Extreme Benchrest 2017
- Thread starter EdLena
- Start date
Congratulations! The 25 meter results are posted on the USARB website. https://www.usairriflebenchrest.com/category/regional-results/
Steve W.
Steve W.
Ed:
Congratulations!...4th among that many shooters is quite an achievement!
I have talked to some participants and heard the same general complaint and about the same issue that other people have complained in the past...The general cry out is that benches are ASSIGNED at the will of the organizers and not drawn in the presence of the participants to make it fair and competitive...Some top shooters have mentioned that FX shooters, specially a few know to be very good shooters representing the favorite brand are always assigned the best benches around the center where there is less wind and less known conditions considered detrimental...I have never attended any of these shots and probably won't as speed in shooting and big bores at 100 M where I can hardy see are beyond my capabilities.
I believe that organizers can do as they please and reserve the right to conduct things any way they want at Non-World, Olympic or National shoots, but I am interested in hearing what are your insights and experiences and what do you think could be done for making these kind of competitions better?
Regards,
AZ
Congratulations!...4th among that many shooters is quite an achievement!
I have talked to some participants and heard the same general complaint and about the same issue that other people have complained in the past...The general cry out is that benches are ASSIGNED at the will of the organizers and not drawn in the presence of the participants to make it fair and competitive...Some top shooters have mentioned that FX shooters, specially a few know to be very good shooters representing the favorite brand are always assigned the best benches around the center where there is less wind and less known conditions considered detrimental...I have never attended any of these shots and probably won't as speed in shooting and big bores at 100 M where I can hardy see are beyond my capabilities.
I believe that organizers can do as they please and reserve the right to conduct things any way they want at Non-World, Olympic or National shoots, but I am interested in hearing what are your insights and experiences and what do you think could be done for making these kind of competitions better?
Regards,
AZ
Hi AZ,
They said the lanes for qualifying were picked randomly and I believe them as pro and sportsman class were evenly scattered. The wind was from about 1-3 o'clock and mild on both qualifying days. I was in lane 38/40 close to the right side berm and shoot 221 and 230/250 for the second highest score in my 40 man relay. For the finals the wind was much stronger but again from the right side.
On that day we picked our lane number from two hats, one for the pro class and one for the sportsman class. That was suspicious and I realized later that the pro class got the right side of the range and we got the left with me in lane 11.
I couldn't get a decent understanding of the turbulent wind there and only scored a 176/250 for fourth place in the sportsmen class who all shot poorly.
I'm new to this sport and don't want to point fingers but I see no fair reason to pick from separate hats for the final.
That said I had a great time overall and with hundreds of competitors I think it was well run.
Ed.
They said the lanes for qualifying were picked randomly and I believe them as pro and sportsman class were evenly scattered. The wind was from about 1-3 o'clock and mild on both qualifying days. I was in lane 38/40 close to the right side berm and shoot 221 and 230/250 for the second highest score in my 40 man relay. For the finals the wind was much stronger but again from the right side.
On that day we picked our lane number from two hats, one for the pro class and one for the sportsman class. That was suspicious and I realized later that the pro class got the right side of the range and we got the left with me in lane 11.
I couldn't get a decent understanding of the turbulent wind there and only scored a 176/250 for fourth place in the sportsmen class who all shot poorly.
I'm new to this sport and don't want to point fingers but I see no fair reason to pick from separate hats for the final.
That said I had a great time overall and with hundreds of competitors I think it was well run.
Ed.
Chas DiCapua
New member
rotating benches
At the North East Regional and National Bench Rest events in Salem, NY, we had rotating benches. One bench for each card, and then move 5 benches to the right. So one shot at 3 different benches spanning the width (16 benches wide) of the shooting area per match.
It made things a bit more busy (moving equipment and wind flags) but, we got used to it and it went very smoothly. The result being that nobody had a "good" or a "bad" lane. This seems to be a pretty good way to ensure fairness in terms of what bench one shoots from.
Chas
At the North East Regional and National Bench Rest events in Salem, NY, we had rotating benches. One bench for each card, and then move 5 benches to the right. So one shot at 3 different benches spanning the width (16 benches wide) of the shooting area per match.
It made things a bit more busy (moving equipment and wind flags) but, we got used to it and it went very smoothly. The result being that nobody had a "good" or a "bad" lane. This seems to be a pretty good way to ensure fairness in terms of what bench one shoots from.
Chas
D
Dave Shattuck
Guest
Between shooting rimfire and airgun I've shot in 8 Nationals and dozens of Regional events with all requiring bench rotation between targets. It works great and in my opinion is the only fair way to conduct any large scale event as all shooters end up having to use every segment of the range while facing varying conditions.
As for the added time because of it: it isn't all that much (so long as the shooter you're sharing your next bench with removes their equipment in a timely fashion) as almost all of the equipment relocation and bench set-ups can be done while the old targets are being pulled and new ones hung, then you can clean your guns while the next relay is shooting.
As I said, just my opinion: but what do I know.
Dave Shattuck
As for the added time because of it: it isn't all that much (so long as the shooter you're sharing your next bench with removes their equipment in a timely fashion) as almost all of the equipment relocation and bench set-ups can be done while the old targets are being pulled and new ones hung, then you can clean your guns while the next relay is shooting.
As I said, just my opinion: but what do I know.
Dave Shattuck
Ed, Chas, Dave...Your thoughts and perspectives make a lot of sense and denote fairness and sportsmanship...
