F-Class Nats...when and where???
- Thread starter expiper
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expiper
Broken down Plumber
wonderful...
I hope to be out that way around that time....and will try to attend...Did I understand that there is a waiting list or a list to get on...how do you apply for that list ....is it possible to arrive and shoot or is is only for those invited or approved???....I am used to being able to shoot any where there is an event....I have shot Benchrest events for most of my life and dont understand the procedures ....are the targets and the course of fire different distance or more complicated procedure at a Nat event?....Is it just for "certified" marksmen .....please educate me....thank you all...Roger
I hope to be out that way around that time....and will try to attend...Did I understand that there is a waiting list or a list to get on...how do you apply for that list ....is it possible to arrive and shoot or is is only for those invited or approved???....I am used to being able to shoot any where there is an event....I have shot Benchrest events for most of my life and dont understand the procedures ....are the targets and the course of fire different distance or more complicated procedure at a Nat event?....Is it just for "certified" marksmen .....please educate me....thank you all...Roger
Well, I'll try to explain. Hopefully not too much gets lost in the translation, and please try to understand I'm coming from the opposite end of the spectrum - I shoot HP (XTC, Prone & F-Class) but zero BR as of yet 
Generally the date/location are announced around or about the previous years Nationals. F-Class Nationals move around the country to make it nobody has the 'home field' advantage year after year, and to make it accessible to a larger group. There has been some tinkering with the dates for reasons that don't really apply to this discussion - suffice it to say the 'normal' time - end of October - is very close to some other important LR events that cannot move.
Unless the range hosting the event is very large, such as the NRA Whittington center @ Raton NM, there has to be a cap on the number of competitors. In basic terms, one shooter per target per relay, and each relay gets to shoot three strings, rotating in between. If there are 'only' 25 targets available, then you have a max of 25 shooters per relay. Figuring in all the times for shooting the strings, changing relays, doing pit changes, etc. it works out to where more than 5 relays makes for a *very* long day, bordering on being more of an endurance contest than a shooting match.
As such, this particular event put a cap of 125 shooters on the event attendance. They may 'hold' a spot or two for people who are returning competitors, but otherwise the event is currently full, with a waiting list. The best place to find authoritative information on any NRA LR event is over at usrifleteams.com, formerly 'long-range.com', specifically here for the 2010 FCNC.
Again, I haven't shot BR, so I don't know how much the average shooter has to do during the match besides show up and shoot. In High Power, you alternately shoot, score for other shooters on the same target, and work in the pit pulling and marking the target for your fellow shooters. It's not especially complicated or strenuous; almost anybody can do it with a little practice.
When scoring, you take a chair and your spotting scope and the score card from your fellow competitor and set up immediately behind or to the side of them, and mark down their shots on the score card. Each shot has the target pulled and a spotter put in the shot hole, a scoring disk placed around the edge of the target in a location corresponding with the score (helps clarify things when the shot is close to the line), and then run back up. The scorer calls out the score as such "Roger, your third shot for score is an 'X'" and so on. If someone cross fires and the target goes down and your competitor did *not* shoot, you are a witness to that fact so he does not get scored for a potentially bad shot he did not make (although Murphy's Law for HP states that every crossfire shall invariably be a 10 or an X ).
When pulling targets, you have to pull the target down, remove the spotter plug from the previous shot, put a paster of that hole find the new hole, check if it is touching the line (shooter gets the higher value if the shot touches the line), put the spotter in it, move the value disk if necessary. The rules 'allow' 15-25 seconds per shot for you to do this; most able-bodies individuals can do it under 10; I've seen Grand Seniors (70+) give 7 second target service or better. In between relays you have to re-face the targets (glue on new centers with wallpaper paste). It's important to remember that *you* are deciding the score for another competitor (as are they for you), not some arbitrary range official.
While scoring or pulling you need to keep focused on the shots being fired; it is not a good time to space out or not see the shot impact. You can very easily ruin the rhythm of the shooter when they have to call down on the radio to have the target marked because the puller was asleep, or when they get to the end of their string and the scorer missed a couple shots and says, "no... you still have three more shots to go". There *are* times when people make mistakes and this sort of thing does happen... but new shooters tend to see a little more of it until they get used to how things work.
It's all relatively easy once you get the hang of it... but in my opinion, any sports National Championship is not the place to get your first exposure to the venue and all it may entail. There are other rules that I didn't go over (the above is the absolute basics) that may come up; a passing familiarity with the rule book both in theory and in practice is a good idea. My personal opinion is that a person should really have, at a minimum, a classification card from the NRA (meaning they have at least 120 rounds down range in sanctioned competitions, or about two or three matches under their belt) before showing up at the Nationals to ensure they have a little bit of experience with how it all works out. But thats just me...
Any questions?
Generally the date/location are announced around or about the previous years Nationals. F-Class Nationals move around the country to make it nobody has the 'home field' advantage year after year, and to make it accessible to a larger group. There has been some tinkering with the dates for reasons that don't really apply to this discussion - suffice it to say the 'normal' time - end of October - is very close to some other important LR events that cannot move.
Unless the range hosting the event is very large, such as the NRA Whittington center @ Raton NM, there has to be a cap on the number of competitors. In basic terms, one shooter per target per relay, and each relay gets to shoot three strings, rotating in between. If there are 'only' 25 targets available, then you have a max of 25 shooters per relay. Figuring in all the times for shooting the strings, changing relays, doing pit changes, etc. it works out to where more than 5 relays makes for a *very* long day, bordering on being more of an endurance contest than a shooting match.
