22/250ai Verses 220 Swift

M

murphy

Guest
Can any body tell Me how these compare balistics wise. Have no experience with either but should think that 22/250AI would be better because of its more modern shape ,:confused:but does it have the horsepower?
 
No HUGE difference....

....I would go w/ the swift to avoid fire forming and resale for wildcats is tough.

pf
 
22-250 Ai

I have both. They are pretty much equal on speed,barrel life, and all that jazz. I would go with the 22-250AI over the swift for the following reasons, Swifts are very sensitive to tempature,good brass is high and brass always has to be trimmed cases grow like wild fire.

The 22-250 AI, good brass is cheap and all over the place, you can use reg. 22-250 loads if you want and blast varmints with them instead of wasting barrel life fireforming cases, brass does not grow as fast and a more well rounded cartridge.
 
22-250AI is a winner

CWG said:
250AI +1
lots and lots of cheap brass- if you sell, sell with dies formed brass-
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+1 on the 22-250 AI for all the reasons stated above. I built a fast twist (1:8) for the 75-80s low drag over the winter. Love it. Good brass. I have shot some 4 times with neck sizing only before I had to bump the shoulders back. The only advantage the swift has IMHO is the cost of the reloading dies. I got the Redding set with the S-type bushing neck die, body die, and Comp seater. About $160 if I remember right. I never looked back. In fact a slower twist 22-250AI is in my future as well. Maybe a traditional 1:14 for hyper speed stuff.

tiny
 
Cheap Brass ????????

The 22-250 AI said:
Not so fast. The lots of cheap brass you speak of is not cheap. The AI is nothing more than a 22.250 with the shoulder blown out for more case capacity. The brass for the swift is no more expensive than the brass for the 250. 34.00 a 100 for remington or WW. 39.95 for 50 nosler customs(80 cents per) Norma for 94.99 per 100. Nosler does not currently sell 220 swift brass, but as for the others, check midwayUSA and you will find that the brass for the swift is about a buck a 100 more. So if cheap brass is the only reason for the AI, stick with the granddaddy of all varmint cartridges circa 1935, and keep a good cartridge alive.
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To CHeetahman

Do you have any hard evidence that the Swift does all of these bad things. Ever do any valid testing? If so, kindly publish your test methods and results for all to see.

I have been shooting Swifts for nearly 50 years and I have never found it to be any different to load and shoot than any other cartridge!

I have grown tired of people making claims about the Swift that just plain and simple untrue. Show us your research!

Enough for now,

Zeke
 
Swift versus the 22-250AI

I totally agree that the brass is about the same cost for the 220 Swift as the 22-250 parent. I actually buy the Win white box 45 gr 22-250 to fire-form in my 22-250 AI. It shoots amazing well. The last I got was $19.99/box of 40. Hard to beat that price and great varmint round to play with while fire forming. Didn't know Nolser and Norma made brass for the Swift. I was told they didn't. Never researched it. Still the likelihood of picking up some once-fired 22-250 brass at the range is a whole lot higher than swift brass. One of the men that taught me how to reload in the 80s was a Swift fan. His only complainant was the fact that he had to FL size ever time and he had a very limited selection of factory ammo to choose from. Probably fewer choices today for factory ammo in the Swift than 30 years ago. I agree the Swift is a great cartridge, but I think the 22-250 AI is a performance equal and the longer case life is a plus for me. I get pretty anal about prep and sorting brass.

tiny
 
220 vs. 22-250 AI

Hi,

I have both and I think it is a personal perference. It appears the 220 Swift has an edege in the accuracy department, but that is up to each rifle and shooter. I would take the 220 Swift, after all it is the king of varmit cartidges.

Howard
 
A big thank You.

Just a big thank You for answering My questions. When the share market picks up again I am going to get another rifle,probably a 22/250 and get the chamber recut to AI. Not because of the difference in the cartridges,but simply because there is a better choice in second hand rifles. Reguards Murphy.
 
