The Calfee Effect

[hulk]

Freebies

My logic doesn't hold? Yes, the seller is unwilling at $1.99, which is why I am sure it will not happen.

I am just as sure the seller would be willing at $199,000 but then the government does step in. Then the supply of that miracle drug or cancer cure simply diminishes. The government can and does change economics.

Maybe we should call a Calfee rifle a farm tool and go for some federal funds?

 

[Beau]

Maybe we could get some old junk guns and start a cash for clunkers program.


FMV theory will always hold. Nobody argues that the government can and does intervene. However, the price is no longer the FMV. It's artificial.

At any rate, none of the extremes apply to rifles. You either buy them or you don't. Nobody forces you too.

 

[Vibe]

Next hurricane that hits somewhere, I will be on the spot with a truckload of bottled water at $20.00 a gallon. The authorities usually have a problem with what thay deem "predatory" pricing but The Calfee Effect will be my defense. Fair market value and our free enterprise system, great concepts.

$20/gal water would be predatory....As the buyers are pressured by survival to buy at any price. $20/can beer, on the other hand, would not be.

 

[pacecil]

I'm trying to get some information. I'm not contributing anything about Calfee or his guns.

Has anybody made a comparison of Calfee rifles with other rifles. I'm talking about shooting groups to determine how good they are. I know some don't consider group size as the way to compare guns but it's the best way usually accepted by the most people. Some might say you have to look at scores in competition but this brings the skill of the shooter into the picture. That's not what I'm looking for. I'm looking for a good factual comparison of the guns performance. People selling guns today will tell you how their gun will group - can you get this sort of info on the Calfee rifles?

 

[Lynn]

Pacecil
I would think that a good shooter with a Calfee rifle shoots small groups and that a bad shooter with a Calfee rifle doesn't.
If true it may explain why Tony Boyer has so many Hall Of Fame points yet other shooters using the same equipment don't.
Do a search for Congratulations Freind ......Calfee and look at what events are being won.
Waterboy

 

[Bill Wynne]

Pacecil
I would think that a good shooter with a Calfee rifle shoots small groups and that a bad shooter with a Calfee rifle doesn't.
If true it may explain why Tony Boyer has so many Hall Of Fame points yet other shooters using the same equipment don't.
Do a search for Congratulations Friend ......Calfee and look at what events are being won.
Waterboy

There is a lot of logic in what you say, Lynn. I would like to ask another question that has always been in the back of my mind.

Do the best shooters in this game get the better barrels from their gunsmiths because they will shoot better scores and increase the fame of both the shooter and the gunsmith?

I will ask this question as plainly as I know how. Is there a secret edge for some of the best shooters?

Concho Bill

 

[Beau]

I'm trying to get some information. I'm not contributing anything about Calfee or his guns.

Has anybody made a comparison of Calfee rifles with other rifles. I'm talking about shooting groups to determine how good they are. I know some don't consider group size as the way to compare guns but it's the best way usually accepted by the most people. Some might say you have to look at scores in competition but this brings the skill of the shooter into the picture. That's not what I'm looking for. I'm looking for a good factual comparison of the guns performance. People selling guns today will tell you how their gun will group - can you get this sort of info on the Calfee rifles?

I assume you're asking has anybody actually compared a Calfee rifle with another gunsmiths rifle under the same conditions. Yeah, I've done that, but there's still an issue. Ammo. Now if you eliminate that variable, you can get some good info as far as what you're looking for, but it's hard to do. Calfee is a great gunsmith, but there are others. One thing that I believe sets Calfee apart is his love for the sport and the rifle he is building. It doesn't matter where it's going. If he is doing it, he puts his heart and soul into. That doesn't seem to always happen with others but there is supposed to be another like that and he seems to be a great gunsmith.

 

[Butch Lambert]

I will say"No they don't". I can't speak for all the winners, but Tony is singleminded in his quest for accuracy. He shoots and shoots and shoots. While we are watching football or having a beer, Tony is shooting. He lives shooting.
It is not that important to me and most people, but the ones that pour their life into it do well. A lot of folks have tried to buy it, but with out the sacrifice, and didn't make it.
Butch

 

[404tbang]

There it is!!!

I will say"No they don't". I can't speak for all the winners, but Tony is singleminded in his quest for accuracy. He shoots and shoots and shoots. While we are watching football or having a beer, Tony is shooting. He lives shooting.
It is not that important to me and most people, but the ones that pour their life into it do well. A lot of folks have tried to buy it, but with out the sacrifice, and didn't make it.
Butch

That sums it up, not only about shooting, but ANYTHING that one wants to excel at.

An elegant lady shakes the hand of the world class violinist after the concert, and gushes "I would give my life to play like that!"

The world class violinist replies, "Madam, I HAVE given my life to play like that!"

I have heard several variations of this, it all gets down to what Butch said.

Greg

 

[Dave Shattuck]

I don't want to make it sound like I'm downing any of the previously mentioned gunsmiths as over my 15 years of rimfire bench rest shooting I have seen much of their work, shot against, and lost to many of their end produces, and am currently having a gun worked on by one of those names who I also have the greatest amount of respect for, and have used before and intend to use again.

