cutting oils. Sulfur chlorine. ??????

skeetlee

Active member
Can you fellas explain to me why some cutting oils contain sulfur and chlorine and some do not. Some guys claim oils with sulfur are the best, Some guys don't want any chlorine. What roll does sulfur and chlorine play in cutting oils?
I need to find an oil for this flush system, and I really have no idea what route to take. Any recommendations? Thanks Lee
 
Both are extreme pressure lubricant additives (EP). Both have good properties for being in a cutting oil.
Sulfur is considered a health hazard and an air pollutant.
Chlorine is suspected to cause micro-cracking in parts during machining leading to stress fractures and part failure. Chlorine can be considered a hazardous material and waste containing it can be regulated.
 
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Chlorine is suspected to cause micro-cracking in parts during machining leading to stress fractures and part failure. Chlorine can be considered a hazardous material and waste containing it can be regulated.

This is interesting to hear. I posted comments on the use of RapidTap (original) as a cutting oil. Web check says the original contained trichlor-something, which is not present in the "new" formulation. We were not using it on highly stressed parts, a good thing, in view of possible micro-crackng. It sure gave a good finish, though; I'd like to have a couple of cans...
 
Dusty
I might have to use a water base lubricant. I just don't know yet really.
While trying to learn of the different options available these are just a couple questions I didn't know the answers to.
seems to me every different manufacturer states a different claim as to why there oil is the best. Some contain chlorine, some sulfer. Some contain neither. How do you make a solid choice when you don't know squat about any of them? Lee
 
Dusty
I might have to use a water base lubricant. I just don't know yet really.
While trying to learn of the different options available these are just a couple questions I didn't know the answers to.
seems to me every different manufacturer states a different claim as to why there oil is the best. Some contain chlorine, some sulfer. Some contain neither. How do you make a solid choice when you don't know squat about any of them? Lee

experience or trial and error also coolant is considered a hazardous mat. when you have to get rid of it, in other words don't dump in the woods or sink unless you want a visit from the e.p.a. I'm sure some of you remember Ron Pence ask him...
 
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If you don't use a good sulfur cutting oil, you won't get that great smoke and smell! It's kinda like the old Hoppes9 in a gun cabinet.
 
I made my own lard and mixed with elemental sulphur, I think it worked Ok, but every time I chambered a barrel it smelled like breakfast
 
This is interesting to hear. I posted comments on the use of RapidTap (original) as a cutting oil. Web check says the original contained trichlor-something, which is not present in the "new" formulation. We were not using it on highly stressed parts, a good thing, in view of possible micro-crackng. It sure gave a good finish, though; I'd like to have a couple of cans...

1,1,1 trichloroethane. A chlorinated solvent. Banned because it depleted ozone. You can still find some of the old cutting oils now and then with 1,1,1 trichloroethane on ebay.
 
RapidTap was also the best for its intended use... nice for those 6-48's. We used some kind of trichlor for washing off spotting compound! VERY bad!
F1
 
I can't see where they even make 255r anymore. I am thinking either Ultracut or power chip 2000 by rustlick.
 
If you don't use a good sulfur cutting oil, you won't get that great smoke and smell! It's kinda like the old Hoppes9 in a gun cabinet.

That takes me back to the first machine shop I worked in and some thoughts for skeetlee,

We used sulfur based cutting oils for lots of our work but we also had a big bucket of sulfur additive we could add some with. It was a big ol'bucket like you might see in a cowboy movie hanging off a wagon for greasing the axles. It was about the same consistency anyway. Big stick in it and everything.

I ask my boss why it worked. He said he thought it was such a reactive element that it clung to some materials like steel and made it easier for the cutter to get a grip to cut, OR it clung and made the chips slide easier. Anyway it seemed to help on steel. (Like barrel steel.)

It will make brass and copper tarnish if it gets on them. For that we used either something we called "Red" oil or Hangsterfer's.

http://www.hangsterfers.com/products/cutting-oils/

Hangsterfer's is a chlorine based oil. It was some of the best working and smelling of all the cutting oils. I suppose chlorine is very reactive and clings like the sulfur. ? Hangsterfer's is also a good all around cutting oil. Running it could save you cleaning out a machine to change coolants when you wanted to run different materials.

Another coolant I've used over the years that stood out was a water soluble coolant. It was made by Blaser. Maybe Blasocut. Water soluble coolant is very thin and pumps easy. The water is very good at cooling things. Blaser made the best water soluble oil I've tried but it falls short for some machining situations.

http://www.blaser.com/index.cfm?type=land&navid=48&subid=450&land=us

Keep in mind I've mostly been working in Swiss Screw machine job shops. Not as a Gunsmith.

I think a person getting familiar with machining would need a good selection of coolants and cutting oils. All the types seem to have their place.

One thing you don't want to try is using lube oil as cutting oil. When I was starting out in machine shops I was drilling a hole on a manual machine. I ran out of my little tin of coolant and spotted an oil can within reach. I squirted some of it in my drilled hole and went back to drilling and burned up my drill like right now. It turns out that the oil molecules they use in cutting oil and in lube oil are way different.

Which makes me drift off and remember that was one of the nice things about running a machine with water soluble. You could skim off some of the old lube oil that would end up in it.
 
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I'm not on these forums enough to know who's still around but there was a fellar called "Rusty Stud" that used a lubricunt in his flushing system that he claimed was very good stuff. He had reamers that had chambered thousands of barrels with no noticeable wear. I cannot remember the name of that lubricunt. Dave Tooley knows I asked him about it a few years ago when I was looking to try something other than mobile met and he referred me to ole Rusty Stud. (I'm remembering more as I'm typing.) He was still using it when I looked him up several years ago. A good fellar too. Not one of those that you ask about a product then they tell you how much they know about chambering barrels so they can go around claiming they taught you. Lol!
You should check into it Lee, since you are just getting started in this.:cool:
 
I'm not on these forums enough to know who's still around but there was a fellar called "Rusty Stud" that used a lubricunt in his flushing system that he claimed was very good stuff. He had reamers that had chambered thousands of barrels with no noticeable wear. I cannot remember the name of that lubricunt. Dave Tooley knows I asked him about it a few years ago when I was looking to try something other than mobile met and he referred me to ole Rusty Stud. (I'm remembering more as I'm typing.) He was still using it when I looked him up several years ago. A good fellar too. Not one of those that you ask about a product then they tell you how much they know about chambering barrels so they can go around claiming they taught you. Lol!
You should check into it Lee, since you are just getting started in this.:cool:

Jay,

"Rustystud" is Nathaniel Lambert. He used Rustlick 255R (discontinued) if I remember correctly. He's still around. He posted on the Accurate Shooter forum a couple of days ago. I'm sure he'll be around here soon...

Spell check on "lubricant"...

Justin
 
I had red lines under lubricant every time I miss spelled it. Sometimes I spell it like it sounds and the past couple days I've been in one of those states of mind to just let it go.
Must be something on my mind.
 
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