C
cris
Guest
With his latest score, a new leader in the indoor division of USA Production class.
Steve Ware 2,164-47X
Steve Ware 2,164-47X
Adventures in Production Class
- Thread starter 19Turkeys
- Start date
Today was our first outdoor match of the season. Humbling, very humbling! Here in beautiful SW Oregon we shoot 2 matches/month for 7 months outdoors. Lord, I have 6 1/2 more months of humiliation ahead of me! 
So, I braved the whipsaw wind currents and managed 3 "X's" per target. Folks, that was the high point of the day also! Card 1 was a 230, and I thought gee whiz, if I could just do a little better I could actually shoot my outside benchrest goal of the high 690's, low 700's. Well, Ralph the Outdoor Air Rifle God would have none of it. Card 2 was worse at 225. Then, Ralph served up a dose of Humble Pie to close the day out with a 224 for a grand total of 679/9X.
Back in my college days, I had a statue of a hobo. The sign at the base read, "In my field I stand alone - right at the bottom of the heap." I sure wish I had that statue. I'd put it on my shooting bench! Hopefully, there is no way to go but up!
Steve W.
So, I braved the whipsaw wind currents and managed 3 "X's" per target. Folks, that was the high point of the day also! Card 1 was a 230, and I thought gee whiz, if I could just do a little better I could actually shoot my outside benchrest goal of the high 690's, low 700's. Well, Ralph the Outdoor Air Rifle God would have none of it. Card 2 was worse at 225. Then, Ralph served up a dose of Humble Pie to close the day out with a 224 for a grand total of 679/9X.
Back in my college days, I had a statue of a hobo. The sign at the base read, "In my field I stand alone - right at the bottom of the heap." I sure wish I had that statue. I'd put it on my shooting bench!
Hopefully, there is no way to go but up!Steve W.
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M
ModelA
Guest
Steve W,
You did great for your first outdoor match. Not sure what you have for wind flags? Even surveyor tape on a stick will do.
Pick a condition and try to shoot that condition. Your outdoor scores will keep climbing and match your indoor scores.
Looking forward to your next results.
Paul
You did great for your first outdoor match. Not sure what you have for wind flags? Even surveyor tape on a stick will do.
Pick a condition and try to shoot that condition. Your outdoor scores will keep climbing and match your indoor scores.
Looking forward to your next results.
Paul
Hi Paul,
We had 8 or 9 shooters on the line and the range was pretty well populated with flags. I was sneaking peeks to my left & right. Interesting that a left to right wind caused the pellet to hit high. Also, interesting that the wind was doing different things in different places on the range. Coach Ron has suggested a couple of music stands with the tops removed. I guess they are fairly inexpensive.
Steve W.
How to describe today's match, my second foray into the Outdoor Division of Production Benchrest? I believe "spastic moments of brilliance followed by abject humility" best sums it up. To explain, I do believe I learned quite a bit from match #1, one of the most important being that a left to right wind across the range would drive a pellet high & right. Thus, an 8 o'clock hold on the 9 ring would give a 10 point score. Well, that proved true again today, but then again there were times when the apparently same wind conditions would drive that bloody pellet into the 6 ring! Go figure, unregulated rifle?, different wind?, crappy shooter?, all of the above?
Anyway, my professed goal in the Outdoor Division is to shoot into the high 690's/low 700's. The first card seemed fairly decent and I was pleased just looking it over. Card #2 was a different story, and I knew I had lost quite a few points. Could card #3 pull me into my desired goal? I was sure it was better than card #2 when I pulled it, but the scorer would tell the tale.
Card #1 was a 238/1X. The disappointing card #2 proved to be only a 228/3X. Better on the X count, but far short of the 238. Card #3 was a 235/1X for a total of 701/5X. Yahoo! I felt a great sense of accomplishment breaking into that coveted 700 club! While the X count was below my previous count of 9, the overall score was 22 points higher. I credit this to not only learning a bit about the wind but also the fact that the conditions were substantially improved over the first match. We'll see how the rest of the season goes!
Steve W.
Anyway, my professed goal in the Outdoor Division is to shoot into the high 690's/low 700's. The first card seemed fairly decent and I was pleased just looking it over. Card #2 was a different story, and I knew I had lost quite a few points. Could card #3 pull me into my desired goal? I was sure it was better than card #2 when I pulled it, but the scorer would tell the tale.
