Barrel length vs velocity

this morning i asked tomc if he was posting under a different name because we had talked about the same damned thing a few days ago. and like posted by somebody else it does look like the bullet is going to the right when i see it coming down into the target.

i couldn't believe it when somebody posted something about the exact samething me and a friend had talked about over the phone!!

tomc is your phone bugged by a new guy trying to learn your personal secrets about shooting rimfire matches at you local club?? thier out to get you man:D!!!! we need a new batphone for our talks at our homes!!!!!
 
cork screwing of bullet

Caused by coriolis effect or rotation of earth on its axis, con..... also say woman who fly airplane upside down have crackup.
 
some people just see better than others, i've been able
to see slower stuff that hits 3 rings low. i just catch it as
it arcs downward, i can't see it all the way out, wish i could.
never noticed any side movement. just straight down unless
there was a little wind.
 
Lion, the reason anyone can see the round left to right is the parallax is set for a shorter distance. to check parallax setting, move your head left and right if, when moving your head left the target dances around the parallax is set wrong. you should be able to move your head about and the crosshairs stays on target.if the parallax is set properly and you have a high quality scope and your eyes are good you should see the round breifly at the target, seeing the round as a curve ball is an indication the parallax is off a lot. move your head left and the target shifts right of crosshairs parallax too far, right and shift to lef too close.
 
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martin hammond said:
Lion, the reason anyone can see the round left to right is the parallax is set for a shorter distance. to check parallax setting, move your head left and right if, when moving your head left the target dances around the parallax is set wrong. you should be able to move your head about and the crosshairs stays on target.if the parallax is set properly and you have a high quality scope and your eyes are good you should see the round breifly at the target, seeing the round as a curve ball is an indication the parallax is off a lot. move your head left and the target shifts right of crosshairs parallax too far, right and shift to lef too close.
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Then only time I've seen it consistently is when it's slooow. Either long distances, long barrels, or Eley Lite (everytime). Still enough for me to prove that it is slooow. At least in relative terms.
 
I can attest that when shooting slow ammo I can see my bullet travel the major part of the distance to the target.I can also say that sporter profiles shoot much faster than my suhl.I have shot the exact same ammo back to back in a sporter then in my suhl and there is absolutely no doubt the sporter is shooting much faster and flatter than my long barrelled gun(In my humble view).My parallax(sp?) was correct on both guns also.It seems that it is fairly easy to see a round if you get up closer to the scope where the whole field of view is viewed.Some people(me included) most of the time shoot where we are back away from the scope to the point that we only have the small dot in the middle focused, but if you pull up and get the whole field of view it is very easy to see the rounds travel then.Just my 2 cents.
 
if seeing the flight of the bullet was from anything other than parallax it would travel the path of the vertical reticle.
 
When CCI .22 rf ammo became more common here in the late 60's-early 70's published test results indicated that the propellant and bullet combination produced its maximum velocity within the first sixteen inches of travel. Longer barrels used in those tests produced noticably lower velocities.

I may still have the book with the complete test results, but doubt I'd find it other than by accident.

IIRC the tests were run on a number of popular .22 rf cartridges, the same barrels used and cut and crowned for each stage of the tests to find optimal barrel length for each.
Short barreled survival rifles and carbine sized .22s like the 10/22 were becoming popular at that time, so people wanted the best performance from a short tube.

I remember it being stated that best velocity in a short barrel was a goal of CCI due to the large numbers of cut down trappers rifles in use in Canada, with barrels as short as 14 inches.
There were many of the old pocket rifles and break down single shot pistols still in use for dispatching trapped critters and garden pests.

I always use CCI .22 in my short barreled guns when velocity is important.

Only time I remembering having seen my bullets in flight is when shooting .38 Sp and only when the light was just right.
 
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martin hammond said:
if seeing the flight of the bullet was from anything other than parallax it would travel the path of the vertical reticle.
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Not true at all, the bullet travels in an arc from(with right twist barrels) left to right in the form of a "c" because of the twist of the bullet, just like a curve ball in baseball.If the bullet wasnt twisting then maybe you would be right.
 
