New Hawkeye borescope , new

J

Jimm

Guest
problems !!

After acquiring a Hawkeye at the shot show I hurried home to see how " good " a cleaning job I had been doing . I use the word " good " because I was sure I was .

I wasnt !! Oh yeah the last 18" or so of the bbl was pretty as a picture . But the portion about 2 " forward of the throat and for the next 10 " had carbon streaks galore . Copper was not evident , just carbon .

That particular bbl belonged to a 243 AI that has around 800 rounds through it . So , i checked another 243 AI that only has around 200 rounds down . Not as bad as the other but the area affected was about the same place in the bore . Moving on to a 300 WM with 800 and a bit rounds fired according to my records , I find the pattern is repeating .

Enter a friend that has a new custom bbled 308 ( BTW all my bbls are by custom mfgs , Broughton , Schnieder , Krieger ) . He wants a peak down his bore that only has a couple of hundreds through it . At the same time we are gathering to do this looksee he was watching me clean and remarked how I was making him feel guilty with the cleaning regimen I was using compared to his " spray this foam in it , walk away then patch it out an hour later " routine .

Only two hundreds down range but his bbl is exhibiting the same general pattern of fouling as mine .

Okay , my cleaning routine :

1. wet patch twice with Butches Bore Shine using a jag
then wait 2 to 3 min .
2. wet brush ( Iosso blue , very stiff ) full length , 20 to 25, wait 2 to 3 min .

3. H50BMG , same routine

4. Back to first step , repeat

5. repeat #1 through #3 until patches clean

6. wet patch Kroil twice wait one min . , dry patch Kroil

out then one wet patch Kroil

Voila !! clean bbl ! yes ?...............evidently not .

I am now wondering where to go to next in an attempt to keep my bbls clean . I have JB bore Brite ultrafine , bronze brushes etc . I used the JB on a patch wrapped around a bronze brush short stroking in this area of fouling and it took the better part of an hour of diligent work to see the bore bright . .

Even so , the 90 degree ? junction of the groove and the rise to the land seems to harbor some fouling .

Could there not be some device such as a bore cast of some softer metal impregnated with a lapping compound , very fine , be employed to solve this , to me , problem ?

Many thanks to those that hung on here to the bitter end .:eek:

Jim Brown
 
Hawkeye borescope

jimm: yes, aren't they great? I've had mine for 2 years, don't know how I did without it, It's already paid for itself. I also saw a build-up of carbon in my barrels, used the standard JB on a patch wrapped around a worn brush. Most of it came out, but since the carbon discovery, I've given up on ball powder ( 748, H335), since they seemed to be the biggest producer of carbon. Fired case necks are also a lot cleaner, and what dirt there is comes off with 1 hour in the tumbler. H322, Varget, and VitaVouri remain my powders of choice now.
 
Jim, you might try some Slip 2000 and a brush on the carbon,Ive had pretty good luck with it.
 
Here is a procedure that I use that seems to keep the barrel clean w/out any carbon or copper build up. I have had numerous barrels checked by gunsmith to confirm this in several different calibers.

First I keep running wet patches of Butches BoreShine until they come out with out any black on them. Usually between 5 to 10.

Next, 2 dry patches

Next, I wrap a patch around a nylon brush, smear it with USB Paste and take it forward and back a dozen times or so.

Next, 2 dry patches

Next, several wet patches of Butches BoreShine to clean out the paste

Next, 2 dry patches.

Finish w/ a patch w/ a bit of oil

This leaves the barrel "mostly clean". Do it twice and the barrel is "very clean". Do it a third time w/ Flitz Metal Polish and the barrel will shine.

I do the procedure once as a routine cleaning, twice every 100 rounds or so and flitz it every 200 rounds. I have never had a carbon problem.

Also, no soaking is involved in this procedure so you can do it pretty quickly and nothing sits in the barrel for any length of time.
 
I've considered trying the Slip 2000

ballistic64 said:
Jim, you might try some Slip 2000 and a brush on the carbon,Ive had pretty good luck with it.
Click to expand...

Might as well add some to the extensive inventory of other cleaners I have on my shelves .

Have you by chance viewed the bbl fouled and then observed it with a borescope while cleaning using the Slip ?

Many thanks to all those that offered their input . I hope others that have acquired a borescope and developed further cleaning regimens will chime in here . Like everyone , if there is a better way to do it I want to know .