Card #1 was a 238/1X. The disappointing card #2 proved to be only a 228/3X. Better on the X count, but far short of the 238. Card #3 was a 235/1X for a total of 701/5X. Yahoo!
I felt a great sense of accomplishment breaking into that coveted 700 club! While the X count was below my previous count of 9, the overall score was 22 points higher. I credit this to not only learning a bit about the wind but also the fact that the conditions were substantially improved over the first match. We'll see how the rest of the season goes!Steve W.
Yesterday morning temperatures in SW Oregon were in the mid-60's and sunny when we normally start our outdoor matches. Today was overcast, in the mid 50's, and with a switchy wind! It was not conducive to good scores in any discipline and everyone shot below their expectations. My first card gave me a sinking feeling in the pit of my stomach knowing it would not score well, and I found out at the end of the day that my feelings were correct. It was a 218/1X. The second card gave me a much better feeling, and I thought it might end up being respectable given the windy conditions. In actuality several shots went right where I wanted them when holding off. And yes, it was better - 228/1X. The final card had some shots into the 6 ring, and I did not hold out much hope. I felt really good when it scored 227/1X. So, the day ended with a 673/3X, not a barn burner of a day. Crummy score, but I had fun! We will see what the month of June holds for the lowly Marauder!
Steve W.
It was not conducive to good scores in any discipline and everyone shot below their expectations. My first card gave me a sinking feeling in the pit of my stomach knowing it would not score well, and I found out at the end of the day that my feelings were correct. It was a 218/1X. The second card gave me a much better feeling, and I thought it might end up being respectable given the windy conditions. In actuality several shots went right where I wanted them when holding off. And yes, it was better - 228/1X. The final card had some shots into the 6 ring, and I did not hold out much hope. I felt really good when it scored 227/1X. So, the day ended with a 673/3X, not a barn burner of a day. Crummy score, but I had fun! We will see what the month of June holds for the lowly Marauder!Steve W.
C
cris
Guest
Steve,
Shooting outdoors is definitely different than shooting indoors. Holding off near the 6 ring does take courage and a little getting used to. I hesitate to make another suggestion, especially since I have so lttle experience indoors but try another pellet that looked good indoors, even if it was not your first choice. Stay after it.
Shooting outdoors is definitely different than shooting indoors. Holding off near the 6 ring does take courage and a little getting used to. I hesitate to make another suggestion, especially since I have so lttle experience indoors but try another pellet that looked good indoors, even if it was not your first choice. Stay after it.
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Hi Steve,
As you saw from Mike's match report, everyone had a challenging (trying to be kind here & stay away from the four letter words.) day. It is what separates the wheat from the chaff.
As an aside, I shot an out of the box .22 caliber Pneuma at Wacky Wayne's a couple of weeks ago. The accuracy was killer, but the trigger was 12 pounds and not much lighter after adjustment per the manual. Also, there are no tuning instructions in the manual; thus, it is a search for pellets only. I was considering buying one as they are well priced, but the trigger has really turned me off! So, BobZ, how is the trigger on the Pneuma you guys are shooting and how many shots are you getting per fill? Also, is it a .177 or .22? Thanks in advance!
Steve W.
As you saw from Mike's match report, everyone had a challenging (trying to be kind here & stay away from the four letter words.
) day. It is what separates the wheat from the chaff. As an aside, I shot an out of the box .22 caliber Pneuma at Wacky Wayne's a couple of weeks ago. The accuracy was killer, but the trigger was 12 pounds and not much lighter after adjustment per the manual. Also, there are no tuning instructions in the manual; thus, it is a search for pellets only. I was considering buying one as they are well priced, but the trigger has really turned me off!
So, BobZ, how is the trigger on the Pneuma you guys are shooting and how many shots are you getting per fill? Also, is it a .177 or .22? Thanks in advance!Steve W.
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Wayne Burns
Guest
Steve W.
You should have hung around after the match.. Chris Lovitt got out the Pneuma... I had asked him to work on it for us.. I shot it in that tricky wind.. and it was doing pretty darn good for accuracy.. BUT, the really great news is he got that trigger down under a pound!! It's super great now!! With some work.. this can be a great rig for the money!!
