M
MarkR
Guest
As many opinions as I can get on this...
What aiming point do you use when shooting 100 and 200 yd BR?
Mark
What aiming point do you use when shooting 100 and 200 yd BR?
Mark
J
Jan
Guest
Mark
what reticle are you using? Hope you are using the flags too!
what reticle are you using? Hope you are using the flags too!
M
MarkR
Guest
what reticle are you using? Hope you are using the flags too!
Jan, I got the flags out last Saturday, I got to shoot some, many problems getting things just so so. Little things like front rest setup, brought the wrong target frame (too low), switchy winds, nosy onlookers and talkers with questions, it all turned out pretty good though.
I have FCH w/dot 36X and FCH 30X.
Thanks for asking
Mark
Mark,
Your response to Jan gave me reason to smile,kind of like remembering my first igloo( I didn't really know what I was doing but I just had to build one,before I knew it all the other neighborhood kids were involved and working away) BenchRest shooting holds that same fascination to onlookers( "I don't know what he's doin' but it looks really cool").Therein lies your responsibility as a BR shooter,to figure out what you are doing so you can help others along so the sport can perpetuate itself.
Under good visual conditions I will hold center of mothball and will expect my impact point (under neutral conditions) to be center of mothball as well.with a right to left wind the impact will be high left,with a left to right wind the impact will be low right.
Under poor visual conditions I will hold 6:00 and expect my impact point to be there as well.
With todays great optics I am not concerned with "shooting out my aimpoint" as I can see the difference between my dot and the bullet hole,and under normal all day conditions the wind is usually blowing you left or right of your aimpoint anyway.With a correlating aimpoint/impact point system you will see just how much the wind is moving your bullet and so you will also know how much to adjust your hold if and when the wind changes.
good shooting,
Joel
Your response to Jan gave me reason to smile,kind of like remembering my first igloo( I didn't really know what I was doing but I just had to build one,before I knew it all the other neighborhood kids were involved and working away) BenchRest shooting holds that same fascination to onlookers( "I don't know what he's doin' but it looks really cool").Therein lies your responsibility as a BR shooter,to figure out what you are doing so you can help others along so the sport can perpetuate itself.
Under good visual conditions I will hold center of mothball and will expect my impact point (under neutral conditions) to be center of mothball as well.with a right to left wind the impact will be high left,with a left to right wind the impact will be low right.
Under poor visual conditions I will hold 6:00 and expect my impact point to be there as well.
With todays great optics I am not concerned with "shooting out my aimpoint" as I can see the difference between my dot and the bullet hole,and under normal all day conditions the wind is usually blowing you left or right of your aimpoint anyway.With a correlating aimpoint/impact point system you will see just how much the wind is moving your bullet and so you will also know how much to adjust your hold if and when the wind changes.
good shooting,
Joel
A
abintx
Guest
Mark ...
The one that my flags and sighter tell me to use, to hit my intended point of impact!
The one that my flags and sighter tell me to use, to hit my intended point of impact!
M
MarkR
Guest
The one that my flags and sighter tell me to use, to hit my intended point of impact!
I was taught to use the mothball with the crosshairs horiontal on the bottom of the mothball and the vertical on the left side of the mothball...with the group falling somewhere south or north of center of the mothball...
Mothball...in smallbore...thats called the bullseye...
JerrySharrett
Senile Member
Hold? All over the place. 12:00, center, and then 6:00. My poor detail vision has forced me to hold tangent to the mothball at 9:00 for the vertical cross hair and tangent to 6:00 for the horizontal and a POI of the intersection. This seems to make chaser shots easier and the tangent hold doesn't cause the group to block out the hold elements.
For 2010 I swapped thin x-hairs and dots for bold x-hairs and no dots for 100/200 group shooting. I'll still use x-hair and dots for 600 yards.
At our last big shoot of 2009 (NBRSA Nats) I realized in a day of very still conditions that I was getting vertical just from the hold error of using a dot and holding at 6:00.
This new setup seemed to work at the final shoot of 2009, River Bend. I didn't shoot very well but I was trying out a new barrel configuration and a powder blend of some old and new H322.
For 2010 I swapped thin x-hairs and dots for bold x-hairs and no dots for 100/200 group shooting. I'll still use x-hair and dots for 600 yards.
At our last big shoot of 2009 (NBRSA Nats) I realized in a day of very still conditions that I was getting vertical just from the hold error of using a dot and holding at 6:00.
This new setup seemed to work at the final shoot of 2009, River Bend. I didn't shoot very well but I was trying out a new barrel configuration and a powder blend of some old and new H322.
I was taught to use the mothball with the crosshairs horiontal on the bottom of the mothball and the vertical on the left side of the mothball...with the group falling somewhere south or north of center of the mothball...
Mothball...in smallbore...thats called the bullseye...
MARK,
That system works fine if the wind isn't blowing you 3 rings right and one ring down for your first two shots. Then one ring left and a little high for your next two shots, followed by a head wind for the last two minutes of your group. See how easy it is to get lost ? Benchrest matches are seldom contested in perfect neutral conditions.
