W
wolf gray
Guest
Hell of an idea, Francis !
Goes to show you not everything in Minn. is frozen.
Best,
Dan Batko
"Where are we going and why am I in this basket?"
World Record Scoring
- Thread starter Gene B
- Start date
Hell of an idea, Francis !
Goes to show you not everything in Minn. is frozen.
Best,
Dan Batko
"Where are we going and why am I in this basket?"
John Kielly
Shari's fan club
Just so you make the right choice: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bugger
Remember that you might as well be hanged for a goat as a for lamb,
Remember that you might as well be hanged for a goat as a for lamb,
Pete Wass
Well-known member
I use to work some with Brits in the past and their used the word was as in the first definition in the above reference.
Where I grew up folks almost exclusively use the word when referring to young boys but then folks from that area often use to use words in the opposite of their meaning so I figured they might have that one all wrong as well. I should have looked it up before I jumped into this. It would appear that time has diluted the meaning but perhaps not in the common vocabluary in GB.
I guess I've dug this hole deep enough though.
Pete
Where I grew up folks almost exclusively use the word when referring to young boys but then folks from that area often use to use words in the opposite of their meaning so I figured they might have that one all wrong as well. I should have looked it up before I jumped into this. It would appear that time has diluted the meaning but perhaps not in the common vocabluary in GB.
I guess I've dug this hole deep enough though.
Pete
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jackie schmidt
New member
Good Save, Francis.........jackie
J
j mckinnie
Guest
if i remember right
the original international shoots were in a postal format.I cant find my medal but I think they were an IBS initiative.Does that mean IBS has the right to measure world records?Or do yhey have to be shot at a WBC on a level play ground??
the original international shoots were in a postal format.I cant find my medal but I think they were an IBS initiative.Does that mean IBS has the right to measure world records?Or do yhey have to be shot at a WBC on a level play ground??
The only potential record targets that my committee scores are shot at NBRSA registered matches. While we call them world records they are in reality NBRSA records and NBRSA records only.
There is a European region in the NBRSA and if a potential record is shot in that region, at a registered match, my committee would score those targets, provided they are submitted to me for recognition. That is the only NBRSA region outside of this country. So any potential record shot anywhere else in this world would not be considered by the NBRSA.
The World Bench Rest Federation keeps its own records, but to my knowledge the only matches that the WBC sanctions are the world finals, shot every two years. The WBC has its own rule book, and it is much the same as the NBRSA rule book.
The IBS keeps their own records and has their own scoring committee, Kent is their chairman. The IBS also calls their records world records. I don’t want to speak for the IBS but, I would think that the IBS would not consider a set of targets unless the match was a registered IBS shoot??
Because Kent is on my committee as well as being the chairman of the IBS committee, Kent has already scored this particular set of targets.
Gene
There is a European region in the NBRSA and if a potential record is shot in that region, at a registered match, my committee would score those targets, provided they are submitted to me for recognition. That is the only NBRSA region outside of this country. So any potential record shot anywhere else in this world would not be considered by the NBRSA.
The World Bench Rest Federation keeps its own records, but to my knowledge the only matches that the WBC sanctions are the world finals, shot every two years. The WBC has its own rule book, and it is much the same as the NBRSA rule book.
The IBS keeps their own records and has their own scoring committee, Kent is their chairman. The IBS also calls their records world records. I don’t want to speak for the IBS but, I would think that the IBS would not consider a set of targets unless the match was a registered IBS shoot??
Because Kent is on my committee as well as being the chairman of the IBS committee, Kent has already scored this particular set of targets.
Gene
Vern
Morethan1waytoskinacat
Gene B
"I will not respond to any other postings about these targets.
If you have any questions about the scoring process, please do ask and I’ll do my best to answer. "
I did ask a question about the transfer and shipping process the committee uses.
"Gene that was a well written explanation.
I have only one question and to make it clear it is not in relation to any one or their abilities or conduct.
With all the care that is taken at the range to make sure no one alters the target intentionally or unintentionally and after what you said about targets and or paper shrinking after being wet and dry along with other possibilities what is the process for shipping/mailing the targets around the various states in this country to maintain the integrity of the paper and insure that the postman or ups/fedex carriers dont allow it to get wet, pressed, crushed or otherwise altered or destroyed. Is there a special air tight crush proof container possibly? "
Care to answer?
"I will not respond to any other postings about these targets.
If you have any questions about the scoring process, please do ask and I’ll do my best to answer. "
I did ask a question about the transfer and shipping process the committee uses.
"Gene that was a well written explanation.
I have only one question and to make it clear it is not in relation to any one or their abilities or conduct.
With all the care that is taken at the range to make sure no one alters the target intentionally or unintentionally and after what you said about targets and or paper shrinking after being wet and dry along with other possibilities what is the process for shipping/mailing the targets around the various states in this country to maintain the integrity of the paper and insure that the postman or ups/fedex carriers dont allow it to get wet, pressed, crushed or otherwise altered or destroyed. Is there a special air tight crush proof container possibly? "
Care to answer?
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jackie schmidt
New member
Vern, I can say this.
