Wanting a lathe
- Thread starter themayor
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Butch Lambert
Active member
I was looking for an answer from Scott as he frequents that forum. Peter may know the right answer. Somebody posted pics of that Rivett. I am slowly trying to enclose the 12x30 porch on my shop to allow me to move my saws, sanders, and grinders in that part so that I will have room for the 2 10ee.
Butch
Butch
Butch Lambert
Active member
Hal,
These are old 56 models, I believe are WIAD. Thanks for the offer.
Butch
These are old 56 models, I believe are WIAD. Thanks for the offer.
Butch
L
Louis Boyd
Guest
How large of lathe is still useful for gunsmithing?
My machinist for 20+ years (and long time friend) emailed me a couple of days ago to tell me he sold his big machine shop to someone who mainly wanted the building and was downsizing to just a one person specialty shop which he though't he'd enjoy and probably make more personal profit. I had some parts for the telescopes I design which were finished so I went to pick them up.
When I got there he asked me if I needed any tools since he was selling most of his and had to clear the building. I told him I'd broken the banjo in my 12"x36" Craftsman lathe and hadn't found a replacement part, but I wished I had a little larger lathe. He offered me the smallest lathe he had in the shop for $3600 and I bought it. I have room in my workshop for it (presently occupied by an old Corvette) , but I'm wondering if it may be a little large for my hobbies. It's old (1964) with chipped paint but my friend says it's in excellent working order and I'll get several accssories including an Aloris tool holder, a couple of extra chucks, steady rests, etc. It also has a contour follower (which I'm not familar with).
Its a Lodge & Shipley model 1610, 18" x 54". it's got a 20HP motor. He says it weighs about four tons. Relocating it should be entertaining.
My machinist for 20+ years (and long time friend) emailed me a couple of days ago to tell me he sold his big machine shop to someone who mainly wanted the building and was downsizing to just a one person specialty shop which he though't he'd enjoy and probably make more personal profit. I had some parts for the telescopes I design which were finished so I went to pick them up.
When I got there he asked me if I needed any tools since he was selling most of his and had to clear the building. I told him I'd broken the banjo in my 12"x36" Craftsman lathe and hadn't found a replacement part, but I wished I had a little larger lathe. He offered me the smallest lathe he had in the shop for $3600 and I bought it. I have room in my workshop for it (presently occupied by an old Corvette) , but I'm wondering if it may be a little large for my hobbies. It's old (1964) with chipped paint but my friend says it's in excellent working order and I'll get several accssories including an Aloris tool holder, a couple of extra chucks, steady rests, etc. It also has a contour follower (which I'm not familar with).
Its a Lodge & Shipley model 1610, 18" x 54". it's got a 20HP motor. He says it weighs about four tons. Relocating it should be entertaining.
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J
J. Valentine
Guest
You better be working on some looooong barrels for that spindle , just kiding .
$3600 is a bargian for that size lathe.
$3600 is a bargian for that size lathe.
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buckdnutter
Guest
Jerry I must say you would be right sir, I was going off 3rd person info and in the pic you can plainly see that it says " Bradford Tool Co." That is my bad and I will edit the info to be correct, sorry about the mix up, 20-20 hindsight... Thank you and my applogies for the wrong info...Daniel.
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buckdnutter
Guest
Bradford Lathe... Has some tooling and a 4 jaw chuck. It is wired for 110v but can also be wired for 220v. . If you would like to see more pic's just email me...DRDickerson@verizon.net It will be available for pick up only, and the asking price is $725.00 OBO....You will need a trailor to haul this thing on...Location is Floyd VA 24091.....You can map quest to see if it will be worth you wild...Any ?'s just email me and I will answer them to the best of my knowledge....Thanks
Thank You Jerry...