Jim Brown
 
Jimm,

I have found that JB used on a bronze bore brush will get the job done when a barrel gets a little behind in cleaning. I know others that do the same and it does not seem to hurt the barrel at all. It will of course wear the bronze brush out if you put in enough strokes.
 
Slip 2000/ Carbon

jimm: yes, I tried Slip2000 when it first became available. First tried it on carbon coated fired case necks, and was impressed how the carbon was easily removed. Was not that impressed with the results seen with the borescope. It removed the carbon on the wide, flat areas of the lands and grooves, but the carbon remained in the corners where the land and groove meet. Brushing with JB removed most of the "corner" build-up. I still believe the best way to avoid carbon build-up is to not use the "dirtier" types of ball powder. If fired case necks are heavily coated with carbon--- so is the bore.
 
JB Bore Paste!

I have had my bore scope since 2003.

Since then I switched to JB bore paste and Kroil. My barrels are shiny and clean.

Snake Oil works for some but if you have a bore scope you are able to see the truth.

Mostly I shoot moly. I use a loose patch and Kroil first. Then a tight patch and kroil followed by a dry patch.

At the end of the day I clean to a shiny barrel. 25 strokes, in and out is one stroke, with JB on a tight patch. Some times I use three patches, 75 strokes. Then clean and oil with Kroil to clear all the paste. After this barrel is spotless.

After this detail cleaning when I go out the next day with the barrel it will usually take 1 to 3 shots to settle in. Varies barrel to barrel.

I seem to get better barrel life with this process than any others I have used. Not sure why.
 
I also have a Hawkeye borescope, and have seen the same sort of carbon buildup in custom & factory barrels from 223 up through 308 W. One of the most remarkable things I've seen is how much faster carbon build up in throats happens with my 6x47 Lapuas vs. my 6 Dashers. Whether I'm using Varget, H4350, N150, N160, or Data 86, that extra 7-8grs. of powder the 6x47 uses really shows up in how quickly carbon builds in throats as opposed to the Dashers.

Iosso bore paste on a patch wrapped around a nylon bore brush gets rid of the carbon faster & more consistently than anything else I've used. Slip 2000 carbon cutter worked well on one barrel that had so much carbon that you really had to look closely with the Hawkeye to see the lands & grooves in the first 8"-9" of a factory 220 Swift bbl. the owner used with 45-55gr. bullets on prairie dogs. That one was carboned up badly out to within the last 6" of its 26" bbl. However, when I tried the same carbon cutter on a 6XC that had been shot exclusively with 105-115gr. bullets, it flopped. After a couple of hours of fruitless effort, I gave up and switched to Iosso, which worked like a charm. I don't use Iosso every cleaning - maybe I'm wrong, but it seems that using it too often - to the point where the bore is really shiney - results in more copper fouling, even with moly'd bullets.
 
I got carried away with shiny clean - carbon free in borescope view, and tried Flitz. Major error, ruined barrel, that fast. Copper fouling with coated bullets went off the chart...

This is how I learn things
 
Lester Bruno told me to never use bore paste in my barrel because it would polish the bore too well and would lead to heavy copper fouling in the future. For that reason I rarely use it and do so very sparingly when I do. My damned borescope tells me I should use it more on the first six inches of my barrel to cut through the carbon build up that is so stubborn to other methods. I usually accept a small amount of carbon in the throat as acceptable as long as the rifle is shooting well. It it seems to not want to tune for me, I pull out the JB and remove most of the carbon at the throat. It seems to work but my experience is quite limited in this game.
 
Bore Paste

When you use bore paste I have found it to be critical to have all the paste out of the barrel before you start shooting again!

With JB the Kroil will clean out the paste. That is why I stick to JB.

By the way the JB "Bore Bright" is the slightly faster of the two.
 
Borescope advantages

This is one of the great pluses of owning a borescope; you get to actually see what is in your bore and how effective your techniques are.
Chino69
 
I got carried away with shiny clean - carbon free in borescope view, and tried Flitz.

I had a buddy with the same problem. Fritz!

We detail cleaned the barrel with Bore Paste and Kroil using very tight patches.

Took a spell.

Once it is clean and oiled it shot OK again.

Th Fritz left something in the barrel that bullet jackets did no like.

If you still have the barrel give this a try. It worked for us.
 
Maybe I will. I think I still have the barrel.
Prior to my experiment, the barrel had never copper fouled using WS2 coated bullets. Apperently, I need to 'roughen' it back up for copper free shooting.

I wonder what finish is provided with a new barrel
 
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