Wacky Wayne
You should have hung around after the match.. Chris Lovitt got out the Pneuma... I had asked him to work on it for us.. I shot it in that tricky wind.. and it was doing pretty darn good for accuracy.. BUT, the really great news is he got that trigger down under a pound!! It's super great now!! With some work.. this can be a great rig for the money!!
Wacky Wayne
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Wayne Burns
Guest
Steve and all,
I'll presume the "Production" class rules are still up for debate... for future years.
Why have a rule that is not realist to enforce?
Other than asking each time.. there is really no way to know if someone has done their trigger.. or de-burred a transfer port.. or installed an "O" ring on the hammer for more shots.. and trying to police such matters, is not in the spirit of the "intro" class.
Let's have it more about stock design and using bags to guide the gun to the proper location... and maybe original price point to some degree.. but tinkering is a big part of what most of us air gunners do... why out law it in a class that's supposed to be about a "low price point" competition.
We are seeing some, not a lot of shooters with much higher priced rigs, choose to shoot in this low price point class, which it seems, would raise the chances of "tinkering".. then what kind of internal political mess are we potentially starting in our clubs?
just my humble opinion..
although, on the other hand,.. if we used totally "out of the box" rigs, under a very tough price point limit, as we are currently doing, without fiddling... and then COMPLAIN REAL LOUD on the forums.. maybe the manufactures will hear us and improve their products and prices... a real good thing.. BUT, a long hard road, not many are willing to journey, so will the class end up "adding to our club ranks".. again.. just my humble opinion
Wacky Wayne
I'll presume the "Production" class rules are still up for debate... for future years.
Why have a rule that is not realist to enforce?
Other than asking each time.. there is really no way to know if someone has done their trigger.. or de-burred a transfer port.. or installed an "O" ring on the hammer for more shots.. and trying to police such matters, is not in the spirit of the "intro" class.
Let's have it more about stock design and using bags to guide the gun to the proper location... and maybe original price point to some degree.. but tinkering is a big part of what most of us air gunners do... why out law it in a class that's supposed to be about a "low price point" competition.
We are seeing some, not a lot of shooters with much higher priced rigs, choose to shoot in this low price point class, which it seems, would raise the chances of "tinkering".. then what kind of internal political mess are we potentially starting in our clubs?
just my humble opinion..
although, on the other hand,
.. if we used totally "out of the box" rigs, under a very tough price point limit, as we are currently doing, without fiddling... and then COMPLAIN REAL LOUD on the forums.. maybe the manufactures will hear us and improve their products and prices... a real good thing.. BUT, a long hard road, not many are willing to journey, so will the class end up "adding to our club ranks".. again.. just my humble opinionWacky Wayne
C
cris
Guest
Wayne,
I was not going to respond to your post but at least I waited until today to do so.
Rules are always open to intelligent discussion. Allow me to address your main point.
"Why have a rule that is not realist to enforce?"
Using that logic, shooters can cheat with power levels and weight limits just as easily. Match directors can ask but without objective measurements an Open class rifle could be shot in HV and HV or LV rifles could be seriously over the weight limit.
Hopefully, we will not see that type of behavior creep into our ranks.
On stock design, you had better have precise measurements to make this a fair and equal requirement, rather than someone's opinion.
Last, those shooters that enjoy "tinkering" have plenty of classes to display their prowess and compete honestly.
I was not going to respond to your post but at least I waited until today to do so.
Rules are always open to intelligent discussion. Allow me to address your main point.
"Why have a rule that is not realist to enforce?"
Using that logic, shooters can cheat with power levels and weight limits just as easily. Match directors can ask but without objective measurements an Open class rifle could be shot in HV and HV or LV rifles could be seriously over the weight limit.
Hopefully, we will not see that type of behavior creep into our ranks.
On stock design, you had better have precise measurements to make this a fair and equal requirement, rather than someone's opinion.
Last, those shooters that enjoy "tinkering" have plenty of classes to display their prowess and compete honestly.