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wilsoncs3980
Guest
I
Im_leary
Guest
themayor,
I am surprised that your question brought out all of the cheerleaders for the various brands of lathe. As I read your original question, you did not ask for a purchase recommendation, nor do I think you are in the position to appreciate all of the nuances and deeper philosophical qualities regarding the choice of one brand of lathe over another. You asked, in so many words, "How hard is it to run a lathe?" If you have the right teacher, and a modicum of mechanical inclination, it's not hard to do at all. By the same token, doing good work, to close tolerances, is NOT, by any stretch, easy for the novice. They don't pay experienced machinists the "big bucks" just because they're grouchy and they smell funny (it's the o'd Dykem that gives them the smell).
What I would suggest, MOST strongly, is that you find yourself a good trade school (or vocational tech school, or whatever you folks may call it in your corner of the world) that will provide night school classes. I would argue that learning to run a lathe (or any piece of machinery) is best learned from someone who has done it. I have never read any book which could give me an appreciation for the "feel" of a light cut or what "chatter" feels like. Also note that lathes are precision machines that can be easily damaged (ask any apprentice who has dropped a four-jaw chuck on the ways), and they are VERY expensive to repair. If operated by the ill-informed or ignorant, they can also be VERY dangerous. I won't bore you with "Signal-40 esq" tails of what I saw while I worked at Mack Trucks... but suffice it to say, being wrapped around a 14' walking-beam axle, which happened to be mounted between centers on a 24" LeBlond engine lathe at the time, can be embarrassing, not to mention painful. Save yourself a bunch of money, and maybe even some skin, and go to school.
Oh... and for those who care about such things, I ran a 17" South Bend Turnado gear-head engine lathe for many hours while I was at Mack. Among all the other great lathes they had back then (when they "built" trucks, not just "assembled" trucks), which included LeBlond, Monarch, and quite a few others, I always thought that the Turnado did the best quality work, with less effort, than any of the the others (the Monarch was a close second). South Bend lathes have much to recommend them. By the same token, I never ran a Jet, Grizzly, Logan, or Atlas lathe that impressed me at all. Good lathes are heavy (for their size) and carefully assembled. You will never be able to do close-tolerance work with a lathe that is built loose and flimsy. Just ask your teacher what he ran. If he is knowledgeable, and honest, he will be willing to give his students good advice. I never got any bad advice from the machinist I was apprenticed to (not regarding machine work, at any rate). His words were few and his praise almost nonexistent, but what he did say was always worth remembering.
I am surprised that your question brought out all of the cheerleaders for the various brands of lathe. As I read your original question, you did not ask for a purchase recommendation, nor do I think you are in the position to appreciate all of the nuances and deeper philosophical qualities regarding the choice of one brand of lathe over another. You asked, in so many words, "How hard is it to run a lathe?" If you have the right teacher, and a modicum of mechanical inclination, it's not hard to do at all. By the same token, doing good work, to close tolerances, is NOT, by any stretch, easy for the novice. They don't pay experienced machinists the "big bucks" just because they're grouchy and they smell funny (it's the o'd Dykem that gives them the smell).
What I would suggest, MOST strongly, is that you find yourself a good trade school (or vocational tech school, or whatever you folks may call it in your corner of the world) that will provide night school classes. I would argue that learning to run a lathe (or any piece of machinery) is best learned from someone who has done it. I have never read any book which could give me an appreciation for the "feel" of a light cut or what "chatter" feels like. Also note that lathes are precision machines that can be easily damaged (ask any apprentice who has dropped a four-jaw chuck on the ways), and they are VERY expensive to repair. If operated by the ill-informed or ignorant, they can also be VERY dangerous. I won't bore you with "Signal-40 esq" tails of what I saw while I worked at Mack Trucks... but suffice it to say, being wrapped around a 14' walking-beam axle, which happened to be mounted between centers on a 24" LeBlond engine lathe at the time, can be embarrassing, not to mention painful. Save yourself a bunch of money, and maybe even some skin, and go to school.
