Locked Up Suhl

J

Joe Haller

Guest
At a practice session tonight at our club, one of the Suhl 150 "locked Up".

My Grandson was shooiting it and he noticed a shot ejected hard, then after the next shot, he could not open the bolt. None of us could open the bolt.

Any one here have a similar problem? Know what to do to get that bolt open?

Last time I had a problem like this was in 1958. Had a rimfire 40X blow up on me. The extractors were blown out and locked up the bolt. Had to send it back to Remington for repair. The cause, according to Remington was a hot primer that blew the back of the case out. The next week I had a new BSA Mark II and another case blew. Cracked the extractor fork, but extraction still worked. Al Freeland send me a new extractor.

After that second "explosion" Remington took back the two cases of Remington Match the club had bought and gave us new ammo. Their explanation was that some of the primer "mix" in the edge of the mixing bowl formed a "HOT" primer mixture.

Anway: This Suhl extraction problem was not the result of a blown out case from a hot primer. So: What else could it be? And how do we get that bolt open.

Joe Haller :-(
 
Try taking the rear cap/retainer off the bolt and see if that helps.
Fred K
 
Joe,
I'd take it out of the stock, remove the trigger. It may release it. If not it needs to be out of the way so it won't be damaged. Like Fred said, remove the rear cap and the sleeve. Another thing to try before you take it apart. Bump the bolt handle with a upward strike. Not hard just firm. First thing I'd do would be remove the trigger.
 
Lack of Lubrication

I agree with Fred & Gary. I've had some experience with hard bolt lift, and found I needed to keep the cocking cam lubricated with something slick. I went to using Tetra Gun Grease on the cocking ramps, and the problem went a way. Other that a linght oil on the outside of the bolt body, this is the only other place I use lube on a Suhl bolt.
 
Trigger

Taking the trigger off is a good start but by no means treat it as anything but loaded. The "last shot" is hearsay no matter who said it. Confidence is high that the round is spent but that "shot in a million" will still kill you.
 
Spent case

As it was noted in the first question, the case that is still in the locked up action, is spent. I can't get mine to fire twice.

Sounds like a no lube situation and possibly some grit between the bolt body and bolt raceway.

I agree about operating any firearm safely, but to work on a firearm, that should be done by someone knowlegable.
 
Open Sesame . . .

I tried saying that phrase three times and the action still would not open:
So, tonight I tried the suggestions you guys made.

First: I made sure the muzzle was pointed in a safe direction, as Wilber suggested. JUst in case this might be that one shot in a million.

Second: I tried to take the rear cap/retainer off the back of the bolt as Fred K suggested. It would not turn.

Then, I loosened the back guard screw as suggested by FredB. He thought the end of the screw might be pressing against the under side of the bolt. Still stuck.

Then, I took the action out of the stock and removed the trigger, as Gary suggested. That didn't release it either.

Put the barred action back in the stock cradle and while pushing hard on that rear cap, I tried to pull the bold up. Wouldn't move.

Dave Smith called me yesterday from Florida, and gave me some of the same information you guys gave, but also suggested the use of a hardwood block and a rawhide mallet if I really got desperate.

So: In desperation, I got a small piece of hardwood and a rawhide hammer. Had my Grandson, Rob tap lightly on the back of that knurled cap, while I pulled up on the bolt handle. Still stuck.

I said: "OK, Rob, hit it harder" . . . The bolt moved a little: "Harder, Rob". It came up a little more. "One more time Rob". A mighty pull on the bold and: SHAZAM! It came free. Shazam works better than "Open Sesame".

Pulled the bolt apart, cleaned it and lubed the cocking cam as Fred suggested. Works smooth now.

Have about .040" protrusion on the firing pin. Pulled it apart again and reshaped the end of the firing pin like Bill Calfee has suggested.

Dave Smith sold me a Grade 10 Suhl about 6 years ago. Great rifle. Never had any problems with it. and it shoots GREAT.

Chuck (langenc) is gon'a be disappointed when he learns my Black Grade 10 Suhl is still in good shape.

It was the GREEN one, Chuck.

I want to thank all you guys for your suggestions. Saved me from shipping the rifle to one of my favorite gunsmiths.

Joe (Mr. Frosty)
It's finally warming up UP here. We had a real cold Spring.
 
froze up?

Joe (Mr. Frosty)
It's finally warming up UP here. We had a real cold Spring.
I think the action just now thawed out!
 
Mr. Frosty:

Glad to see you got it freed up. Glad I could help..

Keep that Black Suhl humming....

Dave
 
Joe
I would look very close for the real problem. I don't believe the lack of lube was the problem. Take a good look in the action other than the bolt.
Fred K
 
Joe,

This is a message from Bill Calfee concerning your problem:

Friend Joe:

Read where you re-shaped the tip of your Suhl to something like my specs.....this is not a good idea on a Suhl, UNLESS YOU PIN THE COCKING PIECE TO THE FIRING PIN TO KEEP THE PIN FROM ROTATING.......

Joe, the Suhl pin is threaded to the cocking piece...this is why the tip is round....should it rotate any, the pin footprint would remain the same in the case head....

If you re-grind to the Calfee style pin shape and the pin should rotate you'll have ignition problems...

I have produced several Suhls with my pin shape, works great, but I also placed a small hardened pin through the cocking piece and firing pin to keep the pin from rotating....

Also, where the cocking piece is located on the threaded firing pin is extremely critical for several reasons....

Lastly, if it were me, I'd still have to determine why the bolt locked up...
Chances are it wouldn't do it from lack of grease only..

Your friend, Bill Calfee
 
I'd like to know if you fined why the bolt locked up? I have taken mine apart cleand some crud & grease out of it and re-lubed an assembled it to attemp to avoid your problem.
I had not had any indication of a problem this was done as preventive maintenance only after reading of yours and one other on the forum with bolt issues.


Semper fi
pickles
 
Bolt Lock up

I've had two Suhl Bolts that appeared to lock up, but not to the extent of what Joe mentioned. Since I started to religiously lubricate the Locking Lugs and the cocking ramps with a quality, slick Lubricant, I have not had a problem. Calfee can say all he wants about the lack of lube not be the problem, but I'll bet it sure lead to it. Pickles, do not lubricate the interior of your Suhl Bolt.
 
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