As such, this particular event put a cap of 125 shooters on the event attendance. They may 'hold' a spot or two for people who are returning competitors, but otherwise the event is currently full, with a waiting list. The best place to find authoritative information on any NRA LR event is over at usrifleteams.com, formerly 'long-range.com', specifically here for the 2010 FCNC.
Again, I haven't shot BR, so I don't know how much the average shooter has to do during the match besides show up and shoot. In High Power, you alternately shoot, score for other shooters on the same target, and work in the pit pulling and marking the target for your fellow shooters. It's not especially complicated or strenuous; almost anybody can do it with a little practice.
When scoring, you take a chair and your spotting scope and the score card from your fellow competitor and set up immediately behind or to the side of them, and mark down their shots on the score card. Each shot has the target pulled and a spotter put in the shot hole, a scoring disk placed around the edge of the target in a location corresponding with the score (helps clarify things when the shot is close to the line), and then run back up. The scorer calls out the score as such "Roger, your third shot for score is an 'X'" and so on. If someone cross fires and the target goes down and your competitor did *not* shoot, you are a witness to that fact so he does not get scored for a potentially bad shot he did not make (although Murphy's Law for HP states that every crossfire shall invariably be a 10 or an X
).When pulling targets, you have to pull the target down, remove the spotter plug from the previous shot, put a paster of that hole find the new hole, check if it is touching the line (shooter gets the higher value if the shot touches the line), put the spotter in it, move the value disk if necessary. The rules 'allow' 15-25 seconds per shot for you to do this; most able-bodies individuals can do it under 10; I've seen Grand Seniors (70+) give 7 second target service or better. In between relays you have to re-face the targets (glue on new centers with wallpaper paste). It's important to remember that *you* are deciding the score for another competitor (as are they for you), not some arbitrary range official.
While scoring or pulling you need to keep focused on the shots being fired; it is not a good time to space out or not see the shot impact. You can very easily ruin the rhythm of the shooter when they have to call down on the radio to have the target marked because the puller was asleep, or when they get to the end of their string and the scorer missed a couple shots and says, "no... you still have three more shots to go". There *are* times when people make mistakes and this sort of thing does happen... but new shooters tend to see a little more of it until they get used to how things work.
It's all relatively easy once you get the hang of it... but in my opinion, any sports National Championship is not the place to get your first exposure to the venue and all it may entail. There are other rules that I didn't go over (the above is the absolute basics) that may come up; a passing familiarity with the rule book both in theory and in practice is a good idea. My personal opinion is that a person should really have, at a minimum, a classification card from the NRA (meaning they have at least 120 rounds down range in sanctioned competitions, or about two or three matches under their belt) before showing up at the Nationals to ensure they have a little bit of experience with how it all works out. But thats just me...
Any questions?
Last edited:
expiper
Broken down Plumber
Great explanation...
It sounds a lot like long range Benchrest....except you lay on the ground....does each competitor supply his own spotting scope? and a mat or blanket to place your stuff on (including me..grin),,,I usually trave lite (fly out and bak) and have difficulty taking stuff on the airlines....do others share or is that not allowed....I apreciate the thorough explination so far....Thank YOU...Roger
It sounds a lot like long range Benchrest....except you lay on the ground....does each competitor supply his own spotting scope? and a mat or blanket to place your stuff on (including me..grin),,,I usually trave lite (fly out and bak) and have difficulty taking stuff on the airlines....do others share or is that not allowed....I apreciate the thorough explination so far....Thank YOU...Roger
Generally yes, most people bring their own spotting scope and shooting mat. And yes, its not at all uncommon for folks to share one mat, spotting scope, chair, etc. either because someone is new and doesn't have one, someone's stuff broke/got lost courtesy of the airlines or because we're just too lazy to keep switching them out. Some folks get pretty particular about their setups, though - cutting holes in their mats so that it will lay flat on the ground instead of on top of the mat, or they may be a lefty, etc. so it's not something I'd bet on - but I'm sure if you ask around, a local might have an extra that they'd be willing to lend you. Otherwise... fly light, get into town and go to Wally-world and pick up a camping pad for cheap and give it away to someone at the end of the event A pair of compact binoculars would suffice for seeing where the spotter and value disk are for scoring if push comes to shove. A good spotting scope on the line next to you when firing can be an advantage on some ranges under some conditions... you can pull the focus back and watch the mirage if you want, while keeping your rifle scope focused on the target.
or because we're just too lazy to keep switching them out. Some folks get pretty particular about their setups, though - cutting holes in their mats so that it will lay flat on the ground instead of on top of the mat, or they may be a lefty, etc. so it's not something I'd bet on - but I'm sure if you ask around, a local might have an extra that they'd be willing to lend you. Otherwise... fly light, get into town and go to Wally-world and pick up a camping pad for cheap and give it away to someone at the end of the event A pair of compact binoculars would suffice for seeing where the spotter and value disk are for scoring if push comes to shove. A good spotting scope on the line next to you when firing can be an advantage on some ranges under some conditions... you can pull the focus back and watch the mirage if you want, while keeping your rifle scope focused on the target.