Which BR Cartridge is the cheapest to set up?

B

briannmilewis

Guest
Greetings:

My interest in this forum is not for BR competition shooting, it is for the BR knowledge I can gather and then apply to a hunting rifle. My logic is that choosing an inherently accurate cartridge from the BR world has got to help in the hunting accuracy department. I am also very interested in case life and efficient powder use. All great things the BR community has promoted.

I have done a bunch of research on 22 BR Rem, 6mm BR Rem and 7mm BR Rem, also the 22 PPC and 6mm PPC. I have also read good things about the 30 BR Rem. I know there is some different BR "brands", so please bear with me for not mentioning them.

I need to know which BR cartridge is the cheapest to set up for. Like the purchase of a parent case, neck up or down, etc, all the specific hardware you must purchase for that cartridge. In other words, which is the cartridge that requires the least dollar outlay in order to get all your reloading ducks in a row.

Thanks...

P.S. If this is the wrong place to post this, please let me know.
 
Brian

I think you left out the most important one, the 308 Winchester.

I say this because you said 'hunting rifle'. The 308 is inherently accurate, the finest in components are available for it, (Lapua Brass, the finest in bullets, etc), and barrel life is 'forever'.

Of course, there is that littler thing of recoil, but most hunting rifles will produce some of that.

If you must have a smaller caliber, I would go with a 6BR. There is a virtual industry built around this fine little round, whether you are shooting lighter bullets at 3400 fps out of a 1-14 twist, or heavier high BC bullets at 3000 fps out of a 1-8 twist.

The Lapua Brass is so good, you can just go with a non neck turn, and everybody makes dies, as well as powders that are ideal.

So, cost wise, ease of assembling all the components, combined with the finest in component availability with outstanding accuracy, I would say for bigger bore, the 308, for smaller bore, the 6BR........jackie
 
The 222 Remington was a very popular BR cartridge for a long time. Cheap brass, easy to build and load for, too. No special or custom dies required, just jump in and start shooting.
6 BR would be next easiest and cheapest. A bit more expensive but potentially better performance.
 
For what you have described, I agree with Jackie, and if you get one throated for the shorter bullets, with suitable barrel twist, you will have one of the best varmint rigs for medium to longer work where there is some wind. A well built .222 or for that matter .223 of equal build quality would be good choices as well. But they are more wind sensitive.
 
If the rifle you're pondering needs to feed rounds from a magazine, the shorter BR cases can be a bit of a hassle depending on the action, magazine, etc. I've got both a 22BR and 6BR hunting rigs...love 'em both. Both are single shots.

Not sure exactly what kind of hunting you're going to do with it, but a plain vanilla 6BR twisted 1:8 would give you a lot of flexibility for bullets. It will shoot everything from the 55-58 varmint bullets to the 105-107 stuff. There's a good number of hunting bullets in the 80-100 gr. range that work well. The throat length will be a compromise, but that's probably not a deal breaker. Dies are simple, available and the Lapua brass needs only to have the flash holes and primer pockets uniformed and it's ready to shoot. If the chamber reamer has a .271-.272 neck, you'll not need to turn the necks.

For something that needs to feed flawlessly through a magazine, it's hard to beat the 308W. With a short freebore and twisted 1:14, the 1.00" long jacketed 117-125's will shoot well as will the 150's on the 1.150" jackets. The 14 twist would be a good compromise for some of the hunting style 150's that are a bit longer than 1.150".

For a more 'BR' type case that will still feed well, the 6.5X47 Lapua necked to .30 would be a dandy. Much more case work but a bit more efficient. Neck turning is a must when you neck this case to .30, but that's no biggie. Dies are a bit more hassle but your 'smith should be able to steer you the right direction. Since all you'll need is a f.l. die and a seater, you're 'smith could use a 6.5X47 Lapua f.l. die and open the neck portion of the die to a diameter .004-.005 less than what a loaded round measures for a simple f.l. die. A Wilson .30 cal. blank seating die cut with the chamber reamer would be a simple seating setup. You could also use a Wilson 30-30 seating die, cut that with the reamer, shorten it and save a bit of the work on a blank.

A 30BR would also be a dandy. With a 125 gr. Nosler BTip, it's a 'bang, flop' deer cartridge.
 
most of the guys have more experience than me...but to the question "cheapest to set up"...i think of all the BR out there today, it would be the 6 BEGGS with a no turn neck.

on the other side of the coin, i have a 308 win br....it feeds and it shoots. i do 135's in a 1/15 twist, a 1/14 would get you up to 150's and a 1/13 would probably do 165's.

mike in co
 
which br cartridge

The cheapest is the 222.
It uses less powder and componets are easy to get.
Most likely the most accurate of the br cases.
As you get into different cases the price goes up quite a bit.
It is adequate for Small game and a few have even shot other game with it. For small animals it should be just fine.
 
Hands down if you want most inexpensive

Gerry said:
The cheapest is the 222.
It uses less powder and componets are easy to get.
Most likely the most accurate of the br cases.
As you get into different cases the price goes up quite a bit.
It is adequate for Small game and a few have even shot other game with it. For small animals it should be just fine.
Click to expand...