Just been told I have throat erosion in my 22-250AI

I have a 26" Cut rifled 5R 8" twist .Including fire forming I bet less then 500 rnds have been through it. Its a sporter weight BBL Cooper Classic with after market BBL. Its got plenty of horse power but not with out its cost. I get 3/4 MOA not bad for a walking varmint/predator rifle I'm just dissapointed in the throat erosion.39grs of IMR 4064 behind a 55 gr Nosler BT produces 3,900+. Fire forming is a hassle from now on I'm using cornmeal and wax with 10 grs of unique .
 
You could argue this stuff all day and whatever people like is what they think is best. Years ago I had a Swift but sold it. Wish I hadn't. Since about '89 or '90 I've had 5 or 6 22-250AI's and there's always one in the truck on every trip.

With formed brass, the accuracy 50gr load in one 28" gun is at 4247fps....all holes touch or overlap. Fireforming load with another gun was a 50gr at 4113, same accuracy or slightly better. Even a rechambered well-used factory Rem sporter shot 50's at 4100 and about 1/2". You can compare those numbers to a Swift. If you get a 22-250AI don't waste time and components fireforming with fillers, just use bullets and go shoot.....find a good load and accuracy will be terrific.
 
Aren't I wasting BBL life by fire forming loads?

I was told by a shooter "Just fill the case with WW 760 and 55 gr bullets". Well I did that and the accuracy was 1 1/2 to 2" MOA. May be I fired those too fast oh 10 shots in 15 minutes. Perhaps the gun smith wants some more work and told me about the throat erosion. The gun smith that built my 6x284 said the same thing about that BBL and that gun still shoots under a 1/2 MOA at 100 yds. My load that gave me the most consistency I already posted earlier in this thread. I figure if I start tweaking these loads any more my BBL will take a nose dive shiiiiiiiiiiitttttttt
 
Worker

You want to use a fast powder like IMR 4895 and a 50 to 55 gr bullet seated well into the rifling and that should get you some well formed cases the first go. I used the cream of wheat method and I don't think it works well at all. Half the cases formed and the others did not. When I fireform loads I don't waste them on paper I use them on varmints, make them count. True it may take a while to get a supply of fireformed cases but your killing two birds with one stone. Forming cases and killing hogs
 
murphy said:
Can any body tell Me how these compare balistics wise. Have no experience with either but should think that 22/250AI would be better because of its more modern shape ,:confused:but does it have the horsepower?
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I don't have an AI but did shoot a std 22-250 until the barrel washed. It was a custom model with a Shilen barrel. I have a Savage 112 BVSS-S in 220 Swift and it is about ready to be rebarreled, but I got twice as many rounds through it. Personally I like the Swift better. I think the longer neck on the Swift is much easier to load than the 250 and according to some experts has a longer barrel life. You will have to load your own with the AI and there are some other options which I think are better. The short version of the 250 developed by Bob Greenleaf or the 22 BR, which I just got back from the smith and so far I like it much better than the 22-250
I had problems with split necks with the 250 and have had very little case failure with the Swift. Sure you can load the 250 AI to shoot balistically with the Swift but you better have a good supply of barrels. Loadem hot and you will be lucky to get a thousand rounds through it...
 
King 220 Swift

OK heres a little something on the swift from the reloaders den.

The 220 Swift was and still is the fastest commercial cartridge in the world. It is also one of the most accurate super velocity 22 cartridges ever developed. Its popularity has benn somewhat retarded by the fact that the ammunition in this caliber is expensive. Swift barrels have never been noted for long life, but this factor has been negated to a large degree by development of modern, erosion resistant barrel steels since WWII. Factory ammunition has always featured the 48 grain and 50 grain bullets, but the Swift is considered adequate on all animals up to deer size. There is certainly plenty of field evidence to demonstrate on occasion it will give fantastic one shot kills on deer and antelope. However the 220 Swift tends to be erratic in its performance on large animals, and most states will not permit its use on big game of any kind. Properly constructed bullets would almost certainly solve this problem on animals to mule deer size. In any case, factory bullets are designed for quick expansion on light animals. Most varmint hunters agree that the 220 Swift is the best varmint cartridge made. It remains a popular caliber despite the fact that no domestic major manufacturer offers it.

