Fireforming 6 Dasher methods

Over the weekend I put 8 grains of Clays Uni. in a 6BR to make an improved version, 6BR-DX. I Topped them off with cream of wheat and packed it in with a piece of paper towel. 100 cases, not one problem. Sharp shoulder and all the rest.

I just finished fire forming 100 pieces of 6x47 Lapua. Expanded with a 6.5 mandrel, re-size with a .267 bushing creating a false shoulder, use a small pistol primer with 9 grains of clays, cream of wheat and paper towel. They look and measure exactly as the ones I fireformed with powder and bullets. I'll now expand with a 6mm mandrel trim them all to length and turn them.

It seems to work!
vinny
 
Vinny
I create the false shoulder and use the cream of wheat just like you and they come out fine.

Alinwa
On my cases the false shoulder with a live primer doesn't hold the brass real tight.It holds it a little better than a bullet but not much.I use a pin punch to remove my primers and after testing a case with the false shoulder method for the second time it won't fire the primer without completely re-doing the neck.To my way of thinking this tells me the 6.5 mm false shoulder isn't holding everything back.It is the method I use but its not perfect.

Lancexxx
You can get a full length 6 Dasher die from Sinclairs on the homepage of this website for about $36.The die will reduce your neck back down creating the false shoulder.
Waterboy
 
Lynn said:
Alinwa
On my cases the false shoulder with a live primer doesn't hold the brass real tight.It holds it a little better than a bullet but not much.I use a pin punch to remove my primers and after testing a case with the false shoulder method for the second time it won't fire the primer without completely re-doing the neck.To my way of thinking this tells me the 6.5 mm false shoulder isn't holding everything back.It is the method I use but its not perfect.
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OOOHHhhhhh!!!! Good info mon!!

Thanks for testing this and passing it on.

I've only done it on two long-chambered 6BR's and a couple over-length .243
AI's trying to make better cases (I don't have a DAsher) and they all came out equal length.

Do you set them for a firm jam? And they STILL move???

I needa' back up and do some more testing!

al
 
Alinwa
I think the brass I am using currently is pretty soft stuff out of the box.I can take tight fitting shoulders add a piece of tape to the boltface and close the action very easily.

JRinCo
I do my neck turning after my fireforming but then again I don't use a bullet to fireform with so I don't have any clearance issues.
I always figured neck turning first for a case with alot of shoulder movement is for those guys who really like to make alot of measurements and tinker quite a bit.
Me I like to shoot.Our range has quite a few dragon flies near the firing line and the cream of wheat makes a great short range load for them.
Waterboy
 
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Lynn said:
Alinwa
I think the brass I am using currently is pretty soft stuff out of the box.I can take tight fitting shoulders add a piece of tape to the boltface and close the action very easily.
Click to expand...

Ohhh, if you're using URBR brass I can see it happening. I use only Lapua and have had zero shoulder setback in my testing so far.

al
 
Alinwa
Al I'm using Lapua brass in my 2 Dashers.I use the URBR brass in the standard 6BR case.
Waterboy
 
Lynn,

All my stuff is hard enough that if I don't get the crush JUST right you won't get the bolt closed even if you hammer it with your palm. I've had to re-bump some shoulders because I let them sit too long.

al
 
Alinwa
Al I haven't had brass that good out of the box in 3 years now.If I neck up to 6.5 and neck down maybe 0.125 of the neck to 6mm I can close my bolt like a normal hunting load.If you don't fire the brass once or twice you can't load it up without expanding the webs.At the nationals this year my father had some brass that never saw a bullet and two of his cases lost the primer pockets big time with everyday loads.In the past we could pull our brass out of the box and shoot fullhouse loads in it.Those days ended about 3-4 yaers ago with the first big shortage of 6BR brass and have never returned.

Waterboy
 
Thank you Lynn!

I'm still working off of a lot of 1000 6BR cases that are almost 10yrs old and my 6.5X47L cases are from the very first lot off the boat from Finland...... in fact all of my Lapua brass is older than you've described. Looks like I'd better order up some of the newer stuff and see if it's just an annealing problem or if he brass is actually softer. Some of those first 6.5X47L cases have over 40 firings now as my 6X47L and are still going strong.

Your statements about the cases taking pressure "after you've fired them" leads me to believe that it's an annealing issue..... meantime, I'd better reassess some of my assumptions re Lapua brass.

al
 
Alinwa
My 6BR load is 31.5 grains of Varget and 3-4 years ago or longer we would fully prep our brass and go to a match.
Today we only turn the necks until the brass has 2 firings on it.We rarely exceed 30.5 grains until 2 firings before we step on it now.If you ream the flashholes or uniform the primer pockets early on they will get bigger on you with loudenboomer loads on virgin brass.
Its the same thing with the big 300 Ackleys.If you don't use weenie loads at the start 3 shots later you toss the brass due to loose primer pockets.
I am going to use 338 Lapua brass shortened up to around 92-96 grains on my next heavygun barrel just so I get decent brass.

