Barrel PreTreat For HBN

SGJennings

New member
Following the lead of a lot of the VFS guys, I'm going to coat bullets. But rather than Danzac/WS2, I'm going to use hexagonal boron nitride (HBN).

I see some info about pretreating the barrel when using moly and Danzac.

Anyone seen anything about doing it with HBN?

Thanks,

Greg J.
 
Where do you get it?

Could someone please advise me on where to buy Boron Nitride AC6111? I am trying to locate a source within Australia without any success. Any information would be a great help.
Regards
Allan
 
I put some in some.............

MPro7 oil, get the barrel as close to surgically clean as possible, then begin the application coupled w/the burnishing, using patches and coated bullets. On varmint rifles, there does seem to be a slight accuracy increase, and easier and simpler(faster) clean-up. Now, like BenchResters, and, some benchresters, I am forced to exercise frugality, so I view this as having a significant role in barrel preservation, then, well.....I'll just CHANGE 'er out on a WHIM!!!! :D:D:D;)
 
So, you oil before you clean it squeaky clean? Why? Or are you using MPro7 cleaner or what?

I think I'm clear on the squeaky clean then the mop/shoot cycle.
 
Jerry, Thanks for posting that link. I'm one of the many shooters who've been using moly & wax (since 1995), and have tired of the labor-intensive process. Reading Kevin Thomas's article on moly & barrel life in PS a few years ago had raised a good deal of doubt as to whether moly was worth the time & effort, but being a hardheaded farmer, I doggedly kept at it.

David Tubb recently stopped offering his Sierra-made 6mm DTAC 115 bullets with moly coating, instead giving shooters the choice of HBN or bare bullets. Not long after that, I purchased 1lb. of HBN from Momentive Performance Products, and began coating bullets with it. My process involves nothing more complicated than filling clean vitamin bottles with bullets & HBN, taping the lids tight, and putting them in a heavy-duty vibratory tumbler for an hour. In a few cases, bullets coated in this way came out of the jars with a rather lumpy coating of HBN, so I tumbled them in plain corncob media for a minute or two in a RCBS Sidewinder rotary tumbler. That pretty well smoothed them up, though the cosmetics don't compare very well to nicely waxed moly'd bullets. Whatever - they shoot just fine.

So far, I've used HBN-coated bullets in a few Bartlein & Krieger barrels, but until recently, all these barrels had been broken-in & shot extensively with only moly'd bullets. However, I recently finished assembling a DPMS AR10, using a 1:8 Krieger 6.5mm blank that I contoured & chambered for the 6.5x47 Lapua. To date, it's had 63rds. of HBN-coated bullets fired through it, and I'm still seeing the reamer marks on the faces of the lands in the leade. Typically, in the 6 & 6.5mm bbls. I've used, the leade erodes smooth within 40-50rds. in the 6s, shooting moly'd bullets with cartridges such as 6 Dasher, 6x47, & 6XC, and within as few as 20rds. in the 6.5x55 and 6.5x55AI.

Granted, the 6.5x47 has considerably less case capacity than either of the other 6.5s mentioned; another consideration is that I've been shooting lighter bullets (120,123, & 130grs.) than the 139s & 142s used in the 6.5x55 & AI. The only copper fouling I've seen through the Hawkeye was around the gas port during break-in - now that a few tiny burrs & the sharp edges of the port have worn smooth, I've not seen any further copper streaks. Typically, with moly'd bullets, I'll find some copper fouling in the last 3" or so of a 28"-30" bbl., but so far, I'm not finding any copper at the muzzle of the AR10's 28" bbl.

I'm not jumping to any earth-shaking conclusions here - just mentioning a few interesting observations. Since this is the 1st bbl. I've shoot exclusively with HBN, I'm going to keep notes on it and see how it progresses. But from now on, I do think I'll simplify life a bit by using HBN.
 
We have gone from coating our barrels with Penephite to coating them with Boron Nitride AC6111 (from momentive performance) and alcohol 90%. What we have seen is with the Penephite coating in the barrel you can almost trust the first sighter shot or fouler in that case... But with the Boron you CAN trust the first fouler or sighter shot. The impact is the same as the next 15 rounds.

