Best Choice For Bench Rest Action

C

cl5man

Guest
I've been building guns for about 5 years now. Never really been into competion before but I'm thinking I want to give it a try. I've built myself several target/varmit guns in 6mmBr on Remington actions. All of them shot very well, .250 3 shot groups were the norm, although several .125 inch groups were shot also. I'm looking to build a real target gun with a real trigger and a real benchrest style stock. I would like to get a gun that I can use in light and heavy varmit. Theres so many custom actions out there. Which would be the best for around $1200. I see a ton of Bat actions in the classifieds on this site. How are they? What about Hall, Panda? I'm a Shilen fan along with McMillian and Leupold. I know how much a nice gun will cost, I wanna make the right choice on the action so im not kicking myself in 2 years. Any advice?
 
Cl

Welcome aboard.

As you have discovered, there are a multitude of top quality actions available to those wishing to build a real, honest to goodness Benchrest Rifle.

This is just my opinion, based on what I see, and what I have learned through the years.

The best choice for an action right out of the box is a Stolle Panda, built by Kelblys. Pandas use a time tested fire contole system, and the machine work on all the criticle areas is dead on. In other words, you can use it right out of the box without sending it to some 'Guru' to have a bunch of quirks corrected.

Of course, any of the popular actions can be used, it just seems that we are always hearing things like, "best action made, after you do such and such to it". There are top Gunsmiths who have a cottage industry going fixing some of the little anomalies that many believe plague some particular brands.

Whether there is really anything wrong in the first place can be disputed. But it seems like a lot of shooters who are in the winners circle embrace many of these ideas.

It does seem a little odd to spend that kind of money for an action, and then have it sent somewhere else to "get everything right"..........jackie
 
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cl5man said:
I've been building guns for about 5 years now. Never really been into competion before but I'm thinking I want to give it a try. I've built myself several target/varmit guns in 6mmBr on Remington actions. All of them shot very well, .250 3 shot groups were the norm, although several .125 inch groups were shot also. I'm looking to build a real target gun with a real trigger and a real benchrest style stock. I would like to get a gun that I can use in light and heavy varmit. Theres so many custom actions out there. Which would be the best for around $1200. I see a ton of Bat actions in the classifieds on this site. How are they? What about Hall, Panda? I'm a Shilen fan along with McMillian and Leupold. I know how much a nice gun will cost, I wanna make the right choice on the action so im not kicking myself in 2 years. Any advice?
Click to expand...



With all the fine custom benchrest actions on the market today, I don't know how you could pick one you would not be happy with. :) Go by and visit with or call Lester Bruno at Bruno Shooter's Supply in Phoenix. He stocks actions and you might find just what you want in stock.

Gene Beggs
 
If you have a good shooting 6br Remington 40x or 700 I would suggest buying a BR trigger for it and a BR stock and shoot it for the first year. This way you can see the different actions in person at the matches and develop your own preference. Then when you get ready to jump into a custom action you can take the trigger off the Rem and use it as all the customs use a Rem pattern trigger. You could also take the Br stock off your Rem and have it inletted for whatever action you choose or you may decide on a different stock after seeing them in person.

I personally use Viper Drop Ports but most any action is available with or without an ejector or you can just pick the fired case out of the port. There are no crappy custom actions. Just different ways to do the same job.
 
jackie schmidt said:
The best choice for an action right out of the box is a Stolle Panda, built by Kelblys. Pandas use a time tested fire contole system, and the machine work on all the criticle areas is dead on. In other words, you can use it right out of the box without sending it to some 'Guru' to have a bunch of quirks corrected.
Click to expand...

Jackie's advice is sound.......I have 3 Pandas. The first one was bought 15 years ago on recommendations from other shooters, and because I got a deal on a 9 year old unfired action. The next 2 were bought because I'd observed most of the others in use. I've been to Kelbly's shop.........I'm a Machinist and know what to look for............Its there........

-Dave-
 
Just looked at the panda website. $1,100 bucks is right in my price range. It sounds like the one I want is the Panda with on right port. I've never done a cone head bolt before, hopefully its pretty straight forward. I want to do all the work myself on my own machine, including stock work. I work factory actions all the time but I would be a little nervouse chucking a new panda up in the lathe. It sounds like the pandas dont require any "checking". I'll do a little more looking before making the final decision.
 
When you call about the Panda action, ask for the chamber instruction sheet and dimensions, its a big help. The cone bolt is not hard to do. We also have a little thread gauge that is a big help in checking the threads when you are chambering, so ask about it. And certainly do not be afraid to ask questions.

Jim
 
Action choices

Dear Cl5man, If you are R handed, some action option choices you might want to think about are ejector or no ejector and if an ejector what type, bolt port configuration, firing pin diameter, fluted or non fluted bolt, short throw or regular throw action. You may get a polished or bead blasted finish. My only advice is to consider a R bolt L port R eject action. This works well on most types of benches you will encounter at a BR match. The only burning question I have of you is what is the story behind the moniker C15man. Are you a robot? Tim
 
Thanks jim ill be sure and ask about the sheet and thread guage when i call. Could someone explain what a R bolt, L port, R eject is. I've never seen an action with two ports?? Ah not sure how to respond to the question about me being a bot??
 
cl5man said:
Thanks jim ill be sure and ask about the sheet and thread guage when i call. Could someone explain what a R bolt, L port, R eject is. I've never seen an action with two ports?? Ah not sure how to respond to the question about me being a bot??
Click to expand...

