Alinwa 338 Lapua ???

L

Lynn

Registered User
Alinwa
Al I am getting the Tac 408 action on the 28th of this month(10 day waiting period)and want to order up some barrels for it.
I see Bruno has a 1.450 MTU to 1.000 barrel at 33 inches from Krieger but it has an 11 twist to it.
The action is 1.600 in diameter and I suspect that barrel would finish at 32 inches so it matches pretty closely what I am after.Problem is why the 11 twist rate? Is this intended only for the 250 grain bullets? or is it intended for the 300's with a higher velocity range like the 338 Snipe-Tac cartridge at 3300 fps?
I also see they list 9.35 twist barrels any thoughts on these? Just for lathe turned solids?
Is Borden chambering those big calibers for you? Or did you find another gunsmith?
I would also like to shoot the 350 grain Sierra MatchKings in 0.375 caliber called a 375 Snipe-Tac but have never seen any actual data on it.I don't know of any magazines for the 408 parent case?
Lynn
 
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Lynn,

My entire 338 endeavor is built around the blown out 338 Lapua case using the 300gr Berger Hybrid. I actually spec'd the reamer some time ago from the older bullets but it seems to fit the new one too. If this bullet flops I'll have to start over. I have 9, 9.35 and 10" twists. Krieger claims that 9.35 is perfectly matched to the 338L using the new Hybrid. I spoke with Bryan Litz and he assured me that this latest batch of 300's will make me happy, in a 10" twist. I've also got a barrel ordered for my 65lb RWB gun, I'm going to try this round in comp without a brake.


I only own one 338 reamer spec'd to my own design and built around the 300 Hybrid. I spec my rifles from the leade out. First I pick a case, then a bullet, then spec the reamer, etc..... I ended up making a sizer from scratch on the 338, just to set the headspace to make the brass to order the reamer to fire the rounds to make the sizer die... which I finally got ordered last week.


I'm doing my own chambering. Long story, but I'm very happy with my decision.... happy enough that my FFL's in the mail and I'm thinking seriously about hanging my shingle as a specialty shop. I'll never do general gunsmithing again but I've found a niche market among people who've already SPENT their tens of thousands and found no satisfaction. I can make them happy.

I know nothing about the Chey Tac case except that nobody is offering anything better than 1moa, for 3-shot "groups." I can't see any gain over the BMG case myself. Of course nobody's getting better than 1moa for the 338L either so I can't infer too much from that except that folks don't know how to make rifles that shoot :)

It takes a Calfee Crazy type to go after the "why."

al
 
BTW, I'm FINALLY going to actually try the Hornady Custom Shops die..... after much phone tag and f'nagling The Honorable Ben Syring is making up a die....We 'Chall See. He will also make the die in larger threaded diameters as needed if it flexes. These larger diameter dies would work for the Cheytac case.

al
 
Of course nobody's getting better than 1moa for the 338L either
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Al, that's just not true. Steve Shelp in NC routinely did far better. And I don't remember if Scott Fletcher was shooting a .338 Lapua or a .338/460 Weatherby, but he won HG at the 2006 IBS 1,000 yard Nationals. Jim Hardy shot a .338 quite well too -- got a "bullet lathe" and point-up dies from Ferris Pindell. He sent some bullets to Joel Pendergraft, who won a few matches using a .338 on the full length, blown out, .404 case. There are others who were successful with the .338 Lapua, too.

The problem with the .338 has always been bullets. If the Bergers are good, the various.338s will be competitive, esp for score.

(Actually, Shelp was shooting a .338 Yogi, Dave Tooley's .338 Lapua improved.)
 
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Scott Fletcher also won Heavy Gun Group at the 2010 IBS 1000yd Nationals shooting a 338 Sloan. He was using the new Hornady 285 BTHP Match bullet. His agg. was only slightly below 1 minute though at 9.148".

James
 
Charles and James, I'm sorry, I was sloppy.

Of course some of the BR guys are doing better..... I just lumped my statement in with the guys building CheyTac's. I was unclear, skipped a few steps. What I meant to say was that the guys building CheyTacs and writing about it aren't getting real accuracy out of anything they build. They're all about speed and hunting and are completely satisfied with consistent 1moa capability.

Of course the 338L case is capable.

I'm not sure about the CheyTac case but that's simple ignorance on my part.

al
 
Goodgrouper
I picked up a 1000 of the 375 caliber 350 MatchKings for 57 cents each so I may try out a 375 Chey-Tac as well.Right now I am debating which barrel contour,twist and length to go with for a 338 Snipetac.I am thinking 1.450 for 5-7 inches with a straight taper down to around 0.940 - 1.00 at the muzzle 32 inches long maybe 34 inches.
I never even thought about using the McMillan 50 caliber stock until you posted the pictures of your gun.
I am assuming it is a carolina sunset color pattern on the LBR 50 caliber stock is that correct? Or is it the HBR with the 5 inch forend? My action is 1.6 inches so it would fit perfectly without having to go with a one off carbon fiber stock.Did you get that stock from Bill Shehane as well or straight from McMillan?
What twist does your barrel have for the 300 grain bullets and what altitude are you shooting them at?
I was hoping with the extra velocity available to the Snipetac rounds(3300-3450 fps) I could go with a 11 twist barrel?
Nice set-up and that is coming from somebody who doesn't hand out compliments everyday.
Ooopppss what scope are you using? It looks like a gold ring Leupold? Did you consider the 5.5X22X56?
Lynn
 
For a 2000yd shot that's actually a frighteningly LOW elevation :) It really illustrates the beauty of the round. That same shot with Bruce D'Artus' 308 would be about two more mountains up!