Nader,
And what about if you get a bullet bumped up to cut the ring at the top and then a push to cut the line at 9:00..... using your system?
I'm not arguing, I'm wondering. I haven't fired at my crosshairs for 20yrs....... until just this last year shooting 600yds. It was weird, EASY and kinda' refreshing to just "sight in" on the crosshairs!
But I still can't see it for 100-200 group.
al
Hi Al,
One can hardly refer to having the bullet impact where one is aiming as "my system".I think Davy Crockett was way ahead of me.I'm not a nitpicker with the scope dials,I would rather not have to touch them at all,so I'll go with as close to my aimpoint as I can get them.If you aim at 6 and impact center of mothball that's close enough to deal with the hurricane that is scheduled to pound the rifle range at 9:00 am Saturday and last until 3:00 pm Sunday.
The farther away your impact point is from your aimpoint( as with a tangent hold on the mothball with the impact being "somewhere north or south"of where one is aiming)The more difficult( time consuming) it will be to compensate one's hold should conditions change in the middle of one's group.
It is not uncommon for some exasperated newbie to come up to me at a match and ask for help cause his gun just isnt working.After covering all the safe handloading issues and weeding out the bench trash( backward rear bags glued to slippery pieces of wood,etc)I'll get behind him with a spotting scope and have him take a shot,most of the time the bullet will hit an inch or so away from the mothball,"were you aiming there"?,I'll ask."No I was aiming at the center of the moth ball"----OK-----ZERO THE RIFLE !!! "but I thought I was supposed to"-------ZERO THE RIFLE !!! "but I thought"------"Do you want my help or not?"----"ya"-----Then ZERO THE RIFLE. It's the number one problem with new shooters.
Where one's bullet impacts away from dead center when correlated with the read on the windflags is also instrumental in determining whether the gun is in or out of tune.
I wonder how Davy Crockett went about tuning his "flint lock" ?
One can hardly refer to having the bullet impact where one is aiming as "my system".I think Davy Crockett was way ahead of me.I'm not a nitpicker with the scope dials,I would rather not have to touch them at all,so I'll go with as close to my aimpoint as I can get them.If you aim at 6 and impact center of mothball that's close enough to deal with the hurricane that is scheduled to pound the rifle range at 9:00 am Saturday and last until 3:00 pm Sunday
.The farther away your impact point is from your aimpoint( as with a tangent hold on the mothball with the impact being "somewhere north or south"of where one is aiming)The more difficult( time consuming) it will be to compensate one's hold should conditions change in the middle of one's group.
It is not uncommon for some exasperated newbie to come up to me at a match and ask for help cause his gun just isnt working.After covering all the safe handloading issues and weeding out the bench trash( backward rear bags glued to slippery pieces of wood,etc)I'll get behind him with a spotting scope and have him take a shot,most of the time the bullet will hit an inch or so away from the mothball,"were you aiming there"?,I'll ask."No I was aiming at the center of the moth ball"----OK-----ZERO THE RIFLE !!! "but I thought I was supposed to"-------ZERO THE RIFLE !!! "but I thought"------"Do you want my help or not?"----"ya"-----Then ZERO THE RIFLE. It's the number one problem with new shooters.
Where one's bullet impacts away from dead center when correlated with the read on the windflags is also instrumental in determining whether the gun is in or out of tune.
I wonder how Davy Crockett went about tuning his "flint lock" ?
JerrySharrett
Senile Member
Hi Al,
One can hardly refer to having the bullet impact where one is aiming as "my system".I think Davy Crockett was way ahead of me.I'm not a nitpicker with the scope dials,I would rather not have to touch them at all,so I'll go with as close to my aimpoint as I can get them.If you aim at 6 and impact center of mothball that's close enough to deal with the hurricane that is scheduled to pound the rifle range at 9:00 am Saturday and last until 3:00 pm Sunday
The farther away your impact point is from your aimpoint( as with a tangent hold on the mothball with the impact being "somewhere north or south"of where one is aiming)The more difficult( time consuming) it will be to compensate one's hold should conditions change in the middle of one's group.
-------ZERO THE RIFLE !!! "but I thought"------"Do you want my help or not?"----"ya"-----Then ZERO THE RIFLE. It's the number one problem with new shooters.
Where one's bullet impacts away from dead center when correlated with the read on the windflags is also instrumental in determining whether the gun is in or out of tune.
I wonder how Davy Crockett went about tuning his "flint lock" ?
Joel, that is why I am really getting to like the Tangent at 9/Tangent at 6 and the POI at the cross hair intersection. That way if I have to chase, more now than I used to, the adjusted hold will be from the cross hair intersection.
As to Davy and his tune. I live close to the Davy Crockett Birthplace State Park. One of my best friends, Mark Haulback, is the Superintendent there, so I called him to get the details on Davy's tune. Turns out when Davy carved "Chil A Bar on this Tree" Davy was shooting at a benchrest target he had nailed to the tree and he hit The Bar sleeping on the third limb up!!