Oh... and for those who care about such things, I ran a 17" South Bend Turnado gear-head engine lathe for many hours while I was at Mack. Among all the other great lathes they had back then (when they "built" trucks, not just "assembled" trucks), which included LeBlond, Monarch, and quite a few others, I always thought that the Turnado did the best quality work, with less effort, than any of the the others (the Monarch was a close second). South Bend lathes have much to recommend them. By the same token, I never ran a Jet, Grizzly, Logan, or Atlas lathe that impressed me at all. Good lathes are heavy (for their size) and carefully assembled. You will never be able to do close-tolerance work with a lathe that is built loose and flimsy. Just ask your teacher what he ran. If he is knowledgeable, and honest, he will be willing to give his students good advice. I never got any bad advice from the machinist I was apprenticed to (not regarding machine work, at any rate). His words were few and his praise almost nonexistent, but what he did say was always worth remembering.
JerrySharrett
Senile Member
I agree with the get what you pay for part. Like I have said on other threads, buying a lathe and paying for it what you would pay for a riding mower at Home Depot and expecting great quality...don't.
As to being an Engineer and not a machinist, there is a difference in the guy who saunters out into the shop and the guy who builds and runs the machines. I am both, a Mechanical Engineer and a DOL/BAT machinist and I will put Hitachi-Seiki, Mori-Seiki, and Mazak up against the best LeBlond ever built. As to Makino, it is primarily a Japanese builder itself.
"The Mill" built a few lathes but some fair mills, but never equal to Kearney and Trecker. Where is "The Mill" now? They don't build machine tools at all.
And does Makino?? Makino assembles some machining center and EDM machine tools in North Carolina but weren't all the parts made in Japan? Is not Makino a Japanese company?
At Eastman Chemical we bought and used Milacron extruders, milling machines. NC and CNC drills, and cylindrical and tool and cutter grinders. The Mill (Cincinnati-Milacron) has not built a mill. drill, or grinder in years.
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aleaddict
Guest
I just bought an 11" Rockwell base on a recommendation from Butch Lambert. It is in excellent condition and came fully loaded with $$$ tooling. The short 16" headstock, 1.38" through spindle, variable speed drive (45 - 1550 rpm), 36" between centers, L00 spindle nose are among some of the features that makes this machine an almost-perfect gunsmith lathe. Mine was built in February 1978.
This RW is my first lathe. I have been "practicing" on a friends 13" Turnmaster for years. Someday I plan on taking a machining course at the local community college but until then I just learn from people who know more than I do. My nick-name for years was "5 mil" just because I was afraid to take heavy cuts. Now with the right cutters and material I can remove 50 in one pass. It's a long, slow learning curve towards developing a "comfort zone" with powerful machines. Take it slow and practice as much as possible.
Butch Lambert
Active member
Jay Lynn Gore has 2 11x36 Rockwells. I believe Bill Myers has a 11x36 also. They are variable speed, 1 3/8" spindle bore, and short in the headstock. They are no longer manufactured, but there are a big following on yahoo Rockwell forum. I would look long and hard for one if I needed a gunsmith lathe.
Butch
Butch
ultramagmed
JKM
Entry level...........
So.......... for someone who doesn't even know how to operate a lathe yet, let alone work on one of these old relics that everyone says to buy. What are some U.S. built lathes that are still in production that can be bought on a budget of say 3 to 6k? Or, what are some BRAND NAME NEW lathes that will do the job but not break the bank that are not made in communist China, or anywhere else over seas!!! I would like to do MY OWN barrel work, so it is not very feasible to spend 10k++ to do MAYBE several dozen barrels over the years. I think for someone not out to make a living at gun work, the choices are somewhat limited. Or am I mistaken??
Thanks, JKM.
