Question about a FFL

L

Lew

New member
If a Licensed Gunsmith has a Dealers License to ply his craft. Why is a BAFTE asking him to get a manufactures licence. He takes parts that have alreardy been serialed numbered all his is doing is putting the parts together to a seriled numbered action. Is this the way of the future of the way the agent reads the rules. Thanks in advance
 
If he builds more than 49 from unbarreled actions he is going to have to pay a manf. tax thus the BATF may want him to get the Manf. lic. I was questioned by the visiting agent about my numbers and told him I would not be doing over 49 a year. He made a phone call and all was good on dealers Lic.
 
Also what if you purchase over 50 (in a year) remington 700 complete rifles, disassemble, true , restock and re-barrel....would that be exempt from the manf tax?
 
i believe, that once the ffl/serialized action is assembled to a complete rifle, then you have a taxable/manufactured rifle. the 49/50 built actions is seperate.


yes ?

mike in co
 
The ATF told me...

I asked much the same at a seminar with sevaral agents and one of the attorneys present and it boiled down to this: If you assemble from already numbered and tranfered parts, then sell that firearm, it's considered manufacturing. Example: Buy an action and tranfer to your shop. Build a custom and sell and transfer to customer.... manufacturing. If you take a firearm and say for example change the grips and the sights then sell / transfer... manufacturing. So I asked, If I sell a action to customer make the transfer, and he or she then has me build a custom for them is that ok? The answer was yes. I think I have seen before some smiths advertise that way, that is "Custom work on your action"

I'm sure someone else has gone thru this before and would be interested what they were told. I am just getting started in the business and want to do things the right way, but have heard many different things from several FFLs.

Dale
 
49 actions..

is no small amount.

By number 49 you'd probably have a good idea that you want to make more..

Avoiding trouble before it arrives seems sensible.

:eek:
 
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Gunsmith vs Manufacture

The BATFE was split after 911. The ATFE went from being under Treasury to being under the Department of Justice. The tax part now the TTB is still under Treasury. Tought they share information they are somewhat disjointed. I have a manufacturing license and a Gunsmith/Dealers license. When I went through my last inspection, I was asked by the ATFE inspector how many rifles I had made from scratch matching a action to a barrel and stock. She was not aware of the 50 gun limit/exemption for gunsmiths. I made her a photocopy of the October letter from the TTB. I have been told by several BATFE inspectors and Agents that anytime one significantly improves the function or value of a firearm he or she is manufacturing. I was advised to add a manufacturing license type 07 to my existing type 01 dealers license. The manufacturing license is only $30.00 if I remember correctly. If the gun is brought to the gunsmith for improvement and not bought by the gunsmith and sold to the the owner, then the owner is considered to be the manufacture. Get your new Federal Firearms book (2007 edition) the latest, out and look it up
Rustystud
 
Just got off phone with local agent for ATFa regular FFl is $200 and $90 per three years for renewal, a class 7 FFL to Manufacture firearms & ammo is $150 then $150 per three years to renew, you don't need both just one,, so$300 vs $290, pertty easy to spend $10 more every three years for less BS.
Ya'll might want to start calling the ATF and try to stay in good grace's instead of sitting around getting "info & regulations" from another website then having your butt in a sling @ inspection time
 
But what about the tax part??? If I get a class 7, and take a $400 action, $200 stock, and $200 barrel, and sell this for $1200 as a custom rifle, what tax do I pay? :confused: Also, what is the penalty, if they decide that I manufactured a rifle that I got at a yard sale for $200, reblued it and sold it as a private individual to somebody for $600?? With NO license.
 
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XSheadspace...

Don't worry about the Tax you will be living in Federal housing with a poor view of the rest of the world. And the only people with guns will be protecting your gated community.
Rustystud
 
if a FFl buys actions and then installs barrels or stocks or stocks and barrels on them --they are manufacturing per my recent inspection. Manufactures-no matter how many they make require an 07 license.
Also, once you have the 07 license--check the ITAR -you must also be registered with the State Department as a manufacturer--$1750 per year.

I know some 07 licensees that have not been registered with the State Department and they recently got called and told they need to register as a manufacturer with the State Department as well.

Just thought I would pass along for those that are interested.
Best advice--do not fight it--get teh right license(s) and do things right.
 
ITAR, another GOVCO rip off. I dropped my registration because it went from $600 a year to $1750. And I thought that was only needed if you were going to export firearms. Another fine example of how our government treats small business.

The way I was told. The customer is responsible for the tax. Once I get to 50 rifles built I'm responsible for collecting the tax. I have never heard of them tracking down an owner and collecting the tax.

Dave
 
dave you might be in for a surprise

some j4 customers have been contacted recently.

enough said

jeff
 
Dave

need to be registered whether you export or not and the 07 has nothing to do with excise tax.

once you reach the 50th rifle you owe the tax on the first 50 rifles.....if you did not collect it, then it comes out of your pocket.

not only that--but did you know the tax applies to state sales tax as well if you sold within state? That's right --you have to collect the 11% tax on the sales tax.

Jim
 
Well one way or another I'll never hit 50. If I get close at the end of the year I'll just stop and go hunting. Wonder if that will pass muster with my wife?Guess I'll be waiting for a phone call from GOVCO.

Dave
 
Dave, never do anything to make the phone ring

Dave Tooley said:
Well one way or another I'll never hit 50. If I get close at the end of the year I'll just stop and go hunting. Wonder if that will pass muster with my wife?Guess I'll be waiting for a phone call from GOVCO.

Dave
Click to expand...
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Shoot better
Peter
 
Something is really out of whack here---how can rebluing, or restocking a gun be classified as manufacturing?? I can see if some gunsmith is doing the 50+ guns a year from parts, that is manufacturing. But fixing up?? That's called Gunsmithing. And a private citizen is allowed to sell a few guns a year, as long as it is not a significant business.
 
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