Welding barrel to reciever?

B

bluechip

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I have a Savage 17 hmr that is so-so accurate. I removed the action from the stock and put the reciever in a bridgeport vise. I put a dial indicator on the barrel about 12" from the reciever. By grabbing the end of the barrel I can easily move the indicator .010" in either direction. The issue here is when pulling the barrel in either direction, the indicator fails to return to "0" by a couple of thou. Now. seeing that we are only talking about a $200 rifle anyway, and I've got over thirty years experience with a tig welder, what are your thoughts on running a pretty little bead around the barrel/reciever. The one problem I foresee is by running a bead aroung a tube (barrel) the contracting weld may tighten the O.D. of the barrel in the case/neck area a bit. Any horror stories on this one? BTW, the weld isn't as permanent as it may seem either, five minutes on a lathe would removed the weld.
 
Barrel and receiver

I had to look up a diagram of a Savage 17 HMR to see what you are talking about, but it looks like the barrel is pressed in and retained with a pin and then a stud is screwed in from the bottom of the receiver and that contacts the barrel tenon(?). I'm wondering if taking it apart and putting in a little J-B Weld in the joint and re-assembling it would firm things up. Just a thought. Of course make sure none of it it left inside the action. nhk
 
Sows ear and silk purses..

You can spend lots of time and money on a $200.00 rifle and you still have a $200.00 rifle.

There is an extreme difference in a model 52, 40X or Anshutz and the Savage, Ruger or other off the shelf factory rifle.

Nat Lambeth
 
Time and money

Rustystud said:
You can spend lots of time and money on a $200.00 rifle and you still have a $200.00 rifle.

There is an extreme difference in a model 52, 40X or Anshutz and the Savage, Ruger or other off the shelf factory rifle.

Nat Lambeth
Click to expand...

Right you are. Just that some of us have more time than money :) nhk
 
On Straight

Welding or JB will not promises to get the barrel on straight.

Sleeve it for a perfect fit.

Cutting the barrel and re-chamber before this operation would be even better.

This procedure was done for many 541's..

You could even sleeve the action and then thread the barrel.
 
welding

I just talked to my local gunsmith and he suggested a scope mount that fastens directly to the barrel only and extends back far enough the mount a scope in the usual position. It seems like a bad idea to mount a scope to a reciever in which the barrel may not be 100% solidly connected to. BTW, the issue here is not so much getting the barrel 'straight' with the reciever, but removing any possibility of the reciever/scope being a bit 'loose' with the barrel.
 
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Anything is certainly possible and if there was ever a test bed for experimenting, this community of folks is certainly prolly the most open minded.

That being said though you don't find many (any?) gents here grabbing a rod and a torch to go blazing away on the barrel/receiver ring.

Just consider that before flipping that face shield down over your eyes.
 
personally

i believe john's suggestion had it nailed, sleeve the barrel to a press fit. if that fails cut the barrel and rechamber and thread action and barrel to a snug fit. both seem a better alternative to welding or jb weld. my main concern with welding would revolve around washing the temper out of the barrel at the chamber area. i know we are just talking a 17 HMR but still, do like chad suggested think it thru well before lighting it up.
 
A friend was having some problems with accuracy with a 10-22 that had been fitted with an aftermarket barrel. (10-22s have a slip fit barrel with a clamp on one side.) Not too long before I had spoken with a gunsmith who fits match barrels in pressed and pinned receivers by gluing them in with epoxy. I suggested it to my friend. He was doubtful and then checked around, came around, and tried it. It solved his problem.
 
Bluechip.

I am sure that the hard core gunsmiths on the site will frown on this but I can tell you that Locktite 601-609 will get rid of the "wiggle".

Many an AR Match rifle is assembled by big names in the Service Rifle game with Green Locktite between the bbl extension and the upper receiver. There is no Wiggle between them once it sets up and you can always break the joint by applying heat to soften the Locktite.

It is a $200 rimfire and probably not worth an extra $100 - $200 worth of machine work (bbl sleeving etc.).

The fix is cheap and if it doesn't work, then you can begin to throw cash at the rifle.

