C
cris
Guest
LD,
Thanks for your input.
Thanks for your input.
W
Wayne Burns
Guest
cris
Registered User
Join Date
Oct 2008
Posts
202
Gordon,
"Shooters have reported 6 pound barrels at .900 OD and stocks between 8-9 pounds to accommodate large bottles. Scopes with rings will push 2 pounds."
Steve, how does 6 + 9 + 2 = 22? That adds up to 17lbs in my math. 18 is the compromise that lets the "out of the box" guns play with the existing HV B guns. That's the link we want, not Open to Unlimited. Unlimited is a class by itself, by it's very nature. This is a big mistake as Gordon said in his first post.
Wayne Burns,
Match Director,
Ashland Air Rifle Range
Registered User
Join Date
Oct 2008
Posts
202
Gordon,
"Shooters have reported 6 pound barrels at .900 OD and stocks between 8-9 pounds to accommodate large bottles. Scopes with rings will push 2 pounds."
Steve, how does 6 + 9 + 2 = 22? That adds up to 17lbs in my math. 18 is the compromise that lets the "out of the box" guns play with the existing HV B guns. That's the link we want, not Open to Unlimited. Unlimited is a class by itself, by it's very nature. This is a big mistake as Gordon said in his first post.
Wayne Burns,
Match Director,
Ashland Air Rifle Range
C
cris
Guest
Wayne,
Barrel, 6 pounds
Stock, 8 pounds
Scope/Rings, 2 pounds
Action/Trigger, 3 pounds
Air Tube/Regulator, 2 pounds
Some of these weights are guesses and some have been passed on for information.
Out of the box guns can compete and we want other designs to be able to compete as well, without going to a .25 caliber class only.
One piece rests are very popular and have a great deal of support in this class and the Unlimited class.
Barrel, 6 pounds
Stock, 8 pounds
Scope/Rings, 2 pounds
Action/Trigger, 3 pounds
Air Tube/Regulator, 2 pounds
Some of these weights are guesses and some have been passed on for information.
Out of the box guns can compete and we want other designs to be able to compete as well, without going to a .25 caliber class only.
One piece rests are very popular and have a great deal of support in this class and the Unlimited class.
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Exitpupil
Guest
My .02. I vote for staying with the International Rules and let skill be part of the equation. Why reinvent the wheel? That way a fellow with a reasonably accurate rifle can be competitive if he can read wind flags and shoot and can travel anywhere and be legal to compete. It limits potential costs and keeps the USA strong for International competition. I find the international target and rules quite challenging and leaves room for growth for a long time. Look at RF and you can see where this can end up. Multiple associations with different rules and equipment, different targets so you can't compare scores, top rifles made by only a select few smiths (expensive and wait time), bickering over ammo distribution, two or even three rifles required, and if you drop one point you are done for the day. Not much fun or attraction for recruiting new shooters. Will Piatt
C
cris
Guest
Will,
We are continuing with the existing 4 rifle classes and rules from the WRABF. In that way, we remain ready and able to compete with the rest of the world.
The 2 new rifle classes are for those that want to shoot something over 20 FPE and the .25 caliber, which also takes more power.
We are continuing with the existing 4 rifle classes and rules from the WRABF. In that way, we remain ready and able to compete with the rest of the world.
The 2 new rifle classes are for those that want to shoot something over 20 FPE and the .25 caliber, which also takes more power.
G
GordonDawson
Guest
When will the new classes take effect?
I heard there are a couple guys building rail guns for the unlimited. I can't wait to see those!
I heard there are a couple guys building rail guns for the unlimited. I can't wait to see those!
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C
cris
Guest
Gordon,
Hopefully, in a few days when as many as possible have weighed in and we can be more sure that we have this right.
Hopefully, in a few days when as many as possible have weighed in and we can be more sure that we have this right.
C
cris
Guest
Last Call
The weight limit appears to be the last wrinkle to iron out.
A low of 18 pounds has been proposed.
A high of 22 pounds is our compromised proposal.
Any further input. Thanks.
The weight limit appears to be the last wrinkle to iron out.
A low of 18 pounds has been proposed.
A high of 22 pounds is our compromised proposal.
Any further input. Thanks.
D
Dave Shattuck
Guest
All I'll throw in here is that the intent of an "OPEN" Class should only be to give those who have FAC guns, but don't want to lower their power levels enough to qualify for the HV-B Class, a place to shoot.
After a weekend of thinking it over I finally realized that the Open Class shouldn't be a whole new Class with different rules from what are already in place, but instead should be just a modification of a current rule to broaden the spectrum of what is being offered. Any radical changes other than for an increase of the FPE level, like increasing weight limits, should be left for the Unlimited Class and not done here.
So, what I am strongly advising is that we add a HV-C Class that mirrors the HV-B Class with all the same rules other than for allowing the use of guns of up to and including 35FPE and leave all the other changes and increases for the Unlimited Class.
After a weekend of thinking it over I finally realized that the Open Class shouldn't be a whole new Class with different rules from what are already in place, but instead should be just a modification of a current rule to broaden the spectrum of what is being offered. Any radical changes other than for an increase of the FPE level, like increasing weight limits, should be left for the Unlimited Class and not done here.
So, what I am strongly advising is that we add a HV-C Class that mirrors the HV-B Class with all the same rules other than for allowing the use of guns of up to and including 35FPE and leave all the other changes and increases for the Unlimited Class.
T
therealld
Guest
Makes good sense to me. My HV gun WAS set for 32fpe before I shot the Worlds match, and I turned it down. Now I've turned it back up again, but I'll still keep it under 15lbs. I've seen no need to add weight to it. So far as I know, there really anrent any readily available guns you can buy that exceed 15lbs with most common scope setups anyhow.
I think special super heavy guns and special one-piece rests have a place in BR competition, but it should be in an "experimental", or
"unlimited class" rather than be fitted into a standard Varmint class as though they are common fare.
I think special super heavy guns and special one-piece rests have a place in BR competition, but it should be in an "experimental", or
"unlimited class" rather than be fitted into a standard Varmint class as though they are common fare.
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GordonDawson
Guest
Do I hear 20lbs...............going once,...................going twice.......................lol
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Wayne Burns
Guest
Dave,
I've already said what you said... so I certainly agree. I proposed 18lbs as the compromise. But, I agree with LD and yourself, that it's better still to keep everything the same as HV-B class except up the fpe to 35. AGAIN, a lot of existing shooters have already turned down their under 15lb HV -B rigs from 35fpe to 20fpe for the HV B class. Unlimited class is where the extra weight belongs. We don't want to add weight for open class.. we want to shoot both classes with a simple power adjustment.
Wayne Burns,
Match Director,
Ashland Air Rifle Range
I've already said what you said... so I certainly agree. I proposed 18lbs as the compromise. But, I agree with LD and yourself, that it's better still to keep everything the same as HV-B class except up the fpe to 35. AGAIN, a lot of existing shooters have already turned down their under 15lb HV -B rigs from 35fpe to 20fpe for the HV B class. Unlimited class is where the extra weight belongs. We don't want to add weight for open class.. we want to shoot both classes with a simple power adjustment.
Wayne Burns,
Match Director,
Ashland Air Rifle Range
G
GordonDawson
Guest
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C
cris
Guest
Gordon,
Not the final word but we are close. I put them on the website hoping to get more feedback.
Not the final word but we are close. I put them on the website hoping to get more feedback.