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katokoch
Guest
Suppose I were to design a simple, but usable tuner (or muzzle device if you will) for a (rimfire) rifle with a straight taper barrel and don't want to thread the end. How would you fit the tuner to the barrel?
Bill Wynne
Active member
Most rimfire tuners are attached by a clamping action built into the tuner itself.
It works very well.
Concho Bill
It works very well.
Concho Bill
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katokoch
Guest
How simple of a clamp are we talking? Any photos or links?
I might as well explain what I'm planning on doing. It's a dead simple design, but I think it perfectly well achieves the concept of a tuning device.
I'll take a peice of threaded steel rod... maybe 1 1/8" or 1 1/4" diameter and boring a hole in that is as close to .920" as possible, 1" deep. The barrel is .920", straight taper. NO, it is not a 10/22.
Anyways, basically we're looking at a threaded rod that is (probably going to be) 1 1/8" in diameter and has a .920" hole drilled through. I may just have it drilled through .920" for one inch and then the rest at something like 3/4" or so, so there is a step for fitting it tight and more weight. I think I'll have 2" hanging off the muzzle so the entire thing is 3" long.
To weight it, I'll simply use 1 1/8" nuts. I'll figure out a base weight and adjust them from there (I have no problem sweating out work with a hacksaw). I'll probably loctite in one nut as a base and then screw in others against it and once vertical is eliminated in the groups, loctite the last one in too.
Ugly? Yes. Inexpensive enough for me? Definitely.
Will it work? What do you think?
I might as well explain what I'm planning on doing. It's a dead simple design, but I think it perfectly well achieves the concept of a tuning device.
I'll take a peice of threaded steel rod... maybe 1 1/8" or 1 1/4" diameter and boring a hole in that is as close to .920" as possible, 1" deep. The barrel is .920", straight taper. NO, it is not a 10/22.
Anyways, basically we're looking at a threaded rod that is (probably going to be) 1 1/8" in diameter and has a .920" hole drilled through. I may just have it drilled through .920" for one inch and then the rest at something like 3/4" or so, so there is a step for fitting it tight and more weight. I think I'll have 2" hanging off the muzzle so the entire thing is 3" long.
To weight it, I'll simply use 1 1/8" nuts. I'll figure out a base weight and adjust them from there (I have no problem sweating out work with a hacksaw). I'll probably loctite in one nut as a base and then screw in others against it and once vertical is eliminated in the groups, loctite the last one in too.
Ugly? Yes. Inexpensive enough for me? Definitely.
Will it work? What do you think?
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katokoch
Guest
Time for some Microsoft Paint awesomeness. Never doubt a teenager who is bored and needs a study break.
I hope the image is large enough. For the visual people, this is the design.
Letter A= barrel
Letter B= threaded rod
Letter C= clamping screws
Letter D= point where rod bore diameter steps .920 to fit barrel to 3/4" (muzzle)
Letter E= Nuts, cut to weight.
This also allows ample space for small, lead tire weights
There are Fudd tuners, and there is my Fugly tuner.
Here's a question... is there an optimal bore diameter for the tuner itself?
Where is the optimal place to have weights?
I hope the image is large enough. For the visual people, this is the design.
Letter A= barrel
Letter B= threaded rod
Letter C= clamping screws
Letter D= point where rod bore diameter steps .920 to fit barrel to 3/4" (muzzle)
Letter E= Nuts, cut to weight.
This also allows ample space for small, lead tire weights
There are Fudd tuners, and there is my Fugly tuner.
Here's a question... is there an optimal bore diameter for the tuner itself?
Where is the optimal place to have weights?
Last edited by a moderator:
JerrySharrett
Senile Member
First, you are going to need the barrel turned straignt (no taper) for the distance you want the tuner to clamp on. Even with epoxy, a tapered fit will eventually give up the ghost as the barrel expands and contracts.
Bill Wynne
Active member
Katokoch,
Of course it will work. My tuner has a bore of about .5" but I don't know if that optimal.
