Harrison/DoAll 13" lathe

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dokey

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Harrison M300 /DoAll 13" lathe

Anybody have any experience with a Harrison M300 13" lathe? I believe it was manufactured in England. Also has a DoAll 13" sticker on it. Also has a 3HP 3PH motor. I would like to install a 220V solid sate phase converter and wonder if I should bypass all the controlls and wire the motor direct with a 220V magnetic starter? I've been watching a VFD drive on Ebay auction 3006 5288 6556. Would this be suitable for converting the 3HP 3PH motor that's on the lathe?
 
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Harrison lathe

I currently own a Harrison M300 when they were building rebadged for South Bend Lathe #7388 . I bought this used from the Air force I'm not disappointed at all it is a great lathe for home gunsmithing I have worked on South Bend Heavy 10 and Clausing 15" lathes. Harrison M300 can hang with them easily. Nice headstock for chambering through the headstock, controls are nice seems to be just the right size lathe not to big not to small. I've chambered a few barrels with fine results. Cuts threads just fine as with anything setup is important as to the outcome. I like the D1-4 config. the chucks don't weigh a ton easy to change if needed. Chucks fit both lathes that I have. I like the Harrison M300 take your DTI's and check out what you are looking to purchase. The lathe is geared headstock which is not as quiet as belt driven only thing that I noticed. I by passed everything and installed a VFD works great.
 
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What is VFD? and where can I get a manual for it, I mean a manual for the lathe
 
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Vfd

It is a Variable Frequency Drive it allows you to convert your single phase 220 V into three phase 220 Volt. Much safer than building your own converter. You can find one here @ dealerselectric.com Mine cost about $200.00 with shipping they work great.
 
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The units that have a potentiometer will allow you variable speed with a twist of a knob. You can add braking resistors for instant stoping.
 
Have an M300 one of the few lathes to offer no faffing about to change thread pitch, just dial it in no change wheels.

Stands a good chance its dual voltage nearly all are and will say on motor plate, mine isn't with the GEC motor but coolant pump is.


No need to run 1ph 240V to 220V 3PH, no benefit in fact a hindrance with less power. I can get mine running 400V to just about slow down at 540rpm putting a cut on, 220v usually 1/3 less output. Not to mention doing away with all the factory necessary controls as in spindle stop/forward/reverse, brake needed for threading plus lesser needed controls. Coolant with vfd will also need wiring in and would fluctuate depending upon voltage supplied via rotary pot.
Really no point in variable speed when have such a good geared head of speeds to 2500rpm from 40rpm via two 3 position selectors.
Of course you can figure out and rewire in the spindle start 7 wires two micro switches and foot brake to inverter which is a must.

Run mine from 1ph 240V to 3ph 400V digital inverter exactly the way Harrison intended keeping control boards, isolator switch and the like its just plug and play like it would be used in factories. Do have a rotary 5.5hp convertor as well, its not man enough exceptionally noisy and spindle easy to get to slow down with menial cuts on just kept for emergency.
 
Runout

What would acceptable runout be on an M300 lathe with the 3 jaw chuck? I had to disassemble and remove the dried white grease because the jaws were frozen. Wire brushed all the parts with a soft wheel, lubed and got it back together
 
dokey said:
What would acceptable runout be on an M300 lathe with the 3 jaw chuck? I had to disassemble and remove the dried white grease because the jaws were frozen. Wire brushed all the parts with a soft wheel, lubed and got it back together
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It would depend on the three jaw chuck! A four jaw chuck will solve that problem.o
 
I checked the Hub with a dial indicator and there's just about 0 runout. The 3 jaw chuck is a 3 pin camlock that I assume came with the lathe.
 
dokey said:
I checked the Hub with a dial indicator and there's just about 0 runout. The 3 jaw chuck is a 3 pin camlock that I assume came with the lathe.
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I assume when you say hub you mean spindle. Your three pin camlock IS your backplate which is attached to the chuck. Run out will probably be in the .005 range if things were done right,if that's not tight enough you will have to resort to a four jaw. When I was a young man all I could afford was a four jaw chuck and in time I got quite handy "dialing in" my work.
 
Inspection card

HERE YA GO DOKEY YOU CAN FOLLOW THIS:cool: JUST "SAVE IMAGE AS"
 

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wiring

when I connected my solid state 220 V phase converter to the lathe's 3 phase wiring I get nothing, but connected directly to the motor independently the motor runs. Am I missing or doing something wrong? Would swapping around the leads have anything to do with it?
 
