barrel chamber question

S

skeetlee

Active member
I watched a guy chamber a barrel a while back and he didnt worry about dialing the muzzle end of the barrel in at all. he just let the run out flop in the wind. He used a range rod that he stuck into the chamber in about four inches or so, he then used two indicators on the range rod to dial the barrel in true. Is this a common method to chambering a barrel? it looked pretty simple. Lee
 
WHOoowheeEEEEEE!!!!

You DO know how to open the door and fan the flickering flame me' man!!!

LOL

The guy you watched may have been Gordy Gritters, a gunsmith widely esteemed (except here ;) where a bunch of folks think he's crazy as a fruitcake) and who actually gets PAID to show folks his methods...

I think Gordy is a wonderful gunsmith. I learned more-better enough from watching his method that I went and bought a lathe. I modify his method to suit me, but the "flopping muzzle" method is sound

IMO

I first set up a barrel between centers (This is how I learned to do it 30yrs ago, in gunsmithing school) and then run an extension rod into the barrel and check for runout.

Now at least a half-dozen people (who've never tried it) can call me crazy too.

I'm used to it

al
 
skeetlee said:
I watched a guy chamber a barrel a while back and he didn't worry about dialing the muzzle end of the barrel in at all. he just let the run out flop in the wind. He used a range rod that he stuck into the chamber in about four inches or so, he then used two indicators on the range rod to dial the barrel in true. Is this a common method to chambering a barrel? it looked pretty simple. Lee
Click to expand...

"This barrel doesn't shoot worth a darn" IMO is more in how a barrel is chambered than how it comes from the barrel maker. Notice that some gunsmiths chamber barrels that shoot and some gunsmiths chamber barrels that don't, ever wonder why???
 
The fella that i watched do this is an action maker in my area. The barrel shot just fine, i must say! I was just shocked at how simple he made all this set up look. We even turned our own range rod on another machine as he didnt already have a .236 diameter rod. One rod two indicators, and he didnt even pay much attention as to were the run out fell on the muzzle end. It was an interesting day. Lee
 
Care to share what actions this person is making? I want to make sure I'm not planning on getting any of them! How is he dialing in the barrel if he's not influencing the muzzle end of the barrel. I really think you missed a lot in watching this person work. If he had 2 indicators on the range rod, one of them was there to read what the other end of the bbl is doing. It might appear to you to be "flopping in the wind" but in actuality that is because the center of the bore is not in perfect alignment with the OD of the bbl.
 
Is that gasoline I smell? Please extinguish all cigarettes...
 
Skeet, IIRC you live awful close to Lawton... is that who you are talking about?
 
The answer to your question is "Yes".

One of the best Benchrest Shooters around, a noted Gulf Coast Region Shooter, uses his own method of eccentially indicating the first inches, (I don't know how many), of the chamber end. Yes, the muzzle will run out according to how much variation is present in the barrels ID with it's own self, but it is of no consequense. The chamber he establishes will be dead on true with that first section of barrel, and the results do speak for themselves as his Rifles consistantly perform at the top.

Skeet, keep in mind, if a barrel's ID were perfectly straight with it's self, it would all be a moot point. Rememeber, once the bullet makes that initial engrave into the lands and grooves upon igintion, it will follow what ever is present in the rest of the ID.

I prefer my method, because it suites the equipment I have on hand, and, well, I just prefer it.

Where I differ, well downright disagree, with some Craftsmen is this whole thing of barrel indexing. I have proven to myself that a barrels ID is not "bent" as in a bannana bend. It has various spots that for what ever reason known only to Gun Drills, the ID wonders, one run out spot may be in one direction, six inches further up one might be in another. So, I think all of this "barrel indexing" is bogus. People are paying for something that is based on junk science...........jackie
 
Jackie, how is he truing the chamber portion of the barrel if he is not influencing the muzzle end somehow?
 
jackie schmidt said:
Where I differ, well downright disagree, with some Craftsmen is this whole thing of barrel indexing. I have proven to myself that a barrels ID is not "bent" as in a bannana bend. It has various spots that for what ever reason known only to Gun Drills, the ID wonders, one run out spot may be in one direction, six inches further up one might be in another. So, I think all of this "barrel indexing" is bogus. People are paying for something that is based on junk science...........jackie
Click to expand...

