Farley bolts-Solution possibility

P

PPP MMM

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Anybody who owns those "unsafe" bolts in question could fine a possible solution by cutting the bolt head off and replacing it with a floating bolt head (ala Savage) made of 4340 and hardenned to the common World wide "Motor Industry Standard" which is 38-42HRC.

There never ever should be a problem with the material availability, heat-treaters question of their knowledge, material mechanical properties etc.

If the bolt configuration allow this suggestion to become a possibility to be done, I personally wouldn't wait and deppend on another Farley "material ignorance" bolt replacement.

Shoot better
Peter
 
PPP MMM said:
Anybody who owns those "unsafe" bolts in question could fine a possible solution by cutting the bolt head off and replacing it with a floating bolt head (ala Savage) made of 4340 and hardenned to the common World wide "Motor Industry Standard" which is 38-42HRC.

There never ever should be a problem with the material availability, heat-treaters question of their knowledge, material mechanical properties etc.

If the bolt configuration allow this suggestion to become a possibility to be done, I personally wouldn't wait and deppend on another Farley "material ignorance" bolt replacement.

Shoot better
Peter
Click to expand...
Peter
You do seem to have a lot of knowlege in this area, so I am wondering why this solution is better than having the S7 bolt properly heat treated or replaced with one that is properly heat treated.
Thank you

James
 
I made a removable bolt head for my 40X action. Actually, I made a new bolt body too (from C1045) so I could have an integral bolt handle and extraction cam. I made the bolt head from EN30B because I had some on hand and felt it would work well. Seems fine.
I think Peter's point is that 4340 is a better material for the purpose than S7 regardless of hardness. Regards, Bill.
 
First and foremost I would like to state that safety is #1 and I love no one better than ME. However, I have 3 Farley's and they are as good a action as I have ever owned for BR bar none. To commit such a travisty to a great working bolt/action/rifle over a few claims/concerns/instances of hardness issues should be a felony. I have shot my actions thousands of times and will not think twice shooting them thousands of more rounds. ANYONE that modifies a Farley bolt is subjecting themselves to much more risk and headache than than having Jim see if the bolt has any issues or not. All of my actions are RBLPRE and two are dual bolt face (will eject a .100 short 22 PPC or a 6 or 30 BR). Try that with any sliding plate extractor and you are asking for SURE disappointment! These issues (if they are indeed issues) should be addressed directly to the Farley's and not run anyone in the ground on a public forum. Every one involved has a right to know, but with tact and without hurting someone's livelyhood. I'm sure when I say that none of this was intentional that I am speaking for the Farley's.This is not the first time an action has been damaged at a BR match. I don't recall anyone asking who, how, history on the action in question and having solid facts on the history of the action in question. Many times in life smart people (generally speaking) have a brain fart testing some new idea in this sport and the consiquences may not reveal themselves for some time. I'm not saying that a bolt that has been Rockwell tested is not a point of concern if it is too hard, but take care of it the right way. Hacking-up a perfectly good action over having the bolt replaced/repaired is a poor attempt at good judgement.

Good shooting,

Brian Moore
 
Bill, you'r spot on

Bill Leeper said:
I made a removable bolt head for my 40X action. Actually, I made a new bolt body too (from C1045) so I could have an integral bolt handle and extraction cam. I made the bolt head from EN30B because I had some on hand and felt it would work well. Seems fine.
I think Peter's point is that 4340 is a better material for the purpose than S7 regardless of hardness. Regards, Bill.
Click to expand...
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Your choice of EN30B is also spot on a very good steel that was originally designed to replace 4340 in racing cars axles/gearboxes. (tougher than 4340).

Also the name EN30B is used with another steel 2767 tool steel, which is a 4.2% nicklel, chrome, molly steel. Appart from use in the cattlery and coining industry, it's also used in High performance cars gearboxes.

You'r also spot on that the 4340 would be far more suitable for the application of the bolt compare to the S7. The only dissadvantage the 4340 would have it would be an inferior abrasion/weare.

James

Even if the S7 would be properly heat-treated the Impact value would still be only about 50%-60% of 4340. 4Mesh explained it perfectly in a Thread called "Peter" originally posted by Jackie.

Guys lets be serious, I'm only suggesting a relatively "easy" solution to any of you who now know, that the S7 is not as good as the 4340 in this particular application.

If you all feel that you don't need to or don't wan't to do anything about it it's fine by me. I'm not here to tell anybody what they should or shouldn't do.

Shoot better
Peter
 
Peter

Do you have the impact values for 4340 available to post here? If so, please do. Does 4340 actually have impact values near 400 ft/lbs c-notch? Do you have the v-notch data for 4340 & S7, and what about 4140?

Michael
 
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Mturner

Michael

I don't know everything and I don't remember everything forever, but I've seen the 4340 C-Notch/Un-Notch? listed somewhere at 360fp, but I don't remember the hardness and where it was I've seen it. There is even a possibility that was an Un-Notched figures.

The 4340 C-Notch and Un-Notch properties wouldn't be the most common thing to be listed. Even the V-Notch Impact is quiet hard to find. You can go to ASSAB and/or BOHLER and find it there.

For S7 and even tougher S5, you can Google it or go to a Latrobe Steels and it will sent you to a MatWeb and find the links about the S5-S7 Impact Value.
From my memory the S7 V-Notch Value is only about 15fp. at around 50HRC.

4140-4340 go to a MatWeb, Materials, 4000steels. and for relevant 4140 go to a page 1 and look at 168 through to 176

For 4340 go to page 2 and look at 389 through to 392. With the 4340 read at what temperature the particular values aply. (it's listed from -185*C to a 38*C. on the same line in a smaller print!

In both cases there is shown how different tempering temperature effects the Izodic Impact Value.

If I'll find the C-Notch/Un-Notch for 4340 I'll post it.

Just for the sake of it this is a Flexor Impact Values compared with 4140 and 6150

Shoot better
Peter
 

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