W
Wayne Burns
Guest
Steve,
Testing for weight and power are much easier to do than testing for interior trigger or barrel work, although most match directors only do it at the championship level. One would have to disassemble a rig to see if the trigger has been worked on.. or if a barrel transfer port has been cleaned up... seems different to me.. but I'm probably wrong about that
I agree that our sport is based on the "Honor" system and policing is not a high priority.. nor should it be! But if someone in the club complains that another member "must have worked on their trigger, or worked on their barrel or even changed their barrel inside that shroud"... what does the match director do then? Maybe it's not an issue and I'm just a worry wart
"On stock design, you had better have precise measurements to make this a fair and equal requirement, rather than someone's opinion." ... Well, it seems to me that gun makers sell "sporter" style and "adjustable" target stocks.. or "bench rest stocks".. a match director can easily tell the difference.
Although there are classes for "tinkers"... there is also no rule saying they can't play in the "production class"... and when they do... and their rig shoots so much better than everyone else's.. what then? Does the Match Director follow up on someone's suspicions??
I'm not trying to pick a fight here.. your points are very valid.. I'm just offering food for thought as we consider this new "test" class for future years..
Wacky Wayne Burns,
Match Director,
Ashland Air Rifle Range
Testing for weight and power are much easier to do than testing for interior trigger or barrel work, although most match directors only do it at the championship level. One would have to disassemble a rig to see if the trigger has been worked on.. or if a barrel transfer port has been cleaned up... seems different to me.. but I'm probably wrong about that
I agree that our sport is based on the "Honor" system and policing is not a high priority.. nor should it be! But if someone in the club complains that another member "must have worked on their trigger, or worked on their barrel or even changed their barrel inside that shroud"... what does the match director do then? Maybe it's not an issue and I'm just a worry wart
"On stock design, you had better have precise measurements to make this a fair and equal requirement, rather than someone's opinion." ... Well, it seems to me that gun makers sell "sporter" style and "adjustable" target stocks.. or "bench rest stocks".. a match director can easily tell the difference.
Although there are classes for "tinkers"... there is also no rule saying they can't play in the "production class"... and when they do... and their rig shoots so much better than everyone else's.. what then? Does the Match Director follow up on someone's suspicions??
I'm not trying to pick a fight here.. your points are very valid.. I'm just offering food for thought as we consider this new "test" class for future years..
Wacky Wayne Burns,
Match Director,
Ashland Air Rifle Range
C
cris
Guest
Wayne,
All good points. Only time will tell. The match directors and shooters have the best perspective on what path the rules should follow.
All good points. Only time will tell. The match directors and shooters have the best perspective on what path the rules should follow.
No, I am not dead and I have not given up the sport! However, I was relaxing on the Oregon coast, eating fresh seafood, and quaffing some excellent micro-brew! Thus, I missed the last match in May. Today was the first match since my return. My mentor & coach suggested that this thread should be entitled "X Marks the Spot" as I had the highest 3 card "X" count of all my outdoor matches - 14.
The first 2 cards were right in my average but with a higher than usual "X" count, 6 per card. The scores were a 236 & 231. And, that is the good news for the day. Card 3 was in the toilet, 221 - 2X. But, several others struggled on card 3 also. I can only believe that the wind was just a bit switchier than earlier in the day.
However, I can count several successes for the day, especially on card 3. I had to hold off low and in the 6 ring on a few of the shots and even managed a X with one of these excessively big hold offs as well as some in the 10 ring. I also attribute the 6 X count on cards 1 and 2 to some successful holds.
So, 12 cards are in the bag with 3 left the last Wednesday of the month! We can only hope for calm winds!
Steve W.
Thus, I missed the last match in May. Today was the first match since my return. My mentor & coach suggested that this thread should be entitled "X Marks the Spot" as I had the highest 3 card "X" count of all my outdoor matches - 14.The first 2 cards were right in my average but with a higher than usual "X" count, 6 per card. The scores were a 236 & 231. And, that is the good news for the day. Card 3 was in the toilet, 221 - 2X. But, several others struggled on card 3 also. I can only believe that the wind was just a bit switchier than earlier in the day.
However, I can count several successes for the day, especially on card 3. I had to hold off low and in the 6 ring on a few of the shots and even managed a X with one of these excessively big hold offs as well as some in the 10 ring. I also attribute the 6 X count on cards 1 and 2 to some successful holds.
So, 12 cards are in the bag with 3 left the last Wednesday of the month! We can only hope for calm winds!
Steve W.