Butch Lambert said:
JonnyH,
So you have used a VFD and had difficulties? Or did you read it on the internet?
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No I don't run VFD I run a 1Ph 240V input digital Inverter having a variable output of 400V 3Ph wired in using original control board as would be powered by any factory having 3ph 400V+. This does exactly the same job as a static convertor and rotary convertor as in 'Plug and Play'

Sorry no info on their site only on ebay. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10-HP-220...817?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item58ac9fa599

Trying not to confuse things have had the 5hp model 400v output wired VFD but no help from seller and 100+ page manual as good as useless. Lesser 220v output have wiring diagrams. I can find no one in the world that has done the VFD route at 220v to categorically say they have not had reduced power. Videos only show menial or finishing cuts by amatuers, I want the job done when time is money.

VFD have to wired direct in to each motor to control - Slow spindle speed down if coolant wired in as well that slows as well. Also need to wire in the spindle start/stop/reverse and most important foot brake.
Their are wiring diagrams on Harrison forum but doesn't match mine.
 
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dokey said:
when I connected my solid state 220 V phase converter to the lathe's 3 phase wiring I get nothing, but connected directly to the motor independently the motor runs. Am I missing or doing something wrong? Would swapping around the leads have anything to do with it?
Click to expand...

I am assuming its a 220v VFD you have, it takes around300 to 330V for the contactors to latch in (they will chatter until minimum voltage received) before power can be distributed. Meaning would need a static convertor, rotary convertor or digital 400V+ inverter.
The only way that will run is direct to motor, hope you have a manual you will need to disconnect everything original and wire to inverter the lathe controls such as spindle start/stop/reverse, panic and foot brake a must for shoulder work.
 
Jonnyh said:
No I don't run VFD I run a 1Ph 240V input digital Inverter having a variable output of 400V 3Ph wired in using original control board as would be powered by any factory having 3ph 400V+. This does exactly the same job as a static convertor and rotary convertor as in 'Plug and Play'

Sorry no info on their site only on ebay. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10-HP-220...817?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item58ac9fa599

Trying not to confuse things have had the 5hp model 400v output wired VFD but no help from seller and 100+ page manual as good as useless. Lesser 220v output have wiring diagrams. I can find no one in the world that has done the VFD route at 220v to categorically say they have not had reduced power. Videos only show menial or finishing cuts by amatuers, I want the job done when time is money.

VFD have to wired direct in to each motor to control - Slow spindle speed down if coolant wired in as well that slows as well. Also need to wire in the spindle start/stop/reverse and most important foot brake.
Their are wiring diagrams on Harrison forum but doesn't match mine.
Click to expand...

Jonnyh,
My Monarch has 3 phase coming in at 220V. The lathe motor runs on single phase and the coolant pump motor runs on 220 3phase. I'm not an electrician, but 3phase comes into the fusebox on the lathe. I guess the electrician came out of the box with single phase for the lathe motor and 3 phase for the coolant motor. Why would they do that? Monarch I mean?
 
Vfd

I bypassed the power/control box left the carriage reverse controls out, you could wire them in the circuit if you wanted them. VFD can be wired for E-Stop also I have an E-Stop button as my lathe did not come with a foot brake. If you size the VFD correctly there should not be a loss in power. Yes the manuals can be a bit overwhelming as when I purchased some used VFDs from a local electrical company I had to demonstrate to them how to check the VFDs out to make sure they worked correctly. I noticed no loss in power as a VFD is designed such that it allows you to slow down the motor without the loss in power. If and when you decide to wire in an VFD wire the motor directly into the VFD and control on and off from the VFD. It is not good juju to wire a switch between VFD and motor. Also changed the coolant pump to single phase 220V as the original coolant pump was trashed. I am hobbyist home garage tinkering dude. :)
 

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VFD Conversion on my 1236 ACER ATrump

Here is another way to convert an old lathe to a VFD control. Picked this machine in September, shortly thereafter the forward relay started locking up that even turning off the lever and the EMO, the spindle ran. Switched the forward relay in the forward slot. That was the trigger for me to start thinking about the conversion. A retired Oncologist from Tucson was kind enough to render the much needed help to do the conversion - he did the relay logic board, the VFD box and other major components, I just basically did the integration.


The pictures tell the tale.

Here are some notable details: I have always disliked the spindle control lever, during the conversion I elected to use switches for the Stop, FWD, and REV directions of the spindle. Positioned the sealed box under the chip tray. The company does not support this lathe any longer, parts could be very hard to source later, decided to update the relay control logic. The 3P, 2HP Marathon is more robust than the 1 1/2 HP Taiwanese one that originally came with the lathe.




















 
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