Gerry is right when you wanna talk inexpensive. 6 BR or 308 Win might be more useful for longer range or bigger game .
 
Keep 'em coming...

You folks are amazing. Seems to be very good support for a 6BR, and also the 308W gets a good look in too.

I do apologize for not specifying how big an animal I want to hunt - feral cats to white-tail/Mule deer easily, a deer "bang, flop" round, or as close as can be expected, as has been pointed out.

Now for some more questions. Are the references to 308 Win referring to a 1.5" BR case or regular 308 case? I want to conserve powder, with less recoil, so my boys can shoot without getting a flinch, and I am a recoil woos too, that is why a regular 308 Win is not on my list.

I have seen two names, 6mm BR Remington, and 6mm BR Norma. What is the story? Do I care for a hunting load?

Thanks again.
 
Some of the cartridges mentioned do not push a bullet big enough to be legal for deer and larger animals, at least not around here. If you are looking to have a BR quality gun built by someone who has the skills and still save some money, you might contact Fred Moreo at Sharpshooter Supply. He's building high quality rifles based on the new Savage target actions. He has a very good trigger available, too. Though I would not want to go hunting with a 2 oz. BR trigger........

I have one of Fred's 6BR Norma guns built by him from the ground up, and it is an excellent rifle. If I had it to do over, I would have ordered a Shilen barrel and had it sent to Fred to chamber rather than use the Douglas barrel he sells. Still, the Douglas WAS cheaper and it would have been good enough to pop a few prairie dogs at 300 yards or hit a deer in the brisket......

The 6 BR Norma is what you'd be getting if you ordered one these days. The 6 BR Remington was one of the original 6BR cartridges and is pretty well defunct, since Remington did not support it. The main difference between them is that the Norma has a bit longer neck. It is one of the short fat cartridges that are sometimes problematic in magazines. It is also one of the most accurate long range cartridges there are. It is the parent cartridge of other long range stars like the 6mm dasher and the 6.5mm dasher.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
How cheap???

I know Savage makes an "off the shelf" 6br and I believe it has an 1:8 twist barrel (might be 1:12... not sure) If 1:8, this is more than enough to shoot that 100 - 108 grain "deer - flop" bullets you will need. It might be tough to find off the shelf ammo for it, although possible.

Considering if you get a 6br, you will most likely need to reload your ammo. That in itself can get pricy. If you are already set up that way, then it's a piece of cake.

The receipt is:
Laupa brass
30 grains Varget
100ish grain bullet
deer in cross hairs, squeeze, clean, and eat.


My 1:8 twist 6BR shoots the 87 grain - 108 grains fine. My kids LOVE shooting mine with the 87 grain v-max's. This has very little recoil, and that makes it a lot more fun to shoot for the kids.
 
Last edited:
My logic is that choosing an inherently accurate cartridge from the BR world has got to help in the hunting accuracy department.
Click to expand...
Just to interject a note of realism here, I think your "logic" is wrong. In benchrest, we shoot 100 or 125 shots over two days. Usually, the difference in the aggregates between 1st place and 10th place is .030 MOA or less. By my logic, that means anything one can do for an .030 MOA improvement is worth a lot of money, and a lot of compromises in any other area (energy, bullet weight, trajectory, bullet expansion capabilities, etc. etc.). The things to consider when making the inevitable compromises are quite different in hunting. And I use "inevitable" with "compromise" because it is never a single thing -- two "good" things require opposite treatment. (Heavier, longer bullets have a higher BC, but this can only be achieved with a faster rate of twist, which increases shot dispersion with any bullet defects (also inevitable), so the *known* distance at which you compete is a factor. Etc. etc. etc.)
 
Brian

There really isnt'y any such thing as a "6BR Remington" anymore. Lapua fixed that years ago. The reason Lapua Brass has "Norma" stamped on it is because Norma standardized the case at the 1.560 length. Or something like that. It's a long story.

Suffice to say, if you build a 6BR, use Lapua Brass, and make sure your Gunsmith has the reamer that is ground to accept it. Many of the ancient 6br reamers will not.

As for the Savage 6BR and the Savage 308. I think it is a toss up as to which is really the more accurate. I have seen some Factory Savages in 308 at our Club Matches that will amaze you........jackie
 
I think you are going about this the wrong way. When picking a cartridge to hunt with start with the largest game you will be hunting and find a cartridge that is suitable, THEN start looking at what BR tricks you can apply to "create " your tack driver. Most BR shooters that I know who hunt, don't shoot BR with a hunting rifle and don"t hunt with a BR rifle.
 
Last edited:
I see something here that hasn't been mentioned. The barrels on some factory rifles shoot very good and some shoot, lets just say less than desirable. I have 2 - 204 rugers from 2 different manufactures. One shoots 1.75" groups at 100 yd. the other will shoot 1/2 to 3/4" groups most of the time. Just something to be aware of.

Glenn B.
 
If you are looking at building a custom rifle, then I'd look at the 6.5X47 Lapua.