Unfortunately, I am not able to make the final benchrest match of June. Steve, I don't know if you will count best 9 of 12 or not. I am not sure what your rules are concerning that. I have had my house on the market over a year, and it is now in escrow. (The market in SW Oregon is terribly depressed.) This morning is the septic tank inspection, and I must be here.
I wish I could have shot the last 3 cards, but it was just not in the cards! (Bad pun I know.) However, I will still be here reporting on how things go.
All the best to the Wild River Air Rifle gang this AM!
Yours,
Steve W.
I wish I could have shot the last 3 cards, but it was just not in the cards!
(Bad pun I know.) However, I will still be here reporting on how things go.All the best to the Wild River Air Rifle gang this AM!
Yours,
Steve W.
C
cris
Guest
Steve,
I think a best 9 out of 12 can be done. Good luck on your closing.
I think a best 9 out of 12 can be done. Good luck on your closing.
No, I am not dead and I have not given up the sport! Unfortunately, the sale of my house (still not completed), moving into a rental, and getting a construction loan approved consumed most of my time these past few weeks. Today was the first time I had a Wednesday morning free on match day, and it felt darned good to be back!
First, I need to give some credit where credit is do. Chris Lovitt built what I call a Breeze-O-Meter to measure cross winds. It is a rather strange looking contraption, two Styrofoam cups glued together mouth to mouth, mounted on a stick with a counter weight at the bottom mounted on half a bicycle wheel on a tripod. He painted the arch of the wheel alternating black and grey bars to indicate wind speed. I paid quite a bit of attention to it and darned if the pellets went more or less where I wanted them to if I held off as the Breeze-O-Meter indicated.
It had been so long since I shot that I had kind of forgotten prior scores. I ended up with a 230-2X, 231-1X, and 236-4X for a 697-7X. When I went back and looked at the Scoreline scores, I was pleased to see that this was my second best score of the outdoor season even though the X count was kind of middle of the road.
The Marauder will not ever be a 250 rifle, but I am having fun with it and I'm thinking that is what it is all about anyway. I will continue to out shoot myself each match. Ron keeps telling me I need to buy an EV2, but I keep telling him I have to build a house!
Steve W.
Unfortunately, the sale of my house (still not completed), moving into a rental, and getting a construction loan approved consumed most of my time these past few weeks. Today was the first time I had a Wednesday morning free on match day, and it felt darned good to be back!First, I need to give some credit where credit is do. Chris Lovitt built what I call a Breeze-O-Meter to measure cross winds. It is a rather strange looking contraption, two Styrofoam cups glued together mouth to mouth, mounted on a stick with a counter weight at the bottom mounted on half a bicycle wheel on a tripod. He painted the arch of the wheel alternating black and grey bars to indicate wind speed. I paid quite a bit of attention to it and darned if the pellets went more or less where I wanted them to if I held off as the Breeze-O-Meter indicated.
It had been so long since I shot that I had kind of forgotten prior scores. I ended up with a 230-2X, 231-1X, and 236-4X for a 697-7X. When I went back and looked at the Scoreline scores, I was pleased to see that this was my second best score of the outdoor season even though the X count was kind of middle of the road.
The Marauder will not ever be a 250 rifle, but I am having fun with it and I'm thinking that is what it is all about anyway. I will continue to out shoot myself each match. Ron keeps telling me I need to buy an EV2, but I keep telling him I have to build a house!
Steve W.
Yesterday was an absolute disaster, and most of that disaster was my own fault! (More on that later.) The wind was an absolute bear on card one giving me a dismal 225/4X. Card 2 was in the money, a 240/4X. Card 3 was where my self induced disaster happened! I shot the card and scanned all the bulls and noticed I had skipped #4. Aligning the scope and squeezing the trigger I was shocked to see TWO new holes in bull 9, directly below bull 4! I had loaded two pellets accidentally. Thus, an X in bull 9 became a minus 7! OUCH! Had I not made that major screw up, the three target score would have been 697/12X rather than 690/11X. Dumb, dumb, dumb.
Fortunately, I was not the only one to have a mental brain fade yesterday, but we will keep that person's story to ourselves not wanting to embarrass anyone else!
Steve W.
Fortunately, I was not the only one to have a mental brain fade yesterday, but we will keep that person's story to ourselves not wanting to embarrass anyone else!
Steve W.