Thoughts on Benchrest Competition
- Thread starter James M.
- Start date
Dave Tubb Isn't going to show up at any Benchrest Match anymore than I would at one of his matches! There's just so much time and money you can spend on a sport, I'm a 1000 yard shooter and there is just so much time. I do make 10 Matches, reload and I made the World Open and an IBS National Match this year. I love meeting new people. I don't think I can win every match, but once in a while I do get lucky. I got a buddy of mine sucked in this year. I told him to save all his recites for everything he buys, haven't got the grand total yet but I know its over $10.000. He has never been Married and Hunts all the time in different states he told me he had to slow down so he would have money for hunting. I know I've missed Weddings, Birthdays and I know other thing just to go shoot. But I just tell people this is my thing so I'm Sorry. I'm going to be 70 this May I've been doing this since I was 26 so am I getting burned out! Getting close.
Joe Salt
Joe Salt
This has been an interesting read - for a UK benchrest shooter!
Of course, here in the UK, benchrest has only exisisted for about 25 years and we greatly envy the American scene. Nonetheless, Brits have attended every World Championship to date.
We have around 30 shooters and typically about 20 - 25 will turn up at our matches.
Costs? We pay $500 for a barrel blank and $375 to have it chambered. Custom bullets are $45 per 100 - when we can get 'em! A kilo of Vit 133 is $100.
In the UK, we also shoot 600 and 1000 yard benchrest and long range benchrest is a bit more popular than short range for some reason.
This is the question I ask myself:
F Class was 'invented' about 15 years ago (our first proper match in the UK was 2005) but F Class continues to attract more shooters whereas benchrest struggles. Cost of equipment is very similar so, why does F Class appeal more than benchrest? Why do shooters prefer to lie on wet grass rather than sit under cover?
I think Jackie Schmidt's post talks a lot of sense.
Vince (UK)
Of course, here in the UK, benchrest has only exisisted for about 25 years and we greatly envy the American scene. Nonetheless, Brits have attended every World Championship to date.
We have around 30 shooters and typically about 20 - 25 will turn up at our matches.
Costs? We pay $500 for a barrel blank and $375 to have it chambered. Custom bullets are $45 per 100 - when we can get 'em! A kilo of Vit 133 is $100.
In the UK, we also shoot 600 and 1000 yard benchrest and long range benchrest is a bit more popular than short range for some reason.
This is the question I ask myself:
F Class was 'invented' about 15 years ago (our first proper match in the UK was 2005) but F Class continues to attract more shooters whereas benchrest struggles. Cost of equipment is very similar so, why does F Class appeal more than benchrest? Why do shooters prefer to lie on wet grass rather than sit under cover?
I think Jackie Schmidt's post talks a lot of sense.
Vince (UK)
Vince
600 yard shooting (F Class and IBS Benchrest) is growing over here by leaps and bounds. The short answer is "it's easier to compete." For the shooters it's, Bring your a mat, rest, rear bag, rifle and preloaded ammo, and you're ready to shoot. Most F Class matches are one day events. No bringing a trailer of reloading equipment to the range. Youre not getting there three days early to practice. You're not setting up wind flags! You're not chasing a tune like we do with the PPC. Show up and shoot! It's much more simplistic then shooting a short range match.
I was at an F Class match and a new guy was checking it out. Someone said, "You should try short range Benchrest." He said, "Oh Hell no! I saw those guys last week! All the reloading and cleaning! Those guys are crazy!" The man has a point!
Bart
600 yard shooting (F Class and IBS Benchrest) is growing over here by leaps and bounds. The short answer is "it's easier to compete." For the shooters it's, Bring your a mat, rest, rear bag, rifle and preloaded ammo, and you're ready to shoot. Most F Class matches are one day events. No bringing a trailer of reloading equipment to the range. Youre not getting there three days early to practice. You're not setting up wind flags! You're not chasing a tune like we do with the PPC. Show up and shoot! It's much more simplistic then shooting a short range match.
I was at an F Class match and a new guy was checking it out. Someone said, "You should try short range Benchrest." He said, "Oh Hell no! I saw those guys last week! All the reloading and cleaning! Those guys are crazy!" The man has a point!