But, one final thing to think about on this subject, at least from me. Have any of you ever looked into buying any of the upper grade shotguns? I'm not talking about your mass produced, off-the-shelf stuff like what we see advertised or talked about in the American Rifleman. I'm talking about the really Hi-End, Top-of-the-Line custom guns. You want to talk about BIG MONEY. Hell, $11,350.00 wouldn't even begin to scratch the surface of aquiring one of those guns.

So, what's your problem? If you can't afford the money, don't buy the gun! But, don't be critical of someone who is without question one of the most knowledgeable people in his field who has decided to stop taking orders from the general shooting public all together only so that he can dedicate himself to build the absolute best guns that he can possibly build, then offer those guns to the world through a bidding system of his own design, and then starting them with a price that it seems only he thinks is what they are worth.

Now let me you ask this: how long has it taken him to sell any of these guns? Not very long at all, so how can the price be too high I ask you? I'm telling you, there's a waiting line just to be able to bid for one of these guns. That's why he only offers them as being by FAX ONLY with the Machine being turned on for one-half hour on a certain night, and he'll accept the 3rd FAX, then move backwards if necessary. How much fairer can he be?

And, as for the FMV? Screw that! We're talking about owning a one-of-a-kind, hand made (not made-to-order) masterpieces! Now, as for how they shoot, or who's shooting them? If you have to ask either of those question you are obviously a rookie to this sport.

Dave Shattuck

 

[Big Shurl]

I think this sums up the problem people have with Calfee which I'm sure is a great family man but this ad rubs me the wrong way. This is taken from the classified section of benchrest where Calfee is selling his Nite Train "I'm sorry but, fax offers only. My fax will be turned on Friday, 11/27/09 between 7:00 PM and 7:30PM, EST. Fax number is 812 967 2413........I will start with the third fax, then work back if necessary."----- 7:00 to 7:30. Really. Thats pretty arrogant to me. I wouldn't buy a gun from this ad if it guaranteed me a 250 score every round. I love this free market and if he sells guns to the highest bidder this is the land of the free. It just rubs me the wrong way. By the way I started a thread to this effect which was deleted by someone. Granted probably not the best thread but that is how badly it rubbed me. No price just a fax and don't call me pee-on I'll call you.

 

[Melvin Calliham]

And, as for the FMV? Screw that! We're talking about owning a one-of-a-kind, hand made (not made-to-order) masterpieces! Now, as for how they shoot, or who's shooting them? If you have to ask either of those question you are obviously a rookie to this sport.

Dave Shattuck

My problem is not the price he asks. To me he seems to use this system to control exactly who gets the rifle. Rhetorical question..... Do you think if fax #3 was the winner, and happened to be a newbie with no shooting credentials whatsoever, that he would get the rifle?????
MC

 

[Lynn]

Dave
Truer words have never been spoken and my hat is off too you.
I live about 20 miles from Calico Hardwoods and a good buttstock and forend blank for a nice shotgun runs $3500 and up before any inletting or checkering.
Waterboy

 

[Kent Owens]

"Do the best shooters in this game get the better barrels from their gunsmiths because they will shoot better scores and increase the fame of both the shooter and the gunsmith?"

Bill, I don't have a dog in the fight and sure don't have nothing against Bill Calfee, I respect his work a lot. Wish he was still writing for PS magazine too.

That said, the better shooters no the difference between an average abrrel and a great one, the same with ammo. Some folks will never realize the difference between a "good" barrel and a "great" one. An experienced shooter will figure it out pretty fast.
Naturally some barrels are better than others, and now and then one turns out special. Knowing the difference is a skill.

 

[squatty]

I think this sums up the problem people have with Calfee which I'm sure is a great family man but this ad rubs me the wrong way. This is taken from the classified section of benchrest where Calfee is selling his Nite Train "I'm sorry but, fax offers only. My fax will be turned on Friday, 11/27/09 between 7:00 PM and 7:30PM, EST. Fax number is 812 967 2413........I will start with the third fax, then work back if necessary."----- 7:00 to 7:30. Really. Thats pretty arrogant to me. I wouldn't buy a gun from this ad if it guaranteed me a 250 score every round. I love this free market and if he sells guns to the highest bidder this is the land of the free. It just rubs me the wrong way. By the way I started a thread to this effect which was deleted by someone. Granted probably not the best thread but that is how badly it rubbed me. No price just a fax and don't call me pee-on I'll call you.

Your problem seems to be that he does not personally talk to you. But I remember calling Bill years ago and getting the message that I could write to send a message by "facsimile". Ever since I can remember that's the way he's worked. So, what if he chooses to sell his gun in this manner. It's his.

As far as controlling who gets it, this would not be the system to use. What if he just put on there ARA (just as example) of 2100 or better only? Lots of merchants have conditions. Personally, if I could get $6200 for a gun, I would chuck one out every chance I got, but I don't think I can sell one for that.