Now since you have to compare the 22.250 AI to the swift, then there must be some truth to the fact that the 220 Swift after 70 some years is still the hyper velocity 22 caliber round considered to be the benchmark to judge all others by

THEN LONG LIVE THE KING


And by the way, I have never had temperature problems, case neck growth ( I get 12 to 13 reloads out of neck sized brass, not so with my 250.) or any of the other nasty drawbacks attributed to this exceptional caliber.
 
To Waylan.

Is your Savage a straight factory rifle? Was not aware that Savage made 220Swift. Do you know if they still make them, as I would be very interested in a Savage though the laminated stocked Rugers are a nice looking rifle also,:confused:
 
Savage dropped the Swift a number of years ago

I don't thing they have made it in over 5 years. Don't have a positive day. You still see the ocassional take-off barrel that some puts up for sale, but the are usually grabbed quickly. There is a guy named Hammer on a different forum that seems to own about half of them made or at least that is his goal. He's got a bunch of them. You can get a Shilen pre-fit chambered in your Swift for $279. Then it is best of all worlds. Easy to do the barrel swap on the Savage.

tiny
 
murphy said:
Is your Savage a straight factory rifle? Was not aware that Savage made 220Swift. Do you know if they still make them, as I would be very interested in a Savage though the laminated stocked Rugers are a nice looking rifle also,:confused:
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I think they still offer a Swift similar to mine in their 12 series varmint. Mine is a factory model 112BVSS-S. It is an older gun, laminated stock, single shot, stainless fluted barrel varmint weight. I bought the gun used so I can't be sure of the number of rounds thru it. Evidently it had been shot a few times judging from the amount of copper and gunk in the barrel. I did four 24 hour soakings before I got the barrel clean. I have put at least 1500 down the tube since I have owned it. Most accurate load is 52 gr. Berger match with IMR 4064 pushing it at around 3700 fps. At present I cannot touch the lands with the 52 Bergers but it stull shoots .5"-.75" at 100 yds. on a regular basis, and occasionally throws out a .2" or .3".
 
DR4NRA said:
OK heres a little something on the swift from the reloaders den.

The 220 Swift was and still is the fastest commercial cartridge in the world. It is also one of the most accurate super velocity 22 cartridges ever developed. Its popularity has benn somewhat retarded by the fact that the ammunition in this caliber is expensive. Swift barrels have never been noted for long life, but this factor has been negated to a large degree by development of modern, erosion resistant barrel steels since WWII. Factory ammunition has always featured the 48 grain and 50 grain bullets, but the Swift is considered adequate on all animals up to deer size. There is certainly plenty of field evidence to demonstrate on occasion it will give fantastic one shot kills on deer and antelope. However the 220 Swift tends to be erratic in its performance on large animals, and most states will not permit its use on big game of any kind. Properly constructed bullets would almost certainly solve this problem on animals to mule deer size. In any case, factory bullets are designed for quick expansion on light animals. Most varmint hunters agree that the 220 Swift is the best varmint cartridge made. It remains a popular caliber despite the fact that no domestic major manufacturer offers it.

Now since you have to compare the 22.250 AI to the swift, then there must be some truth to the fact that the 220 Swift after 70 some years is still the hyper velocity 22 caliber round considered to be the benchmark to judge all others by

THEN LONG LIVE THE KING


And by the way, I have never had temperature problems, case neck growth ( I get 12 to 13 reloads out of neck sized brass, not so with my 250.) or any of the other nasty drawbacks attributed to this exceptional caliber.
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Well stated, nuff said, AMEN!!!
 
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