Bart
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jackie schmidt
New member
It's reality, Vince. Many people live in a shell and never take a look outside to see what is happening around them.
It amazes me how you shooters in the UK can even shoot Benchrest. From what I understand, compared to the freedoms we enjoy in most of the USA when it comes to Firearms, the UK is darned near draconian.
I think nothing of tossing my Rifles and equipment in my truck, heading over to Tomball, and shooting all day. I may even toss in a handgun in the console to shoot to shoot as well. From what I have read, that is not an option for you.
How do you manage in a Country with the types of restrictions on Firearms as The UK? Or, am I wrong about just how restrictive things are?
JerrySharrett
Senile Member
Bart, from what I hear 600 IBS at Piedmont has grown to the point they now shoot till almost dark to finish. I have not made any o the regular shoots this year except the January fun shoot but they had a good turnout for that. Unfortunately the other one-day trip for me was Oak Ridge and they are not shooting 600 IBS there this year. But I think they are shooting F-class/NRA.
Interesting happening, to me, one year I drove to St Louis for the 600 IBS Nationals. I was the only motorhome/travel trailer there!! Several popup tents and a few loading trailers but none of the rigs we travel in to carry our stuff. I have a picture of my camper setting where Tony used to park. No one on the hill, no one behind the berm at bench 1.
These shooters fall into a group I call "nonrons". They do not remain over night. Much more affordable in money and family time!
Still, the bigger "tax" on our centerfire Group 100/200 is equipment, for the shooters and also the hosting club. Just moving the backer rig is a chore not including setting them up and storing the pile of mechanisms.
Jackie, I'm like you, I wouldn't live in England on a bet. I am old enough to remember when we pulled their asses out of the fire in WW 2 by having gun collection drives here to accumulate guns to send over there to the homefolks to arm their selves. BTW, Germany did not disarm the Germans!! And, the Aussies have caved!!
Speaking of which, this next election, here, we need to carefully elect someone who is not a gun grabber. Trump?? Don't know but I do know from the Kelblys that they have built The Donald's sons some rifles and that he packs. We know what Hillary and Bernies policy is and just found out Chris Cristie is a gun grabber. Oh, well!!
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Interesting happening, to me, one year I drove to St Louis for the 600 IBS Nationals. I was the only motorhome/travel trailer there!! Several popup tents and a few loading trailers but none of the rigs we travel in to carry our stuff. I have a picture of my camper setting where Tony used to park. No one on the hill, no one behind the berm at bench 1.
These shooters fall into a group I call "nonrons". They do not remain over night. Much more affordable in money and family time!
Still, the bigger "tax" on our centerfire Group 100/200 is equipment, for the shooters and also the hosting club. Just moving the backer rig is a chore not including setting them up and storing the pile of mechanisms.
Jackie, I'm like you, I wouldn't live in England on a bet. I am old enough to remember when we pulled their asses out of the fire in WW 2 by having gun collection drives here to accumulate guns to send over there to the homefolks to arm their selves. BTW, Germany did not disarm the Germans!! And, the Aussies have caved!!
Speaking of which, this next election, here, we need to carefully elect someone who is not a gun grabber. Trump?? Don't know but I do know from the Kelblys that they have built The Donald's sons some rifles and that he packs. We know what Hillary and Bernies policy is and just found out Chris Cristie is a gun grabber. Oh, well!!
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Coots/Fesi
Coots - "are you on a witness protection program?" that's funny!
Fesi is doing a great job. I hear the last match had 40+ shooters. (sorry I could n't make it Joe!) That is what it was when I started 5 or so years ago. What I see Joe doing is bringing enthusiasm and a little simple "marketing". No rule changes. Phone calls and emails to get ppls attention. The Friday "fun shoot" seems to also get peoples attention more than I would have thought. Fun and a little $$$.
Also don't under estimate his steaks. Where not talking burned up chopped beef. Quality cuts well prepared. Great job Joe!
Coots - "are you on a witness protection program?" that's funny!