LOL

Goodgrouper,

Do you have a borescope to monitor the carbon ring in your gapspace? Have you ever checked it? Is your cleaning regimen keeping it in check? Reason I ask is it looks as though you've got a 40thou or so gapspace...... some folks have had problems with this.

BTW, if you bought the American version of that target instead of the Oz version you could save some shipping ;) and wouldn't have to turn your head all upsidowney to read it....

al
 
Alinwa
I have two of the McMillan actioned 50 bmg's and when we shoot APIT rounds which is tough with tight necked chambers and factory ammo we shoot them at 2300 yards.It is actually kind of tough finding things past 1200 yards to shoot at.Anyway I am using a 30 MOA base and a straight 36X Leupold 1 inch scope like you would find on a 100,200 yard gun.The bullets bc number is very poor for a 50 at around 0.650 and it scrubs off bc pretty quickly due to the tracer compound cooking off as the bullet travels downrange.
If we are shooting in a northerly direction we crank up all the available elevation in the scope and put the intended target on the bottom of the crosshairs were it is at absolute rock bottom on the scope.When the trigger sets off the round the bullet is a dozen feet to the left of the target and what appears to be several hundred feet high.It then corkscrews to the right directly in alignment with the target and drops what looks like like a rock.
If it wasn't for the tracer compound you wouldn't believe what the bullet is actually doing in order to get there.
Lynn
 
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A friend has a .338 Lap variant (37 deg. shoulder), built on a custom BAT action, Lilja barrel, walnut and carbon fiber long range hunting stock, Nightforce scope. He has shot a slightly under 1/4" 5 shot group at 100 yards. It has a tight neck, and he is a really good shooter.
 
sounds like a good 100/200 yd score gun.......
lol


Boyd Allen said:
A friend has a .338 Lap variant (37 deg. shoulder), built on a custom BAT action, Lilja barrel, walnut and carbon fiber long range hunting stock, Nightforce scope. He has shot a slightly under 1/4" 5 shot group at 100 yards. It has a tight neck, and he is a really good shooter.
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I think that Al is referring to the space between the end of the case neck, and the end of the neck portion of the chamber. Personally, I think that as you back up from the end of this part of the chamber, the chamber wall becomes more accessible by brushes and patches...so perhaps gapspace is a good thing. Carbon rings that I have seen, that were difficult to remove, and hard on accuracy were at the beginning of the leade. The stuff at the end of the case neck was just powder fouling that is positioned (back in the corner) so as to be difficult to reach, and is only a problem when there is too little clearance at the end of the case neck.
 
Yes, Boyd's got it, and Boyd may be right about it being a good thing. I've always "heard" that it's bad and keep mine to minimum generally but then I clean a LOT....

For a while it was a biggie topic with tools available to buy. Lotsa' talk about how Tony had a special tool made and someone made a tool from 22LR or 22mag cases.

And of course "whatever Tony's doing..."

al
 
Alinwa
Take one case and shorten the neck 0.040 and shoot the carbon ring out with two or three shots? Might make a for a good borescope test.
Lynn
 
Lynn,

Actually my first 6X47L was chambered with a 6BR reamer so it has easy 40thou.... I've fired it as many as 45+times between cleanings. (Heavy string) I did pressure out one time at a match with this barrel, lost three primers and blew up (?? dropped anyway??) a bullet.

I don't have a borescope.

al
 
Lynn, I think I misunderstood you. "Shoot the carbon ring out?" I've always understood the carbon ring to be at the base of the leade and absolutely impervious to anything short of a nuclear blast or direct impingement with 220psi carbide grit.....

Of course I've also believed that old formula BBS or worst case Montana Extreme Copper (red stuff) ate it out like gangbusters.

Shoot it out??

dunno


al
 
Alinwa
Al the idea is not to shoot all your rounds short just the ones that will act to blow out the carbon ring.
If your 0.020 off the leade and you get a carbon ring go another 0.020 off and let the charge do the work.If you post this on the competition forum some of the ppc guys will probaly chime in.
Have you tried out Hornady's new 285 grain bullets yet in your 338?
Lynn
 
goodgrouper said:
Me too.
I have about .025" gap space on my reamer and clean often. I use Bore Tech Eliminator and a nylon brush and I've never had any problems with the carbon. On my latest reamer (6ppc), I decided to use even less "gapspace" since I really am anal about the length of my brass with that cartridge. We'll see if less truly is better or if it won't make any difference at all!
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If you have 25 thou on the reamer then I'm guessing you've got more like 50 thou on your fired cases???

Or do you have two reamers and a fireform barrel?

What I'm driving at is that your improvement seems to radically shorten the cases. Back when I spent some years with the .243AI I approached this by having a reamer made with a shorter neck so that I would FF in one chamber and shoot in another. Virgin brass wouldn't even go into my shooter because the necks would bottom out.

al
 
goodgrouper said:
I think it was probably more like 60 thou initially. But now that I have fired them a bunch of times and haven't trimmed them way back, the gap has probably closed a bit. Anyhow, I can't say I saw a difference with it bigger or smaller just so long as I cleaned in my normal way.
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If what you say is true, IF the gap is closing, please be aware that that brass is being robbed from the base of the case down where the casewall thickens into the head. IF the gap is closing you're headed for a casehead separation.

For all those reading this who've had a casehead separation who say "PpPflplplplplaawwww, Big Deal" because they din't get hurt, be aware that casehead separations are like flat tires, most often uneventful. But that occasional one that blows the magwell out or scorches your face (not your beautiful eyes, because you WERE wearing your safety glasses) is the one we worry about.

IF your cases are growing I'll furthermore venture to guess that this is one of those rifles that "shoot tighter with distance?"

:)

al
 
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