.30 BR powders

Pete....

What kind of velocities are you trying to get.?
I have had Cheek 112 grain bullets up to 3275 fps using H322 and WSR primers...I switched to 205 primers and slowed it down to 3050 fps..and it shoots well at that 3050, but will shoot great at 2975 also...;)
 
I never got close to that

eww1350 said:
What kind of velocities are you trying to get.?
I have had Cheek 112 grain bullets up to 3275 fps using H322 and WSR primers...I switched to 205 primers and slowed it down to 3050 fps..and it shoots well at that 3050, but will shoot great at 2975 also...;)
Click to expand...

The speeds I remember were closer to 27 or 2800.Apparently Hodgdon has gone back to the old formula.
 
No chrono today

I started way low at 33 or so and worked up to 218 Jones clicks - something like 37.5 (I have not weighed it - don't shoot it without working up to it). 218 clicks is shooting about the same elevation as my case full H4198 load. It seems snappy. And this is old powder from 1991 or so.

Now about that Truth Serum -- I read that post and I just want Mr. Apple to know that I had half a dozen kegs of that stuff and ended up burning most of it in the backyard and used the rest for fertilizer.






Not really! but I shot one total wipeout target today which looked better than the ones they showed in the thread. I ain't telling about the others.
 
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This is the problem With powders

henrya said:
I started way low at 33 or so and worked up to 218 Jones clicks - something like 37.5 (I have not weighed it - don't shoot it without working up to it). 218 clicks is shooting about the same elevation as my case full H4198 load. It seems snappy. And this is old powder from 1991 or so.

Now about that Truth Serum -- I read that post and I just want Mr. Apple to know that I had half a dozen kegs of that stuff and ended up burning most of it in the backyard and used the rest for fertilizer.





Not really! but I shot one total wipeout target today which looked better than the ones they showed in the thread. I ain't telling about the others.
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That old stuff (322) was a lot hotter than the stuff one can buy now; a lot faster. The newer stuff is as I discribed it.
 
henrya:

Hodgden's Benchmark is a very overlooked powder for the 30BR. With the 118-ish stuff, things get good around 36.0 gr. and 2,950 or so. If you have a 'zero' freebore reamer and are using the 1.00" jacketed bullets with a 7 ogive, the base of the bullet gets down the neck a ways. With a bit of freebore (.030-.035) and this same bullet, or 'zero' freebore and the 10 ogive 1.00" longs or the 7 ogive .925's, the base of the bullet is up further in the neck to let you get some more powder in there.

Tough to beat H4198 Extreme. It burns cleanly, especially at the upper end of the pressure curve. I shoot an entire yardage, including the warmup, without cleaning. We shoot two yardages per day out here, so I just clean after the 100.

I use H4198 in my HBR rig as well. With another 7 gr. in it than my 30BR uses, it's a bit dirtier at the end of a yardage than my 30BR, but not bad.

Randy Robinett and David Apple have another name for the Truth Serum powder: 'Vita-Viagra-O-Boy-O-Boy'. :D
 
Pete is correct . . .

Al Nyhus said:
Hodgden's Benchmark is a very overlooked powder for the 30BR. With the 118-ish stuff, things get good around 36.0 gr. and 2,950 or so. If you have a 'zero' freebore reamer and are using the 1.00" jacketed bullets with a 7 ogive, the base of the bullet gets down the neck a ways. With a bit of freebore (.030-.035) and this same bullet, or 'zero' freebore and the 10 ogive 1.00" longs or the 7 ogive .925's, the base of the bullet is up further in the neck to let you get some more powder in there.

Tough to beat H4198 Extreme. It burns cleanly, especially at the upper end of the pressure curve. I shoot an entire yardage, including the warmup, without cleaning. We shoot two yardages per day out here, so I just clean after the 100.

I use H4198 in my HBR rig as well. With another 7 gr. in it than my 30BR uses, it's a bit dirtier at the end of a yardage than my 30BR, but not bad.

Randy Robinett and David Apple have another name for the Truth Serum powder: 'Vita-Viagra-O-Boy-O-Boy'. :D
Click to expand...

The latest incarnation of H-322(EXTREME), made by ADI, of Austrailia, is SLOWER than the stuff of earlier eras. The bulk density comparison between H-4198 (EXTREME) ,also an ADI produced powder, and H-322(EXTREME), as relates to a [BR] case-FUll of either:
with the Jones set to throw 34.6 Gr. of H-4198, the same volume (powder measurer setting) of H-322 weighs 37.0 Gr. - this for the Lots I compared in 2004. Though the burn rate of the H-322 is slower, one can easily get another 2.5 Gr. into the BR case, which helps mitigate the burn-rate differential.