Fesi is doing a great job. I hear the last match had 40+ shooters. (sorry I could n't make it Joe!) That is what it was when I started 5 or so years ago. What I see Joe doing is bringing enthusiasm and a little simple "marketing". No rule changes. Phone calls and emails to get ppls attention. The Friday "fun shoot" seems to also get peoples attention more than I would have thought. Fun and a little $$$.
Also don't under estimate his steaks. Where not talking burned up chopped beef. Quality cuts well prepared. Great job Joe!
Dusty Stevens
Hollow Point Dispenser
Clubs all across the country could take lessons from joe and scott. But- they have the manpower as well. I know harry ward stayed in his camper for over a month to help with rimfire then centerfire nats and world comp all back to back. Great help and thoughtful marketing makes the difference.
jackie schmidt
New member
Dusty, that is our single biggest problem at Tomball. Through the years, somebody has always stepped up, but after a couple of years, bow out.
We have a great club, limited to 300 members. But out of that 300, only about 8 or 9 shoot Score and Group Matches. Maybe another 10 shoot Score, and that's about it. The other 280 members really don't care. As long as our Matches do not cost the club any money, (i.e., pay for themselves), they give us our dates and leave us alone.
We are lucky right now to have the Pullum Brothers, Dwayne and Richard, as our Registered Match Directors. They run one Two Gun Group Match and one two day VFS Registered Match. They have done an excellent job the last few years.
I take care of the five Club Matches, but the work involved in putting those on is minuscule when compared to the Registered Matches. I order the Ribbons and Targets, make sure the gates are open, and keep an eye on things. Shooters hang their own targets at 100 yards, for our two 200 yard Club Matches, I give a young man $100 to help me in that morning. He is there from 8:am till Noon, that's $20 an hour. Not bad.
The big difference is the Club barely breaks even on the Registered Matches, by the time you get the trophy s, targets, pay the target crew, and a few other things, you barely break even with 30 shooters, even when they are paying the NBRSA rate.
For our Club Matches, I charge $15. They get a warm up, and five record matches. The awards are a really nice triple stream ribbon that only cost about $3 a piece when I buy the 45 Blue, Red, and White for the five Matches of the season. I use up about 1000 targets for the five Matches, depending on attendance. So when it is all said and done, the club can make about $1200 profit for our efforts.
When I first started shooting Benchrest, Tomball had two big Registered Matches. Hank Faulkner was the ramrod. The Spring Match was called "The Hole Enchilada", and he catered in Mexican food on Saturday Evening. Hank suddenly died of a heart attack around 1999, and the match died with him. I can remember them having 3 complete relays on a 25 Bench Range.
If it was not for Mike Stinnet at Denton, there would be no matches there, period. That is a huge club, and he is it.
Mike Guilliot is doing a great job of running the VFS Matches in Lake Charles. They are NBRSA Registerd, and he is having a pretty good turnout. That is where I will be doing most of my Shooting next year. I like going over, shooting a Grand Agg for Score, and coming home, all in one day.
Mike Conry does a great job out at Midland, that is a huge club, but you can just about count the number of Benchrest Shooters on two hands.
We will be shooting Unlimited at Seymour as long as Scott Hunter, Jonn Horn and their crew keep going. That is a dedicated bunch, and they put on a great Match. If you can't have a good time at Seymour, you can't have a good time anywhere.
I have not been to New Braunfels in several years. Kris Whitman still runs it, but since Howard Dietz passed away, I'm not real sure of the future of that range. That is some awful expensive real estate up north west of New Braunfels.
Anyway, that is the status of The GulfCoast Region.
We have a great club, limited to 300 members. But out of that 300, only about 8 or 9 shoot Score and Group Matches. Maybe another 10 shoot Score, and that's about it. The other 280 members really don't care. As long as our Matches do not cost the club any money, (i.e., pay for themselves), they give us our dates and leave us alone.
We are lucky right now to have the Pullum Brothers, Dwayne and Richard, as our Registered Match Directors. They run one Two Gun Group Match and one two day VFS Registered Match. They have done an excellent job the last few years.
I take care of the five Club Matches, but the work involved in putting those on is minuscule when compared to the Registered Matches. I order the Ribbons and Targets, make sure the gates are open, and keep an eye on things. Shooters hang their own targets at 100 yards, for our two 200 yard Club Matches, I give a young man $100 to help me in that morning. He is there from 8:am till Noon, that's $20 an hour. Not bad.
