T
Talon1959
Guest
With it's limited MOA adjustments, could this scope be used at 600 yards without a 10-20 MOA base? 
T
Tconcave
Guest
Depends on your cartridge. I am shooting a Savage 12FV in .308 with Elite 4200 8-32x. I shoot 155gr Sierra Palma's, 46.5gr Varget, Norma Brass, and CCI BR2's. I am able to reach out to 750+ Yards without a rail.
Tcon
Tcon
T
Talon1959
Guest
Thanks for the reply! My 4200 is on a .308 Savage/McGowen. All I have shot with it so far is 168 SMKs over 43.5 of Varget or 42.5 of Rel 15.
T
Tconcave
Guest
My 168 SMK's with 44gr of varget just reached 650Yards without a rail.
Last edited by a moderator:
T
Talon1959
Guest
Thanks for the info!
John Kielly
Shari's fan club
Careful, now!
Talon,
Scope rails aren't just to get you on elevation zero at some distance. Properly matched scopes & scope rails work together to optimise the mechanics & maybe even the optics of your rig.
Even with the technical improvements in glass over some time, it's generally agreed that your scope will operate best mechanically & optically at the centre of its adjustment (assuming that the optical centre corresponds with the mechanical centre of adjustment). That's exactly where you want the scope to be when you're operating at the longest distance you are proposing to shoot at, because that's where you will undoubtedly need to crank the most wind on & off to compensate for conditions - and be most precise setting the elevation, if it comes to that.
If it turns out that you are close to the end of your elevation adjustment at that longest distance, then you risk windage corrections being imprecise because there just isn't enough room left either in the scope tube or the erector system to perform those adjustments precisely. You also risk any aberration or other shortcoming of the optics causing issues with precise focussing.
Now, most scopes don't have enough adjustment for you to set your longest adjustment at the centre & still traverse to the elevation needed to get on zero at the shortest distance, so you need to select a rail that offers a reasonable compromise (one that won't hurt you too much). Let's ignore your specific requirements for the moment & consider the needs of an F classer who needs 35 MOA rise to get from 300 to 1000 yards. A compromise might be to accept that the 1000 yard zero set 10 MOA beyond centre mightn't hurt the mechanics & optics too much. That would mean that your 300 yard zero would fall 25 MOA below centre. You wouldn't want that to be hard on the stops either, so maybe another 10 MOA below that would allow you a bit of safety.
If you do your maths & ignoring any posssibilities of barrel droop, angle or the like, you would need to fit a 25 MOA rail to a scope with at least 70 MOA of elevation adjustment to have a good liklihood that your adjustments would operate precisely as needed in that case.
That issue doesn't arise now, when you're only considering shooting out to 750 yards, but the real F class action happens out at the Palma distances of 800 to 1000 yards, so you should still have that in mind when considering your options IMHO.
John
Talon,
Scope rails aren't just to get you on elevation zero at some distance. Properly matched scopes & scope rails work together to optimise the mechanics & maybe even the optics of your rig.
Even with the technical improvements in glass over some time, it's generally agreed that your scope will operate best mechanically & optically at the centre of its adjustment (assuming that the optical centre corresponds with the mechanical centre of adjustment). That's exactly where you want the scope to be when you're operating at the longest distance you are proposing to shoot at, because that's where you will undoubtedly need to crank the most wind on & off to compensate for conditions - and be most precise setting the elevation, if it comes to that.
If it turns out that you are close to the end of your elevation adjustment at that longest distance, then you risk windage corrections being imprecise because there just isn't enough room left either in the scope tube or the erector system to perform those adjustments precisely. You also risk any aberration or other shortcoming of the optics causing issues with precise focussing.
Now, most scopes don't have enough adjustment for you to set your longest adjustment at the centre & still traverse to the elevation needed to get on zero at the shortest distance, so you need to select a rail that offers a reasonable compromise (one that won't hurt you too much). Let's ignore your specific requirements for the moment & consider the needs of an F classer who needs 35 MOA rise to get from 300 to 1000 yards. A compromise might be to accept that the 1000 yard zero set 10 MOA beyond centre mightn't hurt the mechanics & optics too much. That would mean that your 300 yard zero would fall 25 MOA below centre. You wouldn't want that to be hard on the stops either, so maybe another 10 MOA below that would allow you a bit of safety.
If you do your maths & ignoring any posssibilities of barrel droop, angle or the like, you would need to fit a 25 MOA rail to a scope with at least 70 MOA of elevation adjustment to have a good liklihood that your adjustments would operate precisely as needed in that case.
That issue doesn't arise now, when you're only considering shooting out to 750 yards, but the real F class action happens out at the Palma distances of 800 to 1000 yards, so you should still have that in mind when considering your options IMHO.
John
Last edited:
Does anyone know the amount of elevation adjustment in the Bushnell 4200 Elite Tactical? This page from their website says 50 in. @ 100 yards, but the .7 mm figure beside it doesn't make sense. Does it have 50 MOA adjustment at 100 yards, or more? Bill T.
http://www.bushnell.com/general/riflescopes_elite4200_42-6245t.cfm
http://www.bushnell.com/general/riflescopes_elite4200_42-6245t.cfm