Thoughts on Benchrest Competition

This has been an interesting read. I remember that I was looking for a new competition hobby back in '98, when the local range I belonged to was asking for target setters for a silhouette match. I volunteered and was interested until one of the shooters mentioned a 1000 yard match. Then for the next half hour I asked a bunch of questions. Went to a factory class match with a Remington Sendero in 300 Wim Mag. I ended up with one shot out of five on paper, as a contact popped out of my eye. But I hit paper.
The following month I entered a regular match in light gun and put all five on paper. The biggest factor about the sport that kept me coming back was the encouragement that I and other new shooters were getting from the "old guys". If someone else asked a question, I would lean in to hear the answer.
In 1999, this rookie was lucky enough to come out on top of the IBS Nationals. And I gave credit at the end of the year to about ten people who were main sources of my education, which continued for several more years.
If you want the sport to grow, invite shooters of all ages to come and shoot. Be ready to supply a few bullets and equipment to loan them. Depending on their economic reserves, they will get hooked, I did.

Danny
 
Ron wrote - "You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink."

That fits the "Benchrest" bill more than you can believe. Myself, members of the Southeast region, and many, many vendors of Benchrest supplies spent a couple of years trying to get new faces into the game. I hauled a complete set of very good equipment all over the eastern United States offering it to anyone that wanted to try the game. I remember one Super Shoot that all the relays were covered and another relay that I loaned my rifle to somebody. That was successful as we gained three or more continuing competitors from that one event. Largely, however, the deal was unsuccessful in terms of the trouble vs the gain. It seemed simple at first but got to be too much trouble after awhile. I won't tell you the trouble it was in case somebody else want to do it, but in afterthought, I wish I had more help at the matches. I think George Waldrep took the equipment to a match in Roanoke but his tone concerning the return of said equipment told the story. I mentioned that not to say that George didn't accept the task but rather what the individual competitor was/is willing to do....and that, my friends, is what is happening now.

You've got to give a little more...that's all. If everybody were like James Messer there wouldn't be an attendance problem. James never attended a match alone...he was there with everybody.
 
Thoughts on Benchrest competition

Ron I disagree on the later statement of not allowing classes.

Your a great guy and top competitor but I believe your wrong on that''

Something has to be done to keep the games going.

Giving it a try May help keep the new shooters in the game.

Its along learning curve for some people and it take time for new shooters to learn the games.

As you stated practice practice practice. Keep up on the equipment and more practice.

Reading a book won't do it neither will copying what some shooters are doing.
 
Well, I agree with Ron. If you believe classes will change things for the better then just do it. There's nothing at all in your way!
 
Well as a thing to have fun with I spent about 2 1/2 years shooting .22 hand gun silhouette, all 25 classes, in those days. I took .22 because the targets were a lot smaller then the full bore targets. The 100m ram was about 6" high as compared to the 100m pigs in full bore which were very big. Secondly I had to start as a "A" shooter, I told them at the start I should have been "Inter-national" class, for you people that don't know the classes it went, Inter-National, AAA, AA, A, B, C. Then there was 'Single-Shot, Automatic, Revolver, Unlimited, and Standing, but rules are rules. It was "AMAZING" to me the people who would get their, I believe, 15 targets to stay in C class, and then blow the rest of the targets to get that thropy as a winner in C class. I stayed in it for about 2 years, then I got sick of it. So now I shoot against Tony Boyer and I even beat him once, although he has beaten me 680 times, but you know, nobody hears about the 680, but they have heard about the 1 time. OH WELL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
One point, without a classification system our participation is diminishing....would it grow with such a system? Dunno.EH!!

One more point, of all the disciplines I have shot over the years, all have been cyclic. We may just be in a down cycle??

Bill, I shot handgun Big Bore And 22 for several years too. There may have been a few that sandbagged in our shoots but they were very few. Every one wanted to make International class...and I did in 3 of the 4 classes...shooting cast bullets against the factory bullet shooters.


.
 
I got beat so bad at the first

it wasn't even funny. Well, you can do one of two things. Quit or stick it out. I wanted to shoot against the best there is. You don't really know how you are doing unless you compete against the best. Sure, at the first I sometimes wanted to hang it up, but I didn't. I just kept hammering rounds down range until I got a feel for it. That and testing, and testing, and testing some more. I didn't have a mentor for several years until Darrel Loker came into my life. Darrel gave me just a few tips that totally changed my game. THANK YOU

After that things started to make sense. I guess different classes for me would have slowed down the learning curve. Get a good mentor!! I know they are out there.

Richard Brensing
 
Thoughts on Benchrest competition

Its great that you stayed in the game and took the long learning curve.
I isn't just the hand Loading part or the equipment part you had to learn
Nor the benchrest technique
Its the wind reading that's can be the hardest to learn.
Its a pretty long learning curve for some.

Change it ? That simple? It's not that easy The powers to be don't want it for reasons that i can only speculate.

