To Anneal or Not

[Tony C]

I'm sizing some 30 caliber Lapua down to 6mm and pushing the shoulder back a little. Should I anneal? My gut says yes. I'm going to assume the necks might be more likely to split if not annealed???

Also, is it better to size down in steps or in a single pass?

 

[alinwa]

OK, this is from my limited experience.

IME you can generally squeeze DOWN as much as three "caliber steps" (ie from say 30 to .257) in a single pass using NEW brass.

IME doing anything up or down using fired brass requires annealing.

IME going more than three calber steps requires you anneal for the next pass.

IME split necks normally are the result uf necking UP. Necking down results in collapse and wrinkles, not splits.

IME brass work-hardens when you move it. You move it ONCE for the big moves, say from 30 down to .257. The second move down to 6mm will require annealing.

IME an STP or cam break-in lube lube or even 90wt gear oil is effective lubricant for large moves......trick is to look for a lube that's so tenacious that when you dip your finger in it you can make a "strings." Some of the other exotic lubes like "Power Plus" and such fall into this category. Sticky, messy stinky. Can't wipe it off .......... wear gloves type of messy.

IME sizing down in steps like one half of the neck at a time offers some real advantages for necking down without diddling all off sidewards. A real caseforming set has all sorts of sizes of bushings to be swapped and switched. You switch them out as you size and each SECOND move you anneal....

Clear as mud??

Dunno as I've helped but I tried!

al

 

[Tony C]

I would love to find a used case forming set! They look really nice.

I can take these down without the wrinkles you described. I know annealing is simple in a way, but it seems like alchemy to me. Heat too long... Heat too little... And I would be using a hand held propane torch. I suppose my biggest concern is getting consistency from case to case.

 

[Rflshootr]

I have necked down 308 LC brass to 243 before. I happen to have a 7-08 & a 260 FL dies. I just ran the through all 4 dies, fire formed & then annealed. Never had a problem or a wrinkle.

 

[Cheechako]

I don't anneal. Never have. Never will. I've yet to see any evidence that annealing is necessary when case forming, especially for easy jobs like going from .30 to 6mm.

PM or email Butch Lambert to see if he has any sets of the case forming dies.

Ray

 

[pmcallan]

FYI..... There is a company call Tempilaq (www.tempil.com) that sell temperature indicating liquids for commerical purposes. Paint a drop on each case. When the exact temperature is reached remove heat. Works every time. Hope this is helpful....

 

[Vern]

I have necked down 308 LC brass to 243 before. I happen to have a 7-08 & a 260 FL dies. I just ran the through all 4 dies, fire formed & then annealed. Never had a problem or a wrinkle.

Just out of curiosity why would you form .243 when you can buy such good brass these days? I am at a loss, educate me please.

 

[Rflshootr]

Vern, simply because I had 1200 pieces of once fired LC Match brass and it was for a factory deer hunting rifle. Not only that, I don't cringe as much if a few of them get lost in the woods. I'm just not in the mindset of Lapua Lapua Lapua for every rifle I own where the dollars aren't worth the small gain in accuracy where it really isn't necessary. And besides that, the LC brass was free.

 

[Tony C]

I am seeing some dents in the shoulder. I hope they expand out to chamber dimensions when fired. Will keep a close eye on them.

For those who anneal, do you anneal before pushing the shoulder back or after???

 

[Greyfox]

Tony,
I am a confirmed annealer and do my 30BR brass about every 6-7 firings. I use a Ken Light machine. I have quite a few wildcats that require necking up or down as well as some other issues. In most all cases I've had the best results doing all the sizing and annealing before the first firing. I rarely lose any cases due to splits and most wrinklrs and dents do disappear when fired.

The most radical incident I had was forming a 284 AI Short for a Contender. This case is made from a 444 Marlin necked down to 284 and shortened. It took several dies and changes and I had a brain cramp and pushed the should back a looong way on one pass. I fired a few without annealing (this was before the Ken Light) and split them all. Figuring I had nothing to lose, I annealed all the rest. They all formed perfectly pushing the shoulder forwar nearly 1/4". BTW- I don't recommend this experiment.

I suggest you do all the forming and then anneal before firing. Come to think of it, I have about 200 30BR cases that I reformed back to 6mm. So far, I haven't lost any, but to be fair, I have only fired a few.

Rick