You'll get to know Dr. Tim as you read his posts and meet him at matches. Don't read anything into one of his posts that's not there. Sometimes they tend to lean toward the bizarre. Only one I know of that travels to matches with a gasoline powered blender nicknamed the "weedwacker".
 
cl5man said:
Could someone explain what a R bolt, L port, R eject is. I've never seen an action with two ports??
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Cl, some of the action combinations for a right handed shooter are,

1: Right bolt left port (non eject) with this you pick each case out of the action before loading.

2: Right bolt left port (you load into this port with your left hand) and the empty case ejects out of the right hand port (which is usually smaller than the loading port)

3: Right bolt with left port and also eject out of the left port........only problem with this is the cases eject out pretty close to the edge of the bench.

4: Right bolt right port and eject out the right port, you use your right hand for working the bolt and loading. (Tony Boyer uses this combination)

5: Jerry Stiller of Viper actions makes a Right bolt left port bottom eject.


The most common combination would be the non eject, mostly due to the ejector being a recent addition (10 yrs or so), of the actions with an ejector the right bolt left port right eject would be the most common.

The reason for an ejector is to enable the shooter to "run" a group when the conditions are right, my excuse is so I can shoot big groups faster:D

Here are a couple of rifle featured at 6mmbr with R bolt L port R eject.
http://www.6mmbr.com/gunweek087.html
http://www.6mmbr.com/gunweek018.html

One other thing to consider is firing pin diameter......others with more knowledge than me can explain this one.

Where in AZ are you located, if you are near a match the best idea would be to go and look at some of the equipment being used.......Ian
 
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I like the panda but...

Stiller's Viper/Cobras are aluminum actions every bit as precise as the Panda but they are also hard anodized, come with the rings, and are less expensive. It's a no brainer in my opinion.;)
 
Stiller

I have one of Jerry's Stainless Steel Diamond Back Drop Ports on my Rail Gun, and everything on it was "dead nuts true" as well. ........jackie
 
I have two of Stillers Viper aluminum actions. One is right bolt, left load port, right eject. Sometimes needs a case catcher. The newer one is a drop port. I think only Stiller makes this. It is hard anodized aluminum, no ejector pin in the bolt face. It is right bolt, left load port, bottom eject. The ejection is really nothing more than gravity letting the empty case fall thru a case size notch cut in the bottom rear of the action. The empties drop straight down thru a hole in the bottom of the stock. They fall right in front of your trigger hand. Best arrangement I have seen and I love mine. It really comes down to what arrangement you like. They all are good actions. It you are going to build a light varmint class rifle, you might pay attention to action weight. Just for starters most barrels will end up weighing about 5# to a bit less. This is for a barrel about 21-22 inches long. Light varmint weight limit is 10.5 lbs, ready to shoot.

Donald
 
cl5man said:
...I've never done a cone head bolt before, hopefully its pretty straight forward. ...
Click to expand...

A coned bolt is easier to fit than a Remington. For a Panda, you set your compound to cut 29.5 to 30 degree and cut out from the center of the barrel and fit the barrel up with a little clearance between the end of the barrel tenon and the bolt nose. Anywhere from .001" to .010" clearance will work as long as you have clearance. I wouldn't go over .010" clearance as you risk having unsupported case head in the chamber. Stiller's do the same except for the drop ports which now cut similar to a Remington. Bat actions have 25 degree cones. If you wind up with a Stiller drop port keep the clearances on the minimum side from the bolt nose to inside the counterbore as I've seen problems caused by too much clearance caused by whoever fit the barrel. Too much clearance can cause the case head to blow out at worse or wind up making a belt on the case at least.
 
jackie schmidt said:
Welcome aboard.

As you have discovered, there are a multitude of top quality actions available to those wishing to build a real, honest to goodness Benchrest Rifle.

This is just my opinion, based on what I see, and what I have learned through the years.

The best choice for an action right out of the box is a Stolle Panda, built by Kelblys. Pandas use a time tested fire contole system, and the machine work on all the criticle areas is dead on. In other words, you can use it right out of the box without sending it to some 'Guru' to have a bunch of quirks corrected.

Of course, any of the popular actions can be used, it just seems that we are always hearing things like, "best action made, after you do such and such to it". There are top Gunsmiths who have a cottage industry going fixing some of the little anomalies that many believe plague some particular brands.

All Kelbly centerfire actions are superb. I have Pandas,Kodiak,and even a Polar from 1988. Never a problem with any of them.

Whether there is really anything wrong in the first place can be disputed. But it seems like a lot of shooters who are in the winners circle embrace many of these ideas.

It does seem a little odd to spend that kind of money for an action, and then have it sent somewhere else to "get everything right"..........jackie
Click to expand...

All Kelbly centerfire actions are superb. I have Pandas,a Kodiak,and a Polar from 1988. Never a problem with any of them.
 
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