When Gene gave me back the targets, they were in a nice box, with the addresses of all of the Committee Members, so I guess this was the box used to ship them. In short, they were well protected, Gene saw to it that NOTHING could happen to them, as has happenned in years past, and they appeared to have no bends, folds, cracks, or any kind of damage that would have affected the Committee Memebers arriving at their measurements.
In my opinion, the Records Committee did their job. What I am beginning to see is what we have is a desrepency in how targets are measured, when getting down to measurements this small, the way individule places the reticles, and the way the individule ascertains exactly what is "bullet black', what is paper extrusion, etc, is open for interpretation. In the end, the Records Committee has no choice but to record what they believe is the largest possible measurements, because once they are a record, it cannot be taken back.
I have said before, I accept these measurements as far as the Official NBRSA Record is concerned. I simply think that, in my opinion, they aggregate is a tad smaller than the official measurments.
I have also taken these targets and laid them beside targets with 6mm holes in them. In my opinion, there is a lot more of that spiderwebbing emmitting from the 30 caliber holes that the 6mm holes. I do not know what causes this, but you can sure see it when you look at them with a magnifying glass.
Perhaps in the future, the Sanctioning Bodies will look into this.
.Records have very little to do with our everyday shooting. But, it is a important event in the life of an individule, and the excitement of even being considered is something to cherish. But, If a record is not a record, then the last thing we want is for the committe to "give the shooter a break". This is a tough game, it should remain that way. That keeps us all coming back in order to do better......jackie
When Gene gave me back the targets, they were in a nice box, with the addresses of all of the Committee Members, so I guess this was the box used to ship them. In short, they were well protected, Gene saw to it that NOTHING could happen to them, as has happenned in years past, and they appeared to have no bends, folds, cracks, or any kind of damage that would have affected the Committee Memebers arriving at their measurements.
In my opinion, the Records Committee did their job. What I am beginning to see is what we have is a desrepency in how targets are measured, when getting down to measurements this small, the way individule places the reticles, and the way the individule ascertains exactly what is "bullet black', what is paper extrusion, etc, is open for interpretation. In the end, the Records Committee has no choice but to record what they believe is the largest possible measurements, because once they are a record, it cannot be taken back.
I have said before, I accept these measurements as far as the Official NBRSA Record is concerned. I simply think that, in my opinion, they aggregate is a tad smaller than the official measurments.
I have also taken these targets and laid them beside targets with 6mm holes in them. In my opinion, there is a lot more of that spiderwebbing emmitting from the 30 caliber holes that the 6mm holes. I do not know what causes this, but you can sure see it when you look at them with a magnifying glass.
Perhaps in the future, the Sanctioning Bodies will look into this.
.Records have very little to do with our everyday shooting. But, it is a important event in the life of an individule, and the excitement of even being considered is something to cherish. But, If a record is not a record, then the last thing we want is for the committe to "give the shooter a break". This is a tough game, it should remain that way. That keeps us all coming back in order to do better......jackie
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Kent Harshman
Member
IBS Records
As Gene alludes to a few posts up, in order for targets to be considered as IBS records, they must have been shot in a registered IBS match. The IBS record certificate verbiage alludes to 'so-and-so (name)' "has established an International Record in shooting from a rest..." and concludes with "In recognition thereof this certificate is awarded by the International Benchrest Shooters." The IBS has affiliated clubs in Australia, Canada, Great Britain, Italy, Russia & South Africa, besides here in the states, and if those clubs hold registered matches and shoot records, they would be sent to our committee for scoring. Let's not get too hung up on semantics...after all, it IS a "world" or "international" record for the particular organization in which it is shot...
Kent
As Gene alludes to a few posts up, in order for targets to be considered as IBS records, they must have been shot in a registered IBS match. The IBS record certificate verbiage alludes to 'so-and-so (name)' "has established an International Record in shooting from a rest..." and concludes with "In recognition thereof this certificate is awarded by the International Benchrest Shooters." The IBS has affiliated clubs in Australia, Canada, Great Britain, Italy, Russia & South Africa, besides here in the states, and if those clubs hold registered matches and shoot records, they would be sent to our committee for scoring. Let's not get too hung up on semantics...after all, it IS a "world" or "international" record for the particular organization in which it is shot...
Kent
John Kielly
Shari's fan club
Kent,
You're so right.
Hereabouts, we get quite heady about our international events too. Why not drop out Boxing Day next year to experience the thrills of the World Rabbit Skinning Championship at Moyston, Victoria. You'll never see rodents get so bald so quickly.
John
You're so right.
Hereabouts, we get quite heady about our international events too. Why not drop out Boxing Day next year to experience the thrills of the World Rabbit Skinning Championship at Moyston, Victoria. You'll never see rodents get so bald so quickly.
John
C
Cheechako
Guest
John
What's the current World record? I need to know what I'm up against.
Ray
What's the current World record? I need to know what I'm up against.
