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marion packett
Guest
what do you think of using the arbor press with force measement and dial indicator to sort cases by neck tension? Pros and cons please!
Butch Lambert
Active member
Who makes the seating die with the pressure gauge on it? Feedback that I have seen posted didn't indicate it was worthwhile.
Butch
Butch
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marion packett
Guest
Butch, I was referring to the arbor press with force measement and dial indicator sold by K&M. It requires Wilson seater die
I had to put a longer handle on mine to get the right feel. other than that its a little slower but works fine. You do have to look at the stem of the die, and the gauge at the same time. It should have a needle on the inside of the gauge like a torque wrench! May help. If someone can come up with something along these lines I want a cut.
Joe Salt
Joe Salt
Joe Salt
Joe Salt
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glbreil
Guest
I took a 6.5/284 Redding competition die some time back and made some adapters for an electronic force gauge on the stem and tried that for a while. My force gauge will tell you the peak force hit during the stroke. One thing I found is that you can greatly vary the force required to seat the bullet by the varying the speed that you pull the press handle. If you are going to be real serious about it then the press needs to be automated or you need to find some way to operate it very consistently. That being said you can pretty easily cull out the necks that are extremely tight or extremely loose.
Gary Breiling
Gary Breiling
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marion packett
Guest
Thanks Gary. Are there others who use the K & M arbor press with force measement with dial indicator. What is your opinion on its use to sort by neck tension?
brian roberts
New member
Marion, I never used a gauge as you are questioning, but I have found that by changing the return spring inside, the effort is much less, and the bullet's ogive doesn't get as mangled/deformed.
Load up a bunch. Have a batch where the "results" of seating force are very even, and another batch where they are all over the place.
Now get a co-conspirator, to hand you the batches so you don't know what's what. Shoot groups. Only your co-conspirator knows which is which. If you can see a difference in the groups, it matters. Of course, if the sort with "all over the place" shoots better, you have a conundrum . . .
Now get a co-conspirator, to hand you the batches so you don't know what's what. Shoot groups. Only your co-conspirator knows which is which. If you can see a difference in the groups, it matters. Of course, if the sort with "all over the place" shoots better, you have a conundrum . . .
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4Mesh
Guest
I'm sorta with what Charles is saying here. I'd elaborate a bit and say that I think neck tension is very important if you are shooting very near the lands, or if you shoot a jam. If you jump a bit, it becomes much less meaningful. Maybe even meaningless.
Now, if you anneal, that makes neck tension much more consistent, but more than that, it sorta cures some troubles that are associated with neck tension problems to begin with. It's like, annealing makes it better and less meaningful all in one fell swoop.
I've used one of the K&M presses. (not on my own ammo fyi). I thought it was very consistent in the way it read, and I don't remember speed affecting how it worked as glbriel did. I only ever did about 20 rounds though, and they weren't even my own. That might vary with heavy or light tension. The ones I did were pretty light so there wasnt' much room for variation anyhow.
Just remember, you're gonna get people who say its very important, and others who say it's totally unimportant. And they're probably both right, talking about their own guns. Might be best to do Charles' test.
Now, if you anneal, that makes neck tension much more consistent, but more than that, it sorta cures some troubles that are associated with neck tension problems to begin with. It's like, annealing makes it better and less meaningful all in one fell swoop.
I've used one of the K&M presses. (not on my own ammo fyi). I thought it was very consistent in the way it read, and I don't remember speed affecting how it worked as glbriel did. I only ever did about 20 rounds though, and they weren't even my own. That might vary with heavy or light tension. The ones I did were pretty light so there wasnt' much room for variation anyhow.
Just remember, you're gonna get people who say its very important, and others who say it's totally unimportant. And they're probably both right, talking about their own guns. Might be best to do Charles' test.
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marion packett
Guest
thanks for the previous responses, but I am assuming that consistent neck tension is of the utmost importance in long range shooting, therefor are any of you long range shooters using the force measurement feature of this tool and do you consider it reliable?
Marion yes I use my K&M tool to check my neck tension, but like I said before, you have to have two sets of eyes. at least that is how I feel, but it is worth doing. At the world open this weeken I used it. but the wind wasn't any help. Won 2 out of 4 relays for group and score. but got my butt handed to me by the wind the other two. Haven't decided what pressure is the right one.
Joe Salt
Joe Salt
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marion packett
Guest
I have one in shipment to me now. Hope I can make sense of its use. There are no instructions on there web site so I assume it will come without instructions on its use.
Wayne Shaw
Active member
Brass condition makes a difference, but I always clean the inside of case necks. The feel you get seating bullets as apposed to just brushing them is very noticeable. Now many clean the whole inside in the long range game, which makes this a mute point. I think the grittiness when seating bullets is an added resistance to the feel.
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