Action Trueness Test On My Old Remington 721 I Just Bought

jackie schmidt

jackie schmidt

New member
I removed the barrel, (it was pretty tight), and it appears that it has never been off. In fact, the whole action looks unmolested, the trigger still has some sort of brown locking compound on both the front and rear adjusment screws.

I chucked the action body up in my jig just as if I were going to true it. Geeze, if they ever made a straight one back then, this sure ain't one of them. The face runs out at least .004, and the threads, as best I can tell, are eccentric and crooked by at least .010.

I took the action back out, machined and threaded a dummy tenon, screwed the action upon it, and inserted my mandrel rod from the back side. Hanging out an inch from the action, it shows about .040 runnout. The combination of crooked threads and out of square action face shows.

Also, the round action body is no where near true with the bolt way. Also, on the face of the action, there are two spots that are dead in line with the bolt raceways, about the same size and shape as the lugs. It looks like it was butted against a stop, or something, when they broached the raceways. The .0001 indicator does jump a tad when it hits these two spots. That's the only explanation I would have.


Well, there you have it. The bolt way seems to be dead on straight, as my mandrel fits it perfect, and the luggs are making good contact. I will true up the face and threads, and then decide just what I am going to do with it..........jackie
 
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Jackie, I have seen new ones run out as much... I have also seen both new and old ones run quite true... it's just the luck of the draw... even as crooked as it is and with a good barrel it would still be an excellent shooter for varmint or hunting...
 
Dennis, I have too. Everybody has the idea that "they used to make em dead straight", this shows that Action manufacturing has remained about the same as far as criticle areas running truly straight with each other. In truth, for a hunting Rifle, none of this makes one hill of beans difference.

I am going to true the threads and face, leaving the lugg abuntments alone, as they are making good contact.

I hope that the serial number does come back as it being built in 1949. But heck, even if it was 1950, I can pretend it was 1949.;)
 
Jackie,Dennis,
I don't have a clue, but am curious. Do you think Remington's machining practices were/are this crude or do you think their heat treating is responsible for the variations in these actions ?
Joel
 
Joel, since they machine the things, and continue to do so, I would say that yes, they are responsible for them being a tad crude.

But that might be a relative term. The actions are obviously true enough to serve the purpose for which they are intended.

There is no way that heat treating could acount for this, even if Remington does do the final tempering after all machine operations. But, I was under the impression that all finished machining operations were performed after heat treating.

Regardless, I am sure that Remington has updated their machinery since 1948. And their machining proccess. The product just seems to stay the same.
 
I have it on pretty good authority that all of the machining was and is done before heat treat. As the story was written, the reason that the 40xb-BRs have applied, instead of stamped lettering, below their ports is that they found that there was a slight loss of accuracy if the bottom half of receivers were not true cylinders. Because of this, the order of work was changed on the BRs so that the OD was ground after heat treatment, and since stamping would not be possible afterwords, and the hand work to correct stamping after grinding too expensive, the applied lettering was chosen. I believe that this fell within Mike Walker's tenure.

A number of years ago,perhaps a dozen, after the move from Ilion to the Sun Belt, I spoke with the manager of the Custom Shop, and asked if the same procedure was being followed. He didn't know what I was talking about. Evidently things have changed from when Mr. Walker was in charge.
 
Wow, what are the odds.

The barrel code on my old 721 is EUU, which means it was born in Oct of 1949. I was born in Feb of 1949.

This project just got better, or might I say the coolness factor just went up:D.............jackie
 
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Jackie, My dad had a 721 in 270 when I was a kid in the early 60s. It never would shoot. He tried every powder bullet combo goin about 2.5 or 3 well as I remember. He kicked himself in the butt for not gettin a mod. 70 but they were 30 bucks higher. Alot of money back then for a young buck with 2 kids. I bet something wasnt true on it. Traded it for a mod. 88 .284. Doug
 
Jackie
So tell us what you might have in mind for this old action of yours. Surely an idea or two has crossed your mind!! Do tell!!! Lee
 
I'm betting it's going to get 1 shot fired, and then go on a shelf somewhere as a keepsake. But, who knows. Might end up a gift for the kids, or who knows.

When you mention that the threads were out as far as they were, it makes me wonder how that's even possible. I sit and think about it, if I were making these in mass production, how would it be done, etc. Even if that thing was put against a fence and run with a tap in a hand tapper, (with a big handle!), I'd bet it would be straighter than that. No, .010 over the face of the action (1.4xx) isn't all that bad and certainly won't be a problem for basic gun funciton, but, I'd still say it's a lot. At that point, it begins to be a major error in the tolerance stack that affects the headspace. And I'm betting they never did a "fit" for headspacing the barrels.

Still, if that's all things are off, it'll be easy enough to clean it up and get it right. The thread being eccentric doesn't surprise me any, and in fact I'd expect that.

For what I've seen of the gun industry, I'd say that most improvements done in the past 80 years have been things that the manufacturers were forced into by the new equipment purchases they were again, forced to make. As new equipment and machinery becomes available, you either buy it and use it, or, become uncompetitive just from a time-to-production standpoint. Just by virtue of the need for automation in mass production work, you are forced to make better stuff nowadays. Or at least, use better processes. I guess I should say that IF you really want to make nicer stuff, it's tough not to. The difficulty is beating all the bean counters who have figured out that it is more profitable to make junk, and sell it 20 times.
 
4mesh, I have seen modern 700's just as bad, I figure this action is about typical of production pieces. After I true the threads and face, it will be a nice piece.

As for what I am going to do with it?? I want to build a nice custom, either in 30-06, or 280 Remington. Add a nice HS Precision Stock, a 6-18 variable Leupold, a jewell trigger, (although the originol feels pretty good), bed it to perfection, give it a nice polish and blue job, make it pretty, and in short, even though it is the same age as me, give it a new lease on life.........jackie
 
I have an excellent 280 reamer if you need one. I'd be glad to lend it to you.
 
257 roberts, 10 twist Shilen barrel, Belgian blued.

6.5x55 sm, 8.5 twist......284 win.....10 twist......just a few ideas.

Ben
 
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I also have a 6.5 x 55 Lapua brass match reamer (no neck turn and fairly short throat) that I would be glad to lend you as well... less recoil than the 280...
 
Back in those days when the 721-722 ,s were born, I doubt that much consideration for really true applied. Threads
certainly were not bored single point. Looking at receiver faces from early to now says that little attempt was made, as
the grind pattern has never changed. Working from PH bar stock is much cheaper than adding in Heat treat later. I suspect
that a threads were and are tapped in. I have had and still do have 40x actions which were stamped rather than etched.
One really has to work in a production environment to see why things are made as they are. My first 40x was purchased
around 1973-74 and It was bought from Rem as a bbl action in 222 with 2oz trigger for 365 bucks. I don't recall the price
the stock, but it was proportionately higher than the metal. It even came with test targets. When you consider that a
complete 40x was about 1100 bucks, its easy to see the hand bedding was quite dear. Having seen many and worked on
nearly that many, I was never able to see that the 40X ever received any extra treatment. There was little awareness
in the early days reguarding straight and true being better. Trueing came in much later. As with everything, bean counters
rule production methods
 
Call Cheechako, he's probably got brass for that thing, made the same year the rifle was!
 
Jackie,

I believe Joel Pendergraft still has his 6.5x55 AI reamer, that I (putting words in Joel's mouth) would be willing to lend you. It is a match reamer, a la the one used for Steve Shelp's 1K rifle. And as luck would have it, I have a brand-new FL sizing die to match that reamer, unused, made by Jim Carstensen. You can have the die for the shipping costs.

Charles
 
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