And here I thought I'd gotten away from all this when I switched from skeet to single projectiles. Many skeet shooters claim they can see the shot string. I could see it only when it cut a path through rain. I don't doubt that some can but I was never blessed with superior eye sight. Skeet loads leave the muzzle at about 1150 fps. Even the little .410 with its half ounce of shot is MUCH bigger than a 40 grain .22. Ain't no way I'm buying watching the bullet curve into the target. Not with my eyes! Now if you have the sight of say a Ted Williams you just ain't normal. Go ahead and brag those of you who can count the fleas on a fly at 50 yards. bob
 
Mike, the bullet travels in an arc because? that's where the barrel is pointed. the bullet itself is incapable of an arc without the barrel pointing that way. James, what is the field of view of view on a 44 mm scope at 50 yards? if your round is at the edge of the lens and traveling in a straight line you would be shooting someones target to your left. James check the shooter beside you? in the future maybe your shooting better scores than you think.
 
forgot to add this, no scope made by man is capable yet of focusing on 2 objects at different distances at the same time. if you see a .22 round curving and can watch it to the target the parallax is set at a range shorter than 50 yards. I don't care if it's traveling 1060 fps or 960 fps. and it may only be off by .04mm or so but that's enough to shoot left of the x ring at 50 yards and worse for 50 meters.
 
Not all eyesight is equal. Some can see a whole lot of details in the bullet flight that others can only see at certain times, and other can't see it at all.

Just because you can't see it, doesn't mean that no one can.
 
Brian, I can see it and everyone else can. turn the ao inwards and shoot at a target to 50 yards. then reset to where moving your head around the target doesn't jump around and the crosshairs stay on the x ring. I have 2 sightrons that neither are set on the 50 yard mark, because the ao says 50 yards doesn't make it so. it take 30 seconds to check and when set properly you might see the round a few feet from the target if the ao is perfectly set.
 
and james no I don't make this stuff up. you keep belittling the fact I've only shot a few targets. I may not have your experience at competition but do you think that just maybe there is a reason I hit the ground running? I take care of and pay attention to detail, to me this is all part of tuning a rifle.
 
Martin

martin hammond said:
Mike, the bullet travels in an arc because? that's where the barrel is pointed. the bullet itself is incapable of an arc without the barrel pointing that way. James, what is the field of view of view on a 44 mm scope at 50 yards? if your round is at the edge of the lens and traveling in a straight line you would be shooting someones target to your left. James check the shooter beside you? in the future maybe your shooting better scores than you think.
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Martin, a bullet does travel in an arc because of "spin drift or gyroscopic drift. It is defined by Military Ordnance as "the lateral diviation of trajectory from the plane of departure caused by the rotation of a projectile. Also the scopes used in benchrest usually have a very fine crosshair and floating dot . the crosshair at 35 or 40 yards would not cover a .015 of an inch. In certain light conditions it is easy to see the bullet travel to the target. IT makes no difference if your parallax is adjusted for 50 yards, the bullet can be seen. THE BULLET DOES NOT TRAVEL IN A STRAIGHT LINE. IT IS NOT COVERED BY THE CROSSHAIR. GO to Penn State and get one of the students to explain the "coriolis effect" on a bullet, it might set you straight.
 
martin hammond said:
and james no I don't make this stuff up. you keep belittling the fact I've only shot a few targets. I may not have your experience at competition but do you think that just maybe there is a reason I hit the ground running? I take care of and pay attention to detail, to me this is all part of tuning a rifle.
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I am not saying anything about how many targets you have shot, I said you are wrong about the bullet travel and scopes. Martin, you are running backards.
 
i've seen the bullet thru my scope, i've seen 38 special by standing in shadow shooting into brite sunlight...i've watched my pulse beat in a 45x scope, but i can't see mothballs, can't get the little critters legs apart:D
 
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