Alot of the chest pounding that you used to read about on here came from guys who bought there last big lots of brass about 10 years ago.I can't wait until they re-stock-up on the brand new stuff and see what they post then.

You should put the 4th weekend of April on your calendar as well as the 4th weekend in October.We will be hosting the NBRSA 600 and 1,000 Yard Nationals both in 2010.

If you live in Portland it will take you 9-11 hours to get to the range so you can leave after work on wednesday and be here for sight in practice on thursday.If you leave right after the match on sunday you will be home around midnight so you would only miss thursday and friday at work.
Waterboy
P.S. I heard a rumor Billy Copelin is building a 35 Whelen for next year.
 
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hmmmmm, my Heavy should be running by then. I had a setback yesterday, I'd bedded the big ol' BAT action and was taking it out (BAT's come out HARD!!!!) and I snapped my red-white-and-blue Billy Shehane Big Dawgy right in half! Busted the pistol grip right smack through the middle, I'm standing there with the forend and butt in either hand..........

Got 'er patched up though, looks good this morning.

scared me.

Obeche ain't very stout stuff.

al
 
Alinwa
Al they all snap in the same spot.My first 50 bmg stock snapped at the very same place.
I figured out the best way to cure that was to send it off to Alex Sitman.
Waterboy
 
Lynn,

LOL

This is the first stock I've actually broke..... I'd had plans to run a hunk of 5/8 allthread up through that area anyway but now I can see that it's mandatory just so's I can pick the gun up by the obvious handle.

My problem was that I couldn't install the steel until the action was bedded, from here on out she'll be stout. In the end the entire rifle will be steel supported kind of like Curt's but with a wooden stock inside it for looks.

al
 
Alinwa
The picture below is of a wooden stock made out of little pieces all glued together in a garage.The work is very good for a homemade stock.
Waterboy
 
Just tried my new Whidden hydroform dies and it was a disaster (probably the user - me).

After 17 rounds both plunger rods seized in the upper die body and the tool is totally unusable.

Again probably me, but will be calling Whidden Monday morning.
 
Travelor said:
Just tried my new Whidden hydroform dies and it was a disaster (probably the user - me).

After 17 rounds both plunger rods seized in the upper die body and the tool is totally unusable.

Again probably me, but will be calling Whidden Monday morning.
Click to expand...

Please report back on this

How were you driving the die? Hammer? Press? Vise? Other?

al
 
I tried a hydro form die for the first time this week. I decided to start forming brass so I would have something to shoot next year if I decide to go to a match.
My hydroform die is not a Whidden die but I had the same problem. I clamped the die in a vice and used a brass drift to drive the punch out of the die then chucked in my lathe and polished it a while with some 400 grit sand paper at 1400 rpm. I did this about 6 times to form 50 cases and figured out it is a good idea to take it apart and lube everything every 5 cases to stopper from siezing up on me.
Got another 50 cases loaded up with cream of wheat ready to pop em off tomorrow, its so easy and the weather is nice and I don't wanna be be inside swinging a dead blow hammer any way. Might be OK at -20° and snow balls blowing 40 knots but not right now.
I use 10 grains Unique and a case full of cream of wheat and a 1" square of bounty packed into the case mouth with an Allen wrench. I do this to pack the C.O.W. tight. Makes good cases. I false shoulder my brass after expanding, this time with a 257 mandrel. I have used a 6.5 mandrel and don't know that it gains anything to stretch the neck that far.
I use a a dedicated fireform barrel for the C.O.W. fireforming.
 
i believe it was big al..THAT SAID CHECK THE INSIDE OF THOSE COW CASES.
COW FIRE FORMED RIGHT INTO THE CASE WALL!

Jay Cutright said:
I tried a hydro form die for the first time this week. I decided to start forming brass so I would have something to shoot next year if I decide to go to a match.
My hydroform die is not a Whidden die but I had the same problem. I clamped the die in a vice and used a brass drift to drive the punch out of the die then chucked in my lathe and polished it a while with some 400 grit sand paper at 1400 rpm. I did this about 6 times to form 50 cases and figured out it is a good idea to take it apart and lube everything every 5 cases to stopper from siezing up on me.
Got another 50 cases loaded up with cream of wheat ready to pop em off tomorrow, its so easy and the weather is nice and I don't wanna be be inside swinging a dead blow hammer any way. Might be OK at -20° and snow balls blowing 40 knots but not right now.
I use 10 grains Unique and a case full of cream of wheat and a 1" square of bounty packed into the case mouth with an Allen wrench. I do this to pack the C.O.W. tight. Makes good cases. I false shoulder my brass after expanding, this time with a 257 mandrel. I have used a 6.5 mandrel and don't know that it gains anything to stretch the neck that far.
I use a a dedicated fireform barrel for the C.O.W. fireforming.
Click to expand...
 
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