Ray
Vern
I apologize for taking so long to get back to you --
The short answer to your question is NO ---
While there is special care taken when mailing out targets in that we pack them in a flat cardboard container that is sealed with tape. We do not fold, bend, or roll the targets. We hand carry them to the post office and send all targets Priority mail and mark them as fragile. ---- But, there is no specified container -- they are not required to be wrapped in any humidity proof materials or to be packaged in any crush proof container.
what I've been doing is shipping them in the same type of container that I gave Jackie his targets in. It is just two pieces of corrugated cardboard taped at the seams --I have found this to be the best type of container.
If you can come up with anything better I certainly am open to suggestions -- I looked a while back for something better but couldn't come up with anything that was sized right and suitable for sending targets thru the mail.
I also don't insure the targets or mail them with any type of signature requirement on the other end ---I wouldn't want them mailed to me that way either as there is not somebody here at all times to receive them.
Now having said all that --- to my knowledge the NBRSA has never lost any targets in the mail nor has the USPS damaged any targets (they did damage a Scoville rifle stock for me, but no targets so far, so I know that they are capable of damage) There have been some targets lost for a while before I took this job, but they have all been recovered --
I hope that this answer's your question, If not, then please ask again and I'll try to answer ---
If anybody else feels that I’ve overlooked a legitimate question please rattle my chain again and I'll get with it ---I've got a few other things on my mind right now and I again apologize for not responding in a timely fashion.
Gene Bukys
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Vern
just so as not to be misleading ---I have received targets that have been folded, rolled up and shipped in a tube, and several other ways but that dammage was done before I received them ---I don't know who did the dammage but it had to be either the range official that mailed them to the region director or the region director himself. ---Most of the time I receive targets in good condition properly packed flat. ---
Gene
just so as not to be misleading ---I have received targets that have been folded, rolled up and shipped in a tube, and several other ways but that dammage was done before I received them ---I don't know who did the dammage but it had to be either the range official that mailed them to the region director or the region director himself. ---Most of the time I receive targets in good condition properly packed flat. ---
Gene
Kent the confusion comes where there are at present 3 sets of so called "World Records" which are NBRSA, IBS and WBSF, so which are the actual world records??
My thoughts are that there would only be one set of "World Records". Which to set a record would require head to head competition at the same venue by representatives from multiple countries under the same rules, similar to how other sports hold World Championships.
While I see IBS and NBRSA have membership from other countries most of those members are mostly clubs with only one or two Benchrest organisations. This would make both the IBS and NBRSA records "International records" for each organisation.......but still not a "World Record" (my opinion only).
I have been trying to think of another sport which has multiple organisations, each laying claim to World Records......but can't think of any.........Ian
My thoughts are that there would only be one set of "World Records". Which to set a record would require head to head competition at the same venue by representatives from multiple countries under the same rules, similar to how other sports hold World Championships.
While I see IBS and NBRSA have membership from other countries most of those members are mostly clubs with only one or two Benchrest organisations. This would make both the IBS and NBRSA records "International records" for each organisation.......but still not a "World Record" (my opinion only).
I have been trying to think of another sport which has multiple organisations, each laying claim to World Records......but can't think of any.........Ian
C
Cheechako
Guest
Baseball. SF Giants are the World Series Champs. Why is everyone so hung up on this? We all know that "World" doesn't mean the entire world.
JMHO
Ray
jackie schmidt
New member
Heck, I would settle for the "World Record of Tomball"............jackie
1,000 yard bechrest has three sanctioning bodies -- IBS, NBRSA, and The Original Pennsylania 1000 Yard Benchrest Club. IBS and Pennsylvania, anyway, have a sort of gentleman's agreement that claiming the "World Record" means your group/score is smaller/higher than any of the other organizations. So before Matt Kline (Pennsylvania) shot his HG group in the 2s, Joel Pendergraft's (IBS) 3.044 HG 10-shot group was the "World Record." Now it is the IBS record. (From their web site, the NBRSA HG record belongs to Dave Tooley [4.3220).]
So while we don't formally *recognize* each others records, we do *acknowledge* them. I will say that even in 1,000 yard benchrest, NBRSA members are prone to announcing a new NBRSA record as a "world record." IBS and Pennsylvania are a little more cautious.
Part of this, no doubt, is that on the East Coast, IBS and Pennsylvania people shoot at each others matches. You don't find so much interaction between IBS and NBRSA, though now that NBRSA has VFS, maybe we will.
* * *
As long as the rules and course of fire is pretty much the same, it would be a nice gesture for all the sanctioning bodies to claim records only for that body, unless it is in fact the smallest ever.
So while we don't formally *recognize* each others records, we do *acknowledge* them. I will say that even in 1,000 yard benchrest, NBRSA members are prone to announcing a new NBRSA record as a "world record." IBS and Pennsylvania are a little more cautious.
Part of this, no doubt, is that on the East Coast, IBS and Pennsylvania people shoot at each others matches. You don't find so much interaction between IBS and NBRSA, though now that NBRSA has VFS, maybe we will.
* * *
As long as the rules and course of fire is pretty much the same, it would be a nice gesture for all the sanctioning bodies to claim records only for that body, unless it is in fact the smallest ever.