Some of these long long-range barrels with the Gordy method have to be indexed. Elsewise the shooter would run out of clicks or hit some poor soul going down the road in the next county.

When the bullet exits it takes the direction of the last bit of barrel is pointing, not where it points as it wanders down the barrel.
 
JerrySharrett said:
Some of these long long-range barrels with the Gordy method have to be indexed. Elsewise the shooter would run out of clicks or hit some poor soul going down the road in the next county.

When the bullet exits it takes the direction of the last bit of barrel is pointing, not where it points as it wanders down the barrel.
Click to expand...

Agreed. I'll continue to index my barrels so the bullet leaves with the muzzle pointed in the 12:00 direction regardless of what the bullet is doing 4" from the chamber.
 
He just lets it do what it is going to do. Sometimes the muzzle can be running out .030 or more, it is of no consequense, aside from when changing barrels, the POI is pretty far off.......jackie
 
You misunderstood my question Sir. How is cutting a chamber true to the axis of the bore if he is not using the muzzle end of the bbl to influence the bore in the chuck? If you have a range rod and 2 indicators, to make one of them move you HAVE to do something to the muzzle end. Moving it around in the 4 jaw is not going to bring you to a true bore in relation to the tailstock.
 
Of course he has the barrel supported by a spider on the muzzle end. He adjust the barrel in the chuck and spider untill that first three or so inches of the chamber end is running dead true. He does not use a range rod, he uses a long stem indicator.

The time where you will get the most muzzle run out is when there is one of those crooked spots right up where you are indicating. You get .003 there, and it can translate into .020+ by the time it gets out to the muzzle.

Since barrel ID's are not straight with themselves, every set-up will be subjected to a litle bit of compromise, and as we in the Machine Shop Business say, "splitting the difference"........jackie
 
Jackie, I agree with you 100%. Go back and read what the OP said. He said the guy is indicating the bbl and letting the muzzle flop in the wind. There is a reading comprehension problem here for one of us and it might very well be me. My interpretation of what the OP is saying is that the guy does nothing at all with the muzzle end. THAT is why I told the OP he wasn't paying much attention. It would be impossible to indicate the first inch, much less 3 inches without using the muzzle end of the bbl to influence that. By what the OP said, said smith is doing nothing with the muzzle end.
 
I am sure i am leaving out some important info as this was the first time i had ever seen this done and it was some time ago. This particular fella had a write up In PS last year on how he chambers barrels. i am not going to mention any names because i dont want to cause any ill effects from what i remember about that sunday morning. I was just amazed on how much run out that barrel had. The only real reason i brought any of this up is because i am in the market for a lathe and i am excited to learn how to chamber barrels. The method this fella used looked pretty darn easy but i would need to see it all again i guess before i can say for sure. Lee
 
skeetlee said:
I watched a guy chamber a barrel a while back and he didnt worry about dialing the muzzle end of the barrel in at all. he just let the run out flop in the wind. He used a range rod that he stuck into the chamber in about four inches or so, he then used two indicators on the range rod to dial the barrel in true. Is this a common method to chambering a barrel? it looked pretty simple. Lee
Click to expand...

From what I'm reading there, he didn't worry about dialing in the muzzle end. Meaning he did nothing with it at all. Now I'm sure you can center the bore in a 4 jaw chuck, but that doesn't mean the bore will be running true beyond the very opening of the bore UNLESS you move the muzzle end around to make it run true. Obviously the OP is inexperienced and that makes his post hard to discern what he is actually trying to convey. I just don't see any way one could hold a bbl by the chamber end in a chuck and insure the bore is running true if he didn't use some sort of method for indexing the muzzle around one way or another.
 
lee you must have missed him working on what is called a spider chuck .this would have been on the muzzle end of the barrel .but you are right there more than likely was runnout . T.R.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top