So...Is there any reason why these suggestions and specifically about sorting and rotating benches are not contemplated in the BR rules and regulations?
Wouldn't everyone everywhere want to play fair so everybody has the same opportunity?
How do we incorporate or what do we shooters need to do for incorporating these topics to the rules and regulations?
Regards,
AZ
So...Is there any reason why these suggestions and specifically about sorting and rotating benches are not contemplated in the BR rules and regulations?
Wouldn't everyone everywhere want to play fair so everybody has the same opportunity?
How do we incorporate or what do we shooters need to do for incorporating these topics to the rules and regulations?
Regards,
AZ
AZ, we as competitors want fairness because we may get the short end of the stick. The organizers of events like EBR are financially motivated as you mentioned earlier. There is no one that can tell them the way they must operate when they see it as their event for the sole purpose of advertising their business and products.
Competitions organized by non profit groups don't have those agendas and are happy to be fair and play by the sport associations rules.
What can we do about it? Other than most of us not attending I doubt there's a way. Life's not fair but we have to make the best of it and I'd attend again.
Competitions organized by non profit groups don't have those agendas and are happy to be fair and play by the sport associations rules.
What can we do about it? Other than most of us not attending I doubt there's a way. Life's not fair but we have to make the best of it and I'd attend again.
Chas DiCapua
New member
rules and regs
Can't do anything about EBR for the reasons Ed mentioned, but it could be part of the USARB rules and regs. Of course, match directors of the sanctioned clubs can just do it (rotating benches) on their own, but it might be nice if it was codified into the rules.
Can't do anything about EBR for the reasons Ed mentioned, but it could be part of the USARB rules and regs. Of course, match directors of the sanctioned clubs can just do it (rotating benches) on their own, but it might be nice if it was codified into the rules.
I am somewhat confused about the USARB posting the EBR 2017 results on their site given the fact that it is not a sanctioned event requiring bench rotation, etc...I would've thought that USARB would homologate the rules and regulations before recognizing an event, but apparently this is not the case and it could be that the results were posted because of the magnitude of the event??? 
AZ
AZ
D
Dave Shattuck
Guest
AZ
The results being posted here have nothing to do with being limited to the USARB as this is an open forum and not run by them. Anyone can post anything here. Just look over in the rimfire section to see the different Organizations that post there: IR 50/50, ARA, ABRA as well as all the other rimfire related groups.
Dave
The results being posted here have nothing to do with being limited to the USARB as this is an open forum and not run by them. Anyone can post anything here. Just look over in the rimfire section to see the different Organizations that post there: IR 50/50, ARA, ABRA as well as all the other rimfire related groups.
Dave
D
Dave Shattuck
Guest
Bench Rotation
The Nationals and Regionals, as well as all other LV and HV Classes, are run under what is discribed in the WRABF Rulebook. If you look in their Rulebook under Rule #E.3 Bench Rotation you will find the instructions for how to perform bench rotation. You can also check in the IR 50/50 and ARA Rulebooks for what is required regarding bench rotation, and how it is mandatory during both Regional and National events. For monthly shoots it is left up to the discresion of the Match Director as to whether or not benches are rotated.
The Nationals and Regionals, as well as all other LV and HV Classes, are run under what is discribed in the WRABF Rulebook. If you look in their Rulebook under Rule #E.3 Bench Rotation you will find the instructions for how to perform bench rotation. You can also check in the IR 50/50 and ARA Rulebooks for what is required regarding bench rotation, and how it is mandatory during both Regional and National events. For monthly shoots it is left up to the discresion of the Match Director as to whether or not benches are rotated.
"The results being posted here have nothing to do with being limited to the USARB as this is an open forum and not run by them. Anyone can post anything here."
Thank you Dave...I Understand that when you say "This is an open forum" you are talking about USARB and not Benchrest Central...If indeed USARB is an open forum, then there is my confusion as I assumed that site was exclusively for USARB and other USARB sanctioned events...Thank you once again for the clarification.
I am aware of the rules for rotating benches and how they are applied, nothing I can suggest or add there. These rules are well thought and when applied by the book everyone seems to be happy...It would be good that these or similar rules were applied in ALL shooting events, but as ED implies: "There are some events that are done for promoting "X" or "Y" brand or special interests" and in those cases unique rules have to be accepted by anyone wanting to participate...Anyhow, I am glad that we are seeing more events and that the sport of airgunning is growing and not the opposite.
Regards,
AZ
Thank you Dave...I Understand that when you say "This is an open forum" you are talking about USARB and not Benchrest Central...If indeed USARB is an open forum, then there is my confusion as I assumed that site was exclusively for USARB and other USARB sanctioned events...Thank you once again for the clarification.
I am aware of the rules for rotating benches and how they are applied, nothing I can suggest or add there. These rules are well thought and when applied by the book everyone seems to be happy...It would be good that these or similar rules were applied in ALL shooting events, but as ED implies: "There are some events that are done for promoting "X" or "Y" brand or special interests" and in those cases unique rules have to be accepted by anyone wanting to participate...Anyhow, I am glad that we are seeing more events and that the sport of airgunning is growing and not the opposite.
Regards,
AZ
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D
Dave Shattuck
Guest
AZ
No, I was saying "this is an open forum" because it is not just for the USARB, but for anything and everything to do with airgun benchrest regardless of the discipline.
Dave
No, I was saying "this is an open forum" because it is not just for the USARB, but for anything and everything to do with airgun benchrest regardless of the discipline.
Dave