When we coat our BN bullets we use HCPL grade (also from Momentive) The two grade differ in Particle size. John Leist is the point of contact at Momentive. Tell him Dad and I sent you. He has been good to us, and is interested in hearing results of the uses we have for BN.

Paul Becigneul
 
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5 cents per bullet is a lot of money for having someone else coat your bullets. We get by way cheaper than that. That's $50 per thousand, then figure you pay shipping both ways to and from Tubb, and figure you paid the original shipping on getting the bullets to you. Then figure the average competitive shooter at about 7 to 8 thousand per season. Half of the head of a flat screwdriver heaping is enough HCPL HBN to coat a hundred bullets.

We coat our own Thank You.

After starting to use BN coated bullets I asked Ourselves why are we cleaning our rifles until they are super clean, then adding (black) penephite to the barrel before shooting (white) HBN coated Bullets? So we called John Leist to find a good grade of HBN to add to Alcohol 90% to pretreat the barrels with, He figured the AC6111, which I've yet to find on their site, would work best. A few days later we had a pound of AC6111 at the door. Now we clean are barrels add white prelube then shoot white bullets and clean aftarward. The first shot goes right where it should everytime SO FAR.

Paul
 
Mr. Jennings..............

I originally used the hBN as a lube "enhancer" in MPro7 oil. I had been using the cleaner, followed up with a couple dry patches, then an oiled one, the oil having the hBN already mixed in. One day I was at the range and had FORGOTTEN the trusty MPro7 cleaner :eek::eek:!! Well, no worries, as I used to use LSA as a cleaner AND lubricant. Back to the dilemma....the oil has about a 3/16 wide screwdriver blade scooped in the hBN, not too "heaped-up", then dumped into one of Dewey's angled oilers, then shaken up. When I go to clean, I wet a patch liberally and push it down the bore(1.75 in. square) then stop it halfway or a bit more at the muzzle. I peel open the wrapped patch and liberally wet it some more for the return trip, then pull out the rod, and let the warm barrel absorb the oil & hBN. Then I wet a brush, and do the same, wetting it again at the muzzle, and give it maybe 3-4 round trips in the bore, then remove it. Then I patch it out, wet or dry patches, till they come out clean, or just slightly gray, then I may give the last wet one 10-12 round trips, then wipe off the crown, run a 2" patch around in the chamber, and start shooting again. I'd probably go to more (or less) extremes, but this barrel is on its way out, and its a live varmint gun, but a decent one, it shoots pretty good, I just don't have the money to put a new tube on it yet. I do shoot the bore damp on all my rifles, and they seem to respond with the first round with all the others, right where they are SUPPOSED to be, as long as I do my duty. ;):D
 
Update

UPDATE:

I got this e-mail from Jon Leist this am....

Due to the volume of inquiries, we have set up a hobbyist company by the name of TAI Lubricants (Tom Madden, nyoil@aol.com, 302-326-0200) to handle purchases of quantities less than our minimum purchase size of 5-lbs. I have received five calls over the past several weeks alone. I copied Tom on this email. Is there a chance you can update your blog post to suggest folks contact Tom regarding their HBN needs? In the mean time, I will continue to direct folks to Tom.

Again, thanks so much!

Best regards,

Jon



It seems that guys are trying the hBN like we did. I would like to here if others are having the good results we did.

Paul
 
Hokay,

I emailed Mr. Madden. He replied prompty and courteously that the minimum purchase of AC6111 was 5 lbs and gave me a quote on that quantity. He said that he was working with Momentive to package it in smaller quantities.

So, I've contacted Momentive to ask for a quote on 5 lbs. We'll see what happens.

As the world turns,

Greg J.
 
I've been using HBN and I love it. Never had any luck with moly. WS2 worked well but I constantly had issues getting consistent coatings and chasing velocitys.
HBN is super easy to use. No bullet wash. No media. Just dump in and vibrate.

For pretreating I've used ISO alcohol and lighter fluid.
I'm just now beginning to wonder if continuous pretreating is nesessary. After the barrel has been "broke in" with HBN maybe treating after cleaning is no longer required.

Two wet patches and dry. Barrels as clean as it needs to be. Every 300rds or so. Of course you won't be seeing me at the Super Shoot anytime soon but I'm having fun anyway:)
 
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