It is exactly your kind of thinking that made this country great. Never quit thinking. Many years ago a construction superintendent that I worked for told me that I would have it made in construction because I could think. He added most people don't. The man was right.
Concho Bill
Of course it will work. My tuner has a bore of about .5" but I don't know if that optimal.
It is exactly your kind of thinking that made this country great. Never quit thinking. Many years ago a construction superintendent that I worked for told me that I would have it made in construction because I could think. He added most people don't. The man was right.
Concho Bill
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katokoch
Guest
The barrel is straight *diameter*. I just think it would be easiest for both clamping and installation if I had 1" of the bore diameter to be .920 like the barrel so I have 1" of clamping surface and the rest .75" (and I don't know why that number). I suppose I should do my math and figure out what bore diameter I need to have a base weight of something standard like 8 oz. or so. Does that sound right?
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JerrySharrett
Senile Member
The 1" of barrel you are wanting to use should be straight (cylindrical, not conical). Straight taper and straight diameter are not the same.
As to weight, there are at least two schools. There are those who think 3-4 oz is enough, yet they admit they have to readjust 2-4 times during the day.
Then there are those like myself that have found out that 10 oz or more will keep a barrel in tune over a longer period. i. e. the heavier tuner creates a wider load window.
The disadvantage of the heavier tuner is that it makes a Light /Varmint/Sporter more difficult to make weight of 10.5 pounds. This normally leads to turning a tapered barrel to a straight diameter of about 0.800" or so for all but about 4" of the breech end.
The straight diameter is also easier to tune though.
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RegisG
Guest
What is meant by QUOTE: "Then there are those like myself that have found out that 10 oz or more will keep a barrel in tune over a longer period. i. e. the heavier tuner creates a wider load window."
What is a wider load window? How much over 10 oz are you talking (just a fraction or 14, 15 oz)?
Do you find that you move the tuner position before or after finding correct weight?
My new 453 Varmint is on its way....
Thanks,
Regis
What is a wider load window? How much over 10 oz are you talking (just a fraction or 14, 15 oz)?
Do you find that you move the tuner position before or after finding correct weight?
My new 453 Varmint is on its way....
Thanks,
Regis
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katokoch
Guest
Jerry, I've been using the wrong term all along. The barrel is .920" in diameter for it's entire length, so yes it is a cylindrical barrel. My bad for the confusion.
The fun thing about all of this is that I'm not going to be able to ignore threads about tuners anymore and ringing barrels and how to set them up and adjusting, etc. Ahhh!
The fun thing about all of this is that I'm not going to be able to ignore threads about tuners anymore and ringing barrels and how to set them up and adjusting, etc. Ahhh!
One other way is to forget the threaded rod and nuts. bore about two inches for the barrel and just slide it back and forth to tune. That's the way Bill Calfee's first tuners were I believe. You can use a depth mic or precision scale to go back to settings. Once you get it set right, very little if any adjustment will be needed.
Simplicity is generally the best answer.
Hovis
Simplicity is generally the best answer.
Hovis
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katokoch
Guest
I went down to a local machine shop today to pick up my metal. I got it fitted to the barrel and the clamp figured out.
It's ugly, but it should work. It follows the basic principle of a tuner. Now I just need to go shoot and get it figured out.
Oh, the total cost was (machining $30) + ("weights" from Fastenal $12) = $42 plus some elbow grease. Not too bad.
It's ugly, but it should work. It follows the basic principle of a tuner. Now I just need to go shoot and get it figured out.
Oh, the total cost was (machining $30) + ("weights" from Fastenal $12) = $42 plus some elbow grease. Not too bad.
C
coopshooter
Guest
quick easy clamp
using the threaded rod just bore your .920 to say .004 under then saw split that end for the one inch lenght and use the first nut as a squeeze to tighten and hold
using the threaded rod just bore your .920 to say .004 under then saw split that end for the one inch lenght and use the first nut as a squeeze to tighten and hold