Here it is simple for people who only want to shoot against the best'
ALL NEW SHOOTERS SHOOT IN THE HIGHEST CLASS TO ESTABLISH SOME KIND OF AGG.
after establishing an agg they are classified.
3 or four classes are all that,s needed. sand bagers will be moved to the next higher class if warranted, { they stick out like a sore thumb.
small recognition for great rewards to all shooters. Better match participation More $$ going to the organization via match fee better for the clubs More $$ for the clubs
We are always shooting against the best Not just in your class The hype to do better and win the next class is what will drive it and keep the shooters in the Games
 
I remember a new young shooter coming to one of our matches at Quantico, who had read some of the published match reports, saying that he would not able to compete with class of shooters present. I told him to look around at every one there. He did then turned back to me. I told him that I had beaten everyone of them, then told him to take a second look at them. When he looked at me again, I said that everyone of them had kicked my a$$ also. Later that year, he beat me in a relay. I was the first to shake his hand.
This was repeated many times, so I know a little help and verbal support goes a long way.

Danny
 
For some reason, the Sport seems to have lost some of its appeal. What used to be a fun Hobby has evolved into a job/career without pay.

Bring back the fun and I believe the membership will increase. Just my thoughts.



Glenn
 
GerryM said:
Its great that you stayed in the game and took the long learning curve.
I isn't just the hand Loading part or the equipment part you had to learn
Nor the benchrest technique
Its the wind reading that's can be the hardest to learn.
Its a pretty long learning curve for some.

Change it ? That simple? It's not that easy The powers to be don't want it for reasons that i can only speculate.

Here it is simple for people who only want to shoot against the best'
ALL NEW SHOOTERS SHOOT IN THE HIGHEST CLASS TO ESTABLISH SOME KIND OF AGG.
after establishing an agg they are classified.
3 or four classes are all that,s needed. sand bagers will be moved to the next higher class if warranted, { they stick out like a sore thumb.
small recognition for great rewards to all shooters. Better match participation More $$ going to the organization via match fee better for the clubs More $$ for the clubs
We are always shooting against the best Not just in your class The hype to do better and win the next class is what will drive it and keep the shooters in the Games
Click to expand...

Might work. Who runs this show then?

I believe this game is too hard for most folks.

My problem is, I ain't smart enough to quit.

Dave
 
Bring back the FUN!!!!!!

What used to be a fun Hobby has evolved into a job/career without pay.

Bring back the fun



Glenn[/QUOTE]

+1
 
Thoughts on Benchrest competition

I think that some are seeing some type of agreement with me :D

But still a few only the negative:confused::confused::confused:

Hey it's worth a try, do you want attendance at the match,s? I do and being a former director at a club attendance means a lot.

I think some classification system would help and keep the games alive:cool:
 
Since this thread seems to have run it's course, I'll add a couple of thoughts. I'm not a group shooter and have only shot in a handful of group matches over fifteen years in this sport. Nearly all my shooting has been in IBS score and for the past five years, UBR. I think most of us will agree that score shooting is a different animal. I won't speculate whether one is more difficult than the other, but they definitely require a different approach. I have said on the is forum several times that had we not (Gallatin Gun Club) not changed from IBS to UBR five years ago we would not be holding matches today. The cost of shooting a custom rifle with all the associated equipment is just too much for most brand new shooters. Nearly no one is willing to come up with $3-4000 for a sport they know little if anything about. With IBS competition a serious shooter must compete with some variation of a 30 cal and to be competitive he/she must use a custom rifle of some kind. Of course, you can shoot a 6 PPC or something else and one could use a reworked Remington, but I think we could all agree that it is unlikely that this would put one at the top of the list. It might happen now and then, but not often. Most of us want to know we at least have a chance to win and new shooters are no different.

It has been said that classes won't work and that a Factory class in particular would open the door to a lot of cheating. In five years we have had no sign of that. If it is there it is rare and not effective. Our class system does not class the shooter, but rather the rifle. If a new shooter wants to try the game with a factory rifle, he has that opportunity and many do. Our Factory class frequently has as many competitors as custom class at many matches. Also, if a person wishes to shoot an older sleeved Remington or some such, the Modified class is a perfect fit. I will also add that using a caliber neutral target opens the door to shooters who either don't have a 30 or don't want to deal with the expense and heavier recoil of that caliber. Both the class system that we use and the targets have worked very well for us.

I don't expect to draw folks away from the NBRSA or IBS or for that matter group shooting. That isn't my intention for writing this. I well understand that humans don't like to change. As a baseball fan I am somewhat of a purest and don't care for the designated hitter, so I understand tradition. However, I think most that have weighed in on this thread will agree that our sport isn't healthy. If we want different results, something has to change. If we always do what we always did, we always get what we always got. If we don't make changes, the sport will continue to shrink. I don't expect to do this all that much longer. I am an old man and don't expect to get any younger. But I would like to see the sport get healthier and grow. Changes allowing some kind of class system will certainly work as will some other tweaks. If we don't make some changes I don't think we have much to look forward to in the way of growth.

Rick
 
I wrote a big post and just deleted it. The reason I deleted it is because while writing I realized I can't fix it!

I apologize for anything I wrote that might have been overboard.
 
Wilbur said:
I wrote a big post and just deleted it. The reason I deleted it is because while writing I realized I can't fix it!

I apologize for anything I wrote that might have been overboard.
Click to expand...

Wish you would share your thoughts. I agree, you can't fix it. But I'm pretty sure some of us would like to know what you think. You always bring a different perspective to problems.

Rick
 
The reason you don't see BR. growing is all the work and detection it takes to be successful. Young people today are not interested if requires work……. but if you do the work they may yank the trigger. You stop they stop, seen it many times…….. jim
 
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