Bob
 
Stabilizing the barrel

No one has mentioned this, so... I'm sure everyone will think I'm all wet, but (since it's a $200 rifle and this won't hurt anything) how about bedding the receiver and the first couple of inches of the barrel ahead of the receiver to 'splint' the barrel, maybe even glue it in?

I shoot a 'cheap(er)' .17 HMR and found that the 20 gr Game Point ammo shot more accurately than the 17 gr Ballistic Tips, which I would have perferred, and I can get doubles on prairie dogs. nhk
 
nhkuehl said:
No one has mentioned this, so... I'm sure everyone will think I'm all wet, but (since it's a $200 rifle and this won't hurt anything) how about bedding the receiver and the first couple of inches of the barrel ahead of the receiver to 'splint' the barrel, maybe even glue it in?

I shoot a 'cheap(er)' .17 HMR and found that the 20 gr Game Point ammo shot more accurately than the 17 gr Ballistic Tips, which I would have perferred, and I can get doubles on prairie dogs. nhk
Click to expand...

I have a Remington 541S that has the loose barrel tenon to action fit as described in the original post. When I discovered that I could feel the barrel move in relation to the action, I found this a bit disconcerting...despite the fact that the rifle shot very well.

So I thought about it, and decided I would bed an inch or two of the barrel to minimize this barrel movement. Surely it would be more accurate this way.

Wrong. It now groups like my Superposed.

Now I have to chip bedding out. Once I do that, I will probably leave it alone. If I get a wild hair, I will probably bore out the action a bit, and bush the tenon for a good tight fit. I probably should leave well enough alone, but what fun is that?

Justin
 
I'll tell a story.

I once had a JET lathe to work with for gunplumbing. It should have been turned into fish habitat at the bottom of a lake long before I worked for this particular shop, but its what we had so me did the best with what we had. The half nut was bronze and horribly worn. Backlash was terrible and replacement parts were nowhere to be found for this relic.

So I took a chance. I had no capacity to make a new one due to the thread pitch on the nut. I bead blasted the nut, packed grease on the screw, heated the nut and drizzled silver solder into it. Then I ran that screw through it a bunch of times while keeping the heat poured onto it. When I was done I had very, very little backlash on the cross slide and the lathe worked much better.

This was an extreme "fix" but I got lucky and was able to make it work.

I'm not saying this is the answer for your particular case but it's something I'd consider before welding or using loctite. the problem with a thread locker is that it's a sugar base chemical that forms a crystal. The shock, vibration, and heat from a barrel WILL break this crystal down over time, not enough to make the joint loose, but enough to make it move and shift. The forces at work as a bullet travels down a bore are quite high. It's hard enough to support the entire length well with barely and inch of thread-especially on a std 60 degree thread form.

Maybe take a look at possibly "tinning" your barrel tennon with a low temp solder. It's a bold move no doubt and I'd be sure to have at least a thread file handle handy. You might just surprise yourself though.

Regardless good luck.
 
Loctite make a product for fixing fit between cylindrical objects.. like bearing races in housings with heavy loads. It would solve your poor fit easily.

I have fitted custom rim fire barrels to a slip fit in 77-22's and used this instead of the Ruger barrel clamp and have had excellent success with accuracy.
 
Bronzing up threads..

Chad:

Your idea has been around many years and works well. It is mentioned in many machining books and articles. I have seen threads completely filled and the threads recut from scratch.

I have seen this done with threads that were tig welded up and recut also.

The later may not be an option for barrel tenons.

Nat Lambeth
 
Bedding a Savage .17 HMR

nhkuehl said:
No one has mentioned this, so... I'm sure everyone will think I'm all wet, but (since it's a $200 rifle and this won't hurt anything) how about bedding the receiver and the first couple of inches of the barrel ahead of the receiver to 'splint' the barrel, maybe even glue it in?

I shoot a 'cheap(er)' .17 HMR and found that the 20 gr Game Point ammo shot more accurately than the 17 gr Ballistic Tips, which I would have perferred, and I can get doubles on prairie dogs. nhk
Click to expand...

I have a heavy barrel Savage .17 HMR that is extremely accurate. I bedded the action and the chamber area of the barrel. Try this before you weld.

Lou Baccino
 
I would not be surpeised to see the weld crack. But WTH, it's a $200 rifle.

I'd try the loctite and bedding first.

Ben
 
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