Jackie Schmidt's VFS 30ppc

333smitty

333smitty

Tomball Gun Club
A couple of weeks ago Jackie ask me if I would like to shoot his
VFS 30ppc at our upcoming club match. This was an offer I could
NOT refuse.

Specs on the rig are as follows, Farley action, Kreiger 30cal 17 twist
barrel, millenium stock, Weaver 36x (frozen) Jackie style with a
set of Jewel and Foster mounts, Jewel BR trigger and up front there
is one of Jackie's "battle tested in competition" snubber tuners.

Sunday's match was the first time I used this rig in competition.
I did not do well on the first target scoring only 2x's, I got a handle on it
for the 2nd,3rd,and 4th targets scoring, 5x, 4x, 4x respecfully. I
choked on 5th target scoring only 3x's. Finished up third with 18x.
My good buddy Nick Marino won the event with his 6ppc.Way to go
Nick.

This was the first time for me to use a 30 in competition. It is easy
to shoot, behaved well in the bags, and no noticable recoil. IMHO

I really loved the "HUGE HOLE" it made in the target...:D

I did not do this rifle justice. A more accomplished shooter (Jackie)
than I could win on a regular basis with this rig. Maybe I'll do better
next time.:)

I'm now a 30cal fan and I will start building my own rig in the near
future.

Its not often you get an opportunity to use a rifle of this caliber
built by one the best gunsmiths and shooters in the country.

Thanks again Jackie,

Vic
 
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Jackie, I think some people think that you don't have time for new shooters and your fellow shooters. We know better.
Butch
 
Mike

You see them from 21 inches all the way to 26. With the limited powder capacity of the PPC Case, I doubt anything much more than 23 will give you much gain in the way of velocity. Especially with the Aussie IMR 4227 we are shooting.
The barrel on my 30 PPC is at 22 1/2 inches, you can hit over 3000 with the 112 grn bullets. But the best accuracy seems to be at 2900-2950 range. That is about where we are shooting it.
Ed Bernabeo's Rifle is a carbon copy of mine, we shoot the identicle load,and haven't changed it in over a year, when the Aussie IMR 4227 hit the market.
I woould like to goback and try the N120 again, it seemed a little slow back when I first started this project, the case being just about full when the accuracy really came in.
I will not lie,the 4227, which has a very quick pressure spike, is pretty hard on cases. Vic told me the cases, which had about 4 firings on them before this match, were getting pretty "clicky" at the end of Sundays match........jackie
 
Jackie,

That is why I went to the 30 GR (Grendel case) which is just a little bit larger on capacity, right in between the PPC and the BR. I am using the same powder, and I can get up to 3100 fps with the 112 gr bullets before cases start to show pressure damage. I run my velocity just over 3050, so I am pretty safe unless I cook a round in a hot barrel or do something else stupid. I should also mention that my design uses a 35 degree shoulder and with the diameter increase from 6.5 to 30 I end up with a .275 neck length. I am also using a 19 twist barrel, which precludes the use of some of the heavier (longer) bullets. However the new Berger 115s also work great. I just love this thing. It is the sweetest shooting rig I have ever had.:D:D

Larry
 
Larry

If I had it to do over, I might have taken the same route as you. But I was so intent on keeping the recoil at a minimum, for use in a 10.5 pound Rifle, that I just went with the PPC case.
Also, I never intended to shoot anything heavier than a 112, for the same reason.
All said and done, the Grendel is probably the better case, you can still use it in a PPC bolt face Rifle, and the cases are probably a little easier to make, as you are starting with a 6.5 instead of a 22.
Have you tried N120 in your case??. It would seem to be perfect for that capacity.
Any of these small capacity 30 cal chamberings are super accurate, the bullet selection is phenominol, and the 30 caliber barrels are just great. We haven't had a bad one yet. It is amazing how these slow twist barrels tame the Rifle down on the Bench. They just come straight back.
I will admit that this little thing is a rather "single purpose" Rifle, really designed to shoot 100 yard score. But there is a lot of that out there, much like what we are doing at Tomball......jackie
 
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jackie,

do you think a 220 russian case necked up to 30 cal has enough capacity to push 112-125 gr bullets to the 2900-3100 fps velocity ?

thanks

mike in co
 
mike in co said:
jackie,

do you think a 220 russian case necked up to 30 cal has enough capacity to push 112-125 gr bullets to the 2900-3100 fps velocity ?

thanks

mike in co
Click to expand...

