thread Cec, maybe even think about a couple. Maybe archery?
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pacecil
Guest
Read!!!!!
If all you will simply read what I said....these will stay relatively consistent and as long as a minimum striking force is established in the original action design
The action has to be free of anything that causes insufficient firing pin force. If this is occurring then you have to correct it to get good ignition. Once this is done then it's the characteristics of the case that probably causes problems. Case dimensions affect head space so this has to be factored in.
All of you (even Tim) should realize that all cases will not be identical. Once you understand manufacturing process, especially as it pertains to rim fire cases, you will realize how much variation you can have in that little rim and the priming compound placed in the rim.
I still maintain (although I have no "statistic" to back me up): 90% of ignition problems are case related rather than caused by some fault in the action.
If all you will simply read what I said....these will stay relatively consistent and as long as a minimum striking force is established in the original action design
The action has to be free of anything that causes insufficient firing pin force. If this is occurring then you have to correct it to get good ignition. Once this is done then it's the characteristics of the case that probably causes problems. Case dimensions affect head space so this has to be factored in.
All of you (even Tim) should realize that all cases will not be identical. Once you understand manufacturing process, especially as it pertains to rim fire cases, you will realize how much variation you can have in that little rim and the priming compound placed in the rim.
I still maintain (although I have no "statistic" to back me up): 90% of ignition problems are case related rather than caused by some fault in the action.
With the action ignition being within the original design parameters. In other words, so long as some factor does not change the designed striking force. What could change it?
Perhaps you should do a bit of homework about what is being done to several actions by some pretty smart folks . You would then realize your usual theoretical BS based on zero first hand knowledge is not correct. You assume most custom actions ignition properties to be relatively constant [your words], they're not.
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pacecil
Guest
Tim said, You assume most custom actions ignition properties to be relatively constant [your words], they're not.
Seems several posters don't agree with you. Obviously if dirt or gunk gets into the bolt things can change. I hope this is not what you think "is being done" by the super clever gunsmiths. Perhaps you can tell us what design feature put in by the original action designer is changed, and also which action is deficient.
Seems several posters don't agree with you. Obviously if dirt or gunk gets into the bolt things can change. I hope this is not what you think "is being done" by the super clever gunsmiths. Perhaps you can tell us what design feature put in by the original action designer is changed, and also which action is deficient.
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pacecil
Guest
Tim...
How come, when you make claim to having some superior knowledge about something or other, you can never back it up. You always just refer back to what others have posted. Of course this always goes along with some stupid remark about me or what I post. You seem to think unless a shooter spends a lot of time at the bench, he can't possibly know anything about guns - or for that matter you don't seem to think he knows about ANYTHING! Now, this is all just an opinion I've formed by reading your posts. If I'm making an unfair judgment then I apologize, I sure don't want to hurt your feelings!
Now as to my experience: I've corrected ignition problems on several guns but not a Turbo or Hall. As I recall it's been only on Winchester, Anschutz, Remington, Stevens, Springfield, Ranger, Marlin. There may have been some others but these are the ones that come to memory. The corrections have consisted of changing entire spring/pin assembly, making a new pin, changing spring, lightening (or increasing weight) of the pin, reshaping the pin tip, changing headspace, and just freeing up motion of the parts by removing burrs, bits of primer, dirt, etc. This does not make me an expert and I'm sure it pales next to your experience . Also, not having worked on the super benchrest actions may disqualify me from making comments on ignition, but it's kinda fun - and I get to see your response, which is always good for a laugh!
How come, when you make claim to having some superior knowledge about something or other, you can never back it up. You always just refer back to what others have posted. Of course this always goes along with some stupid remark about me or what I post. You seem to think unless a shooter spends a lot of time at the bench, he can't possibly know anything about guns - or for that matter you don't seem to think he knows about ANYTHING! Now, this is all just an opinion I've formed by reading your posts. If I'm making an unfair judgment then I apologize, I sure don't want to hurt your feelings!
Now as to my experience: I've corrected ignition problems on several guns but not a Turbo or Hall. As I recall it's been only on Winchester, Anschutz, Remington, Stevens, Springfield, Ranger, Marlin. There may have been some others but these are the ones that come to memory. The corrections have consisted of changing entire spring/pin assembly, making a new pin, changing spring, lightening (or increasing weight) of the pin, reshaping the pin tip, changing headspace, and just freeing up motion of the parts by removing burrs, bits of primer, dirt, etc. This does not make me an expert and I'm sure it pales next to your experience . Also, not having worked on the super benchrest actions may disqualify me from making comments on ignition, but it's kinda fun - and I get to see your response, which is always good for a laugh!
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jGEE
Guest
Whew.... Tim you got told, lol!!
Mr. pacelcil i'm new here and i wuz wondering if you were the guy some like to rag on here...... well i guess your that guy!! keep up the good work, i like learning from "both sides".
joe
Mr. pacelcil i'm new here and i wuz wondering if you were the guy some like to rag on here...... well i guess your that guy!! keep up the good work, i like learning from "both sides".
joe
Well there crankypants I figured I'd refer you to a couple areas that show you that one of the best gunsmiths of .22's alive says and that what is involved in a national level winning BR gun and it's ignition. This was done in the hope that even if your the dumbest SOB on the planet, you might figure out the inference. So taking you at your word..... YOU'VE NEVER SEEN A .22 BR ACTION IN YOU'RE LIFE, and you're now 1 for 455. Hey the good news is that I hear a few guys are gonna build up some custom Marlins for the '09 season, wait by the phone.