So.......... for someone who doesn't even know how to operate a lathe yet, let alone work on one of these old relics that everyone says to buy. What are some U.S. built lathes that are still in production that can be bought on a budget of say 3 to 6k? Or, what are some BRAND NAME NEW lathes that will do the job but not break the bank that are not made in communist China, or anywhere else over seas!!! I would like to do MY OWN barrel work, so it is not very feasible to spend 10k++ to do MAYBE several dozen barrels over the years. I think for someone not out to make a living at gun work, the choices are somewhat limited. Or am I mistaken??
Thanks, JKM.
MColeman
Club Coordinator
I know of one well known benchrest gunsmith that started out with a $2600 Enco lathe, produced winning barrels on it, and still has it in use. I don't know how to, or possess the desire to, rebuild some old lathe. I want to work with the lathe, not on the lathe. I bought a Lux-Matter (same as Acer and Turn Pro) lathe a few years ago and then bought a Grizzly. Both are Taiwan lathes but the Grizzly is head and shoulders above the Lux. Have been singing the praises of Grizzly for 4-5 years now.
K
KenG
Guest
Good luck, keep your eye on Craigslist and be patient. There are some very good gunsmiths that are well known on this forum that use import lathes. There are some high end import lathes like Sharp brand that are really nice. If you can stick to the toolroom precision lathes and stay away from the small lightweight imports (like 1200 to 1500 pds)you shuld be Ok. I think your 3k budget is to low, you will come out closer to the 6k mark for a new lathe that will meet your requirments. Chances are if you buy a cheapy that will "do the job(likely a 3-4k lathe)" your going to be looking for another lathe pretty quick, but on the other hand if it gets your foot into the door and lets you learn it might be worth it. A lot of gunsmiths have 2 lathes in their shop the one they started with and the one they found out they really needed once there business grew. Oh, one thing I left out is DRO spend the money and get a DRO it will help you greatly in maintaining tolerances and saving time.
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Butch Lambert
Active member
I don't know of any lathes made in the USA at this time
let alone $3000-$6000. I personally prefer a Trav a Dial over a DRO on the lathe. I like the DROs on my mills, but not on the lathe.
Butch
let alone $3000-$6000. I personally prefer a Trav a Dial over a DRO on the lathe. I like the DROs on my mills, but not on the lathe.
Butch
Gene DeLoney
New member
I also own one of these 11 x 36 Rockwells. Absolutley love it!
One word of caution...... Be careful when useing the "Locked Spindle" position. If the motor is switched on in this position it will break the teeth on the cast drive gear. Don't ask me how I know this... live and learn. I now have a plug in the hole so I can't even use that position any more.
You can change chucks by putting the lathe in back gear at a lower speed so you can turn the big spanner nut that holds the chuck on.
Gene
ultramagmed
JKM
Thanks for the replies...........
I appreciate the replies Mickey,Ken,Butch & Gene. I've thought about which to buy for quite sometime now. If my 3 to 6k budget is too low to do some hobby gun work, then I may as well pay my current gunsmith and not learn anything. So my thoughts are..........since I do not know how to run (yet) or do repairs on a lathe I'm kind of limited to something I don't have to fix to get started which also limits me to Grizzly, Enco or Jet. So, which is the lesser of the "three evils".
I appreciate the replies Mickey,Ken,Butch & Gene. I've thought about which to buy for quite sometime now. If my 3 to 6k budget is too low to do some hobby gun work, then I may as well pay my current gunsmith and not learn anything. So my thoughts are..........since I do not know how to run (yet) or do repairs on a lathe I'm kind of limited to something I don't have to fix to get started which also limits me to Grizzly, Enco or Jet. So, which is the lesser of the "three evils".
A
aleaddict
Guest
Thanks for that safety tip, Gene. As you know, replacement parts are almost as scarce as hens teeth!
I am in the process of cleaning and refurbishing the lathe. It needed new belts, a couple small repairs and a new paint job but otherwise it's in good shape. If you want to see what $1500 will buy you, here's the link.
My Rockwell lathe