What are you looking at.....

F

frey

Member
the moment you pull the trigger?

In my limited experience it seems most everyone is glued to their scope while they're pulling the trigger. They might be looking up and down checking for changes in the condition, but always seem to go back to the scope at the critical moment.

Is this necessary?

It would seem that if you're trying to shoot a dominant condition throughout the card, you should have a pretty good idea of your hold off from bull to bull. Once you have your POA set why would you need to look through the scope again? Granted, there might be a subtle change in the condition that warrants a slight POA change, but once again, do you need to be looking through the scope when you pull the trigger?

I've actually been trying this "blind" approach in my practice sessions and have found that the bullet seems to go pretty much the same place whether I'm watching it through the scope, or have my head up watching the flags. Now, I'm not saying the bullet is going where I want it to, but how I watch it doesn't seem to make a difference.

I read a lot about folks missing a condition and throwing something less than desired. I wonder if this because they set their POA for a certain condition, look up and see it, but by the time they can get back to the scope, it's gone.

Thoughts?
 
Glued to the scope......

frey
Howdy,i have to admit that i feel better looking thru the scope as i break the shot but............i have shot many times with "Joe [red shoes] Besche" and he almost always was sitting up looking at flags, Joe-de-Cators ect. as he broke the shot then he would check thru the scope. You certainly can'y argue with his success.
Colt.45
 
I agree that you should be looking at your flags when you pull the trigger. The time it takes from looking at flags to then look through the scope can be long enough for a change in the flags. I just have a real hard time pulling the trigger and not looking through the scope.
 
I generally shoot looking through the scope at the target with one eye and the flags with the other. I've shot without looking through the scope with some success and I think it may be the better way. But, it's a psychological thing I think. I'm just not comfortable not looking through the scope. Many excellent shooters do not look through the scope when they take the shot and they are successful. So, no it's not necessary. If you can train yourself to have confidence in all the variables and look only at the flags when you make the decision to shoot, it will probably be to your benefit. But it takes discipline.
 
I'm with Beau

One eye through the scope and the other on the flags.
 
IMHO one needs to watch those tails to be consistent. It does take patience and will feel awkward at first, but it will become second nature. The tails can drop, rise and switch in a blink of an eye or even tuck under the vane or vanes before they even turn. My suggestion would be to learn keeping your eye on those tails. You might not know why a shot was missed if you don't know at the time you pulled the trigger what those tails were showing you. Things happen so quick in certain conditions to take your eye off those tails. Is there a right or wrong way, I don't know we each have our opinions, but watching the flags but more important the tails, has worked for myself.

Take Care,
Joe
 
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Depends how you shoot...

First year rimfire benchrest shooter here. I understand some folks shoot by just touching the trigger and the rifle is fully supported by the rest and rear bag, free rifle I think. I guess if you shoot that way you can get away with not looking through the scope when you shoot. I am old school. I have the butt against my shoulder and my right hand is holding the rifle when I squeeze the trigger. I am looking through the scope at what I intend to shoot at that time. I am also trying to keep both eyes open so I am aware of what flags are doing and that will take time to learn. Looking at what you shoot as you shoot it is good safe practice. I see Trap shooters with the Trap Gun barrel down resting on a leather pad on their toe. I would never do that. Some day, some time, one of them will do the same when in the field and get mud jammed in the barrel. My safety two cents worth.
 
I agree with Beau's post that I feel more comfortable looking through the scope when touching the trigger off. I also agree with Joe F. in the tails are ultimately important. I also understand Joe Beshe touching the trigger off while watching his flags without looking through the scope. I don't know that there is a BEST way. There is certainly a comfortable way for each and every shooter. I have tried them all and I like to look through the scope while looking at my flags with the other eye and touching off. But I don't have an ARA A-Line Championship or any 2500's. It's a comfort thing. Tails or a probe will generally show a switch better that most flags (my probe a Beggs shows it faster than both), but attention to the detail is upmost important.

Carp
 
The quality of the bench is important here. If you have confidence in the bench (and your rest), watch the flags. If the bench moves, you have to look at the scope.
 
Which ever

is more comfortable! I mostly us the two eye method, one eye looking through the scope and the other on the flags (this way takes a little practice). Don's correct, if the benches are solid with no movement then I sightin and watch the flags. I shoot free recoil with all my rifles and each method works fine.
 
Heads up and free recoil

Ed Adams kicked butt at the Cactus in Phoenix this March with his head up off the scope watching just the flags. You have to have the correct bag set up and technique... and trust your equipment 100%. Good article about him a while back in the NBRSA magazine explaining why he went back to shooting like this.
 
11 year old thread resurrected. A good one to bring back at that. Shooting heads up definitely has it's place. Not comfortable for everyone, but when conditions don't hold and bench and equipment are up to it, you will put more in the center by using it.

I particularly liked seeing posts from guys you don't see posting anymore and hearing their wealth of knowledge.

Thanks for revisiting it.
 
I never can look at the flags when I’m pulling the trigger. I focus on the crosshairs and my POA. I take a glance at the flags as I’m loading between shots.

I only shoot heads up when it’s really switchy.

Whatever style you feel works, try to perfect it. Also don’t forget about your gun handling when you are trying to go fast. It’s as important as watching the flags. Slapping the trigger or shouldering the stock is the cause of most 4 and 1s.
 
Joe, have you figured out

Joe Friedrich said:
IMHO one needs to watch those tails to be consistent. It does take patience and will feel awkward at first, but it will become second nature. The tails can drop, rise and switch in a blink of an eye or even tuck under the vane or vanes before they even turn. My suggestion would be to learn keeping your eye on those tails. You might not know why a shot was missed if you don't know at the time you pulled the trigger what those tails were showing you. Things happen so quick in certain conditions to take your eye off those tails. Is there a right or wrong way, I don't know we each have our opinions, but watching the flags but more important the tails, has worked for myself.

Take Care,
Jo

WHY such a small movement of tails can make such a big impact on bullet flight? Is it force of air movement or movement of Mirage?

Thanks,

Pete
Click to expand...
 
Pete Wass said:
What is your learned opinion?

Pete
Click to expand...

Mirage is one thing only.......warmer air that rises, no?
Given that, one thing only moves tails on flags, wind.
On those rare occasions with zero wind, mirage will give you elevation but since you referenced moving tails.........wind is the primary culprit.
 
Thanks

tim said:
Mirage is one thing only.......warmer air that rises, no?
Given that, one thing only moves tails on flags, wind.
On those rare occasions with zero wind, mirage will give you elevation but since you referenced moving tails.........wind is the primary culprit.
Click to expand...

I appreciate you're answering Tim. This situation has happened so infrequently to me, I have not learned much about it. The amount of movement of the bullet in relation to the amount of tails seems unrealistic to me but the bullets, they do move a lot sometimes.

I have believed that mirage does actually have some force so wondered if the light flickering was that force.Perhaps I have been wrong all along but have yet to figure the whole thing out and at my advanced age, not likely to happen.

Pete
 
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Mirage

On the subject of mirage: I have recently been shooting at a range in south Florida and on those hot sunny days I noticed this mirage effect.
When it occurred it seemed to cause the aim point to wiggle ever so slightly.

Bob
 
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