Harley Baker
Member
Aim Point
Joel. Stop It Just Stop It
Joel. Stop It Just Stop It
Wayne Campbell
Member
Harley!!!
Don't you fuss at Joel. Remember , it's cold up there and he can't get out and play.
Don't you fuss at Joel. Remember , it's cold up there and he can't get out and play.
Bob Kingsbury
New member
patent pending
Now guys, Joel is working on new cryo treatment for barrels
in his igloo
Now guys, Joel is working on new cryo treatment for barrels
in his igloo
Tim Oltersdorf
Active member
Playing outside in the Northeast
Wayne, I respectfully disagree about our neighbors in the Northeast not being able to get outside and play when it is cold. There are many outdoor activities native to the natives in that neck of the woods during the cold season which runs from Sept./1 to July/1 each year. There is the snow coloring tryouts and finals; brown, green and the ever popular yellow. The feet in the air mailbox and back slide for life championships is practiced daily. This is a sport the elderly often best the younger athletes at; extra form points for broken hips and wrists. There is the ever popular lock yourself out of the house wearing only a bathrobe and fuzzy slippers in a blizzard morning paper fetch. For those past their competitive prime or on the injured list (about 98% of all participants) spectator sports such as overcast sky gazing offer endless opportunities for self fulfillment. There are the old standbys cabin fever and the quest for the great unknown answer to the question of why the damn dog is taking so long to go when the temperature drops below zero. Add to this binge drinking and suicide contemplation and you have just the short list of all that this part of the country offers. Tim
Wayne, I respectfully disagree about our neighbors in the Northeast not being able to get outside and play when it is cold. There are many outdoor activities native to the natives in that neck of the woods during the cold season which runs from Sept./1 to July/1 each year. There is the snow coloring tryouts and finals; brown, green and the ever popular yellow. The feet in the air mailbox and back slide for life championships is practiced daily. This is a sport the elderly often best the younger athletes at; extra form points for broken hips and wrists. There is the ever popular lock yourself out of the house wearing only a bathrobe and fuzzy slippers in a blizzard morning paper fetch. For those past their competitive prime or on the injured list (about 98% of all participants) spectator sports such as overcast sky gazing offer endless opportunities for self fulfillment. There are the old standbys cabin fever and the quest for the great unknown answer to the question of why the damn dog is taking so long to go when the temperature drops below zero. Add to this binge drinking and suicide contemplation and you have just the short list of all that this part of the country offers. Tim
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More on the "supposed to" thing
I just got off the phone with my brother-in-law "Billy".It seems that "Billy" has a shower valve handle that has somehow become disconnected with the valve,he has unsucessfully attempted to fix the problem with "both" of his tools( a pair of pliers and a hammer)and at the request of my sister has elected to call me before things get worse.
Now "Billy", who has more deer/car collisions to his credit than any living person, has hit yet another deer.Sympathetically I inquired about his continuing bad luck."Billy" can't explain it.He saw the deer on the side of the road.He flashed his lights and blew his horn,"you know,like you're supposed to", "and the deer jumped right out in front of me".-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I just got off the phone with my brother-in-law "Billy".It seems that "Billy" has a shower valve handle that has somehow become disconnected with the valve,he has unsucessfully attempted to fix the problem with "both" of his tools( a pair of pliers and a hammer)and at the request of my sister has elected to call me before things get worse.
Now "Billy", who has more deer/car collisions to his credit than any living person, has hit yet another deer.Sympathetically I inquired about his continuing bad luck."Billy" can't explain it.He saw the deer on the side of the road.He flashed his lights and blew his horn,"you know,like you're supposed to", "and the deer jumped right out in front of me".-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tim Oltersdorf
Active member
If only it were an olympic event
Joel, Thanks for reminding us of the Northeast's most popular, winter, male activity: Deer Banging. It is a two part event. Part one, which Billy seems to have mastered, is bang the deer with the pickup. The second part is tricky and depends on the condition of the deer. A dead deer is perfect for the beginner. An injured and mobile deer is best left to the experts. If you strongly suspect Billy,and I certainly do, of engaging in part two confront him with your accusation secure in the knowledge that if he lives in the Northeast, is a male between the ages of 13 to 80 and it is winter you are probably right. Tim
Joel, Thanks for reminding us of the Northeast's most popular, winter, male activity: Deer Banging. It is a two part event. Part one, which Billy seems to have mastered, is bang the deer with the pickup. The second part is tricky and depends on the condition of the deer. A dead deer is perfect for the beginner. An injured and mobile deer is best left to the experts. If you strongly suspect Billy,and I certainly do, of engaging in part two confront him with your accusation secure in the knowledge that if he lives in the Northeast, is a male between the ages of 13 to 80 and it is winter you are probably right. Tim
Deer banging????
Isn't that the first step to making Venison burger???
After the bar closes. Chase deer with truck. Strike deer with truck. Then drive over deer several times.
Wallah. Venison burger.