Still, the probable "reason" people neglect the "322 -EXTREME" is the relatively slow muzzle velocity - 2900 to 2920 FPS being about normal for a case-full of the stuff. So, from the heavily compressed load, there is nowhere to go but DOWN . . . who wants to do that?:confused: And, when, with other powder options, equal or better precision is the norm - and at an easily attainable 100 FPS + increase - who doesn't want THAT? :eek::D

Though H-322 does shoot extremely well, few people will tolerate the heavily compressed load - most simply will not go to a bushing [diameter] which provides enough grip (neck-tension) to keep the bullets seated to the desired position. I left it early on, due to the lower velocity: most people have experienced the same result. DITTO the slightly SLOWER BenchMark.

However, when a barrel, "demands something different" , there are a LOT of options out there . . . when you find a "killer" powder, keep it to yourself, 'cause if you share the secret, it'll get bought-up before you can whip out your wallet! :eek:;)

Thanks to Mike Swartz, I have a nice stash of [well aged] MAGIC POWDER . . and , as Al noted on the SGR /Bench-Talk forum, the instruction/coloring book to go with it! :eek::D RG
 
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Thanks for all the good discussion on this.

I would find something I can't get any more of. I guess when this 1.5- 2 pounds is gone, its gone.

My 90s vintage H322 loads about 4/5 ths up the neck, just to the base of the bullet and as I wrote seems OK on velocity. Although I haven't shot it enough to be positive it sure looked just right - a case full without compression or the tedious handling of too much fill, great metering through the measure, super clean burning and accuracy.

I guess I'll be trying some current lots of powder soon enough.
 
Try some - -

Reloader-7 if you have trrouble getting H-4198. I am finding that I like it.
 
Henrya...

Try the H322 in your next VFS match then decide if you think it will work for you...I have shot against competitors that use N-130, H4198, BenchMark...and have won against all...My score stands as our Range Record..I have a cheap Pro-Chrony chronograph...but I have no problems getting all the fps I need...as you I load up the neck to where the bullet will just touch it when seated...I shoot Ronnie Cheeks 112 grain bullets, but his 118 grn bullets are made in the same die with a little more lead...both shoot great over H322 so I shoot the lighter one in my 18 twist Krieger barrel with a zero freebore chamber...

Good Luck
Shoot their eyes out..:D
 
R. G. Robinett said:
"....as Al noted on the SGR /Bench-Talk forum, the instruction/coloring book to go with it! :eek::D RG
Click to expand...

If anyone is lucky enough to stumble onto an abandoned Citroen with the trunk stuffed full of Truth Serum aka. Magic Powder, make sure and see if there's a factory loading manual hidden among the other contraband. There is exactly one copy known to exist in the United States...the one belonging to Randy Robinett.

The Magic Powder was reportedly mixed in the bathtubs of empty Motel 6 rooms. The manuals never arrived at their shipping destination after being lost somewhere along the route in the Paris to Dakkar Rally.

How the intrepid bullet maker from Iowa wrangled a copy is anyones guess...:confused:

If you ever see one of these at a yard sale or fleamarket...whip out your folding money!

magicpowder.jpg
[/IMG]
 
Gotta wonder why

Hodgdon calls it 322, eh? Certinly there is a slower powder of old that more closely resembles what the current H-322 is.
 
Now about that Truth Serum -- I read that post and I just want Mr. Apple to know that I had half a dozen kegs of that stuff and ended up burning most of it in the backyard and used the rest for fertilizer.
Not really! but I shot one total wipeout target today which looked better than the ones they showed in the thread. I ain't telling about the others.[/QUOTE]

Shame on ya Henry :eek:
 
Why is it the best powders sometimes seem to be the ones we can't get anymore???

Tony
 
Sorta like Women, eh?

Some of us would like to have the ones we can't get, never mind mebby could ever!

Another Hodgdon powder that was slowed considerably is 2015. That shoots good but it is sloOOOOO.

I traded 16 lbs of 4197 for 16 LBS of Truth Serum last summer. I thought at the time that I had made a poor deal but NOW !!! :)
 
Tony C said:
Why is it the best powders sometimes seem to be the ones we can't get anymore??? Tony
Click to expand...

Tony, it's human nature to want what isn't available. :D A perfect example of this is the excellent B&L 36X scopes: when they were available from B&L you could buy them for around $350. Now that they're not produced, a used one will run more than that and a n.i.b. one will be around $600. Same goes for the older Leupold 36X BR-D models.

Good powders for the 30BR are as close as your local gun shop. :) -Al
 
"Good powders for the 30BR are as close as your local gun shop. :) -Al"

You may also want to check out your local Motel 6 as well.......:p
 
following up....

I shot some current manufacture H322 and H4198 a couple of days ago. Both shot very well and to practically the same point of impact. I shot one small group with each powder and some so-so groups, 60 rounds total. This was with new brass but when I got a good condition the holes were going where they should. I did not chronograph.

One nice thing is that both powders are easier to get into the case than the old style 4198. The other nice thing is that I think I could use either with success.

I'm not sure but I think 4198 may want more tension and/or tighter jam. I might have gotten some vertical I shouldn't have. I'll try them both again with tighter neck grip and maybe the chrono.
 
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