The big difference is the Club barely breaks even on the Registered Matches, by the time you get the trophy s, targets, pay the target crew, and a few other things, you barely break even with 30 shooters, even when they are paying the NBRSA rate.
For our Club Matches, I charge $15. They get a warm up, and five record matches. The awards are a really nice triple stream ribbon that only cost about $3 a piece when I buy the 45 Blue, Red, and White for the five Matches of the season. I use up about 1000 targets for the five Matches, depending on attendance. So when it is all said and done, the club can make about $1200 profit for our efforts.
When I first started shooting Benchrest, Tomball had two big Registered Matches. Hank Faulkner was the ramrod. The Spring Match was called "The Hole Enchilada", and he catered in Mexican food on Saturday Evening. Hank suddenly died of a heart attack around 1999, and the match died with him. I can remember them having 3 complete relays on a 25 Bench Range.
If it was not for Mike Stinnet at Denton, there would be no matches there, period. That is a huge club, and he is it.
Mike Guilliot is doing a great job of running the VFS Matches in Lake Charles. They are NBRSA Registerd, and he is having a pretty good turnout. That is where I will be doing most of my Shooting next year. I like going over, shooting a Grand Agg for Score, and coming home, all in one day.
Mike Conry does a great job out at Midland, that is a huge club, but you can just about count the number of Benchrest Shooters on two hands.
We will be shooting Unlimited at Seymour as long as Scott Hunter, Jonn Horn and their crew keep going. That is a dedicated bunch, and they put on a great Match. If you can't have a good time at Seymour, you can't have a good time anywhere.
I have not been to New Braunfels in several years. Kris Whitman still runs it, but since Howard Dietz passed away, I'm not real sure of the future of that range. That is some awful expensive real estate up north west of New Braunfels.
Anyway, that is the status of The GulfCoast Region.
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Dusty Stevens
Hollow Point Dispenser
Sad state of affairs in the 2 regions i prefer to shoot in- gulf coast and SE.
Dusty Stevens
Hollow Point Dispenser
Both of trumps sons- eric and donald are huge gun owners. They buy lots of guns every year from lots of builders. Trump and Cruz are the 2 gun friendly candidates.
J
Jammer Six
Guest
What do you suppose happens if someone gets on the internet and searches for "benchrest"?
jackie schmidt
New member
I just went to Google and type in "Benchrest"
This Site, Benchrest Central, is the first thing to come up.
J
Jammer Six
Guest
Can you draw any conclusions from that?
jackie schmidt
New member
That this Site is a good place to discuss Benchrest??
Discuss, yes. But, to learn how it is actually done can best be achieved at a Match.
Can YOU draw any conclusions from your last two questions? If so, would YOU be so kind as to share them with the board in an unambiguous manner.?
I'm confused about what answer you're looking for.
Glenn
R.Morehouse
New member
Conclusion...Don't know......Result.....Got me ( new guy ) out of the gate with some very informative PM's from members and advise on how to get involved by attending matches and where to go about finding them in my local area. An invite for next season to meet at some of those matches and help me out with "bench manners" ect. .......The search result worked out OK for me........Rick
J
Jammer Six
Guest
Some of you are concerned with attendance.
This group is the frequently the first group one would encounter when considering benchrest.
This group is the frequently the first group one would encounter when considering benchrest.
WHEN you attend a BENCHREST match you will find out that this Group WILL give you the shirt or Jacket from their back.
J
Jammer Six
Guest
If you say so.
You're discussing improving attendance, and ignoring a solution that is simple, free and world wide.
The conduct here is reinforced by the choice to ignore such a simple solution. I'm not surprised you're having trouble with attendance. Assuming you're telling the truth, your actions do not match your words.
I don't care. There's all kinds of matches here, it will never make any difference to me.
You're discussing improving attendance, and ignoring a solution that is simple, free and world wide.
The conduct here is reinforced by the choice to ignore such a simple solution. I'm not surprised you're having trouble with attendance. Assuming you're telling the truth, your actions do not match your words.
I don't care. There's all kinds of matches here, it will never make any difference to me.
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