I just finished one for my kid and I'm having a hard time not keeping it for myself. I'm shooting 120gr ballisic tips in a 21 inch tube.
1. Light Recoil.
2. No brass prep.
3. Efficient in a short barrel.
4. Very accurate.
5. Good barrel life.
 
Russ Hardy said:
If you are looking at building a custom rifle, then I'd look at the 6.5X47 Lapua.

I just finished one for my kid and I'm having a hard time not keeping it for myself. I'm shooting 120gr ballisic tips in a 21 inch tube.
1. Light Recoil.
2. No brass prep.
3. Efficient in a short barrel.
4. Very accurate.
5. Good barrel life.
Click to expand...

I'll second Russ on this one. :)

The 6.5X47L is REALLY a nice all-round round.

Hand load only and full-on custom of course. You won't be finding any boxes of shells at the local gun mart....... I submit that a nice load using the Barnes TTSX 120gr would be a most excellent deer cartridge out to 300-350yds.

I will also agree that a .308 loaded the way it should be loaded kicks....hard.

And IMO the 6BR (much as I love it! ;) ) is too small for deer. I feel the same way about the .243Win.

opinionsby


al
 
If you had asked your question on the 600-1000 yard forum, and if -- a big if -- the people who responded were experienced, thoughtful people, I think you would wind up right about here, with one caveat, the small primer pocket of the 6.5x47 Lapua.

To backtrack. Except for the the Pennsylvania club, 1,000 yard formal benchrest started up in Virginia and North Carolina about 1995. A lot of different chamberings were tried. Most worked OK, though the feeing then was "big and fast." .22s were Middlesteads (.243 case). 6mms were 6 Ackley (.257 case) and 6/06 (.30/06 case). .30s were improved Weatherbys, necked down .404 Jeffrey, or even the 416 Rigsby.

As time went on, success was spelled by choice of bullets and barrels, aided by good brass. People started trying smaller cases. The 600 yard competition furthered the look at smaller cases. For competition, it is still a matter of very good bullets, aided by a good barrel and hopefully, good brass. (Good brass means less work preparing cases, not succeed/fail.)

So, for 600 yard competition, there is nothing wrong with the .260 Remington. It will work at 1,000 but there are better choices. Nothing wrong with the .308, either. I believe one 600 yard record is still held by the .308. For competition, the 6BR is the most popular 600 yard choice, but like others, I think it too small for a good, all-around hunting round.

The 6.5x47 Lapua reminds me of the 6.5 Arisaka, the 6.5 Carcano, and the 6.5x54 M-S. Back when Stoeger was importing rifles -- 1950s and 60s? -- the 6.5x54 M-S was an east coast favorite; the long, heavy bullets had good penetration, and it was a effective moose round at reasonable distances. Still is. I have a wildcat 6mm based on the 6.5x54 M-S that has taken considerable fake wood. Hell, it is just a 2-inch long 6 PPC.

The thing with the 6.5x47 Lapua is it is a bit new. Midwest and East coast shooters -- some of them -- are reporting better success with drilled flash holes. West coast shooters -- many of them, anyway -- find the small flash hole just fine. No one knows why. Back when the PPC cases dried up, Dave Tooley was one of those who got the 6 American going -- a .30/30 case with a small primer, made to high standards. Dave did some testing with case capacity and flash hole size. I think his conclusion would be that the 6.5x47 Lapua is right on the edge, & might better be served by a large primer or drilled flash hole -- but then, he's an noted East coast shooter/gunsmith, & maybe his results wouldn't translate out to the warmer, drier climates of the west. Who knows?

The .260 Remington might just be your safest chambering. If you absolutely, positively have to have benchrest-quality brass, you'll have to make cases from .308 Lapua brass. Benchrest bullets are of no use to you. As far as alinwa's 350 yard recommendation, well, yes, if you are shooting off a rest, and the bullet you're using can be counted on to expand at whatever velocity it has at that distance. Realistically, unless you're a 300 meter ISU champion, don't try it offhand.

I still say that benchrest is not a particularly significant proving ground for hunting chamberings. But if you want to use benchrest techniques -- the rifle build, the reloading, etc., OK. The particular chambering isn't too important. Those of us who wildcated because of the newness of 600 and 1,000 yard benchrest proved again what the rest of the wold seemed to have learned -- it is components that make an accurate rifle, not a particular chambering. Winning comes from incremental development of those components. As for non-competitive shooting, is a hit through the left ventricle better than a hit through the right ventricle?
 
I would also consider , where you hunt . Woods vs long fields, maybe even
hill to hill. Benchrest loading techniques can be applied to nearly any
cartridge, at practically the same outlay in dollars.State game laws may
overule many good cartridges, such as was recently posted about
Indiana and 35 caliber being a minimum. I fail to see any logic to that.
 
Charles E,

I have been hearing of the possability of small rifle priimer and slow burning powders being of some concern. I decided to go with the Rem 7 1/2 BR primers and H4895 since I'm only shooting a 21 inch barrel and 120gr bullets. Any thoughts on this combination? I haven't chronoed it yet, but it sure shoots great at 100 yds. The powder will almost fill the case to the bottom of my bullet. I think Varget would be perfect for shorter barrels and light bullets, but I couldn't find any.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top