I've done it with N120 in a modified 220 Russian case with 110 grain bullets.
 
30 PPC Load

I've been shooting a 30PPC in IBS VFS since March 07. My standard load is 112gr bullet with N120 2/3 way up neck. (Not posting charge weight but will give you the charge weight if you email me. Krieger 17 Twist Barrel 22.8" Long.
I've chrono'ed it many times - 3050FPS at 80 Degrees & 3025 at 60 Degrees.

I've won 4 or 5 matches with it and don't feel I'm giving up anything to the 30BR even at 200 yds.

I haven't seen the need to mess with 4227 since I think you're flirting with a potentially damaging pressure spike. With my load of N120 I've never had a pierced primer or any other excessive pressure signs and I've touched off hot rounds that had been sitting in the Florida Sun or heat soaked in a hot barrel.

If I had a little more case capacity I would like to try H4198 since I think it may have a larger tune window than the Vihtavouri.
 
I know one shooter using RL7 in his 30PPC. Out of curiosity, he filled the case full, just to see the speed. According to my chrono, it was just over 3000 fps. If I remember correctly, he was shooting a 115 grain bullet.
 
I tried the 4227 in my 30PPC and somewhere in the 2950 fps range w/ 112gr bullets the pressure was reaching max and occasionally the brass would expand into the ejector hole and case heads would expand noticeably. Not caring much for that I decided to try N120. I can reach higher velocities with the N120 and I don't think I can get enough in the case to be at dangerous pressure levels. I was a little surprised at the velocity I can acheive with the N120. This is a neat little case. Pretty amazing that you can get close to 3000 fps with less than 30 grs of powder in a 30 cal.
 
30 Grendel

What is the parent case of the 30 GR?

Can someone go thru the case forming process?

Thanks...Vic
 
333smitty said:
What is the parent case of the 30 GR?

Can someone go thru the case forming process?

Thanks...Vic
Click to expand...

The 6.5 Grendel. Brass is made by Lapua. If you had a dedicated barrel for fireforming you could shoot a 6.5 bullet and fireform similar to what Jackie does for his 6ppc and 30ppc. If you go with a thick enough neck you would not have to trim neck wall thickness. This method is not recommended for fireforming in your good match barrels.
 
Joel beat me to it but....

333smitty said:
What is the parent case of the 30 GR?

Can someone go thru the case forming process?

Thanks...Vic
Click to expand...


There are some different variants being played with but I think they are all working well. I call mine a 30 Major. It's basesd off of a 6.5 Grendel case which is a .075" long ppc necked up. Good brass is available from Lapua. With my cartridge, you just neck up the 6.5 Grendel brass to 30, turn the necks for, in my case, a .330 chamber, and load em' up and go shoot. It doesn't get much easier than that! It is a real good shooting little round...very efficient cartridge,too. I think more and more people are finding out that it works great! Heck, it can't be too bad ...it's case volume puts it pretty much right between a ppc and a BR. The brass uses small primers and is of good quality. I like the little 30 Major better than I did the 30BR, and that's saying something. IMO, if you have a rifle with a ppc bolt face, it's the obvious choice to go with for score shooting. ---Mike Ezell
 
AVanGorder said:
Mike,

How do you make your dies?

Adrian
Click to expand...

Adrian, at this time, I use a carbide reamer to open the neck portion of a 6.5 Grendel Type "s" Redding Fl bushing die for the sizer and make the seater using my reamer. I usually keep a couple of sets on hand---Mike Ezell
 
Adrian

For my 30 GR I have the chambering reamer, a full length die reamer and even a dedicated straight line seater reamer. I get my size die blanks from Troy Newlon and my seater die blanks from Wilson. I do commercial work, so if you need anything call me at 989-773-2883.

Larry
 
My thoughts at this point which are points that Jackie and Mike have mentioned. If you want a LV score gun with more manageable recoil and the 2950 fps range with 112-115 gr bullets is acceptable then consider the 30ppc or 30 on the Grendel case, especially if you have a ppc bolt face. If you have a 308 bolt face and want to mazimize velocity then go with a BR. It's hard to improve on the 30BR but some of us like experimenting with new chamberings.
 
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