Boyd Allen
Active member
I probably should wait a day or two to ask this, but did any of you who were there see any tuners in use?
Tuners at the Super Shoot?
- Thread starter Boyd Allen
- Start date
Jeff Stover
Member
I saw very few. I think Darrel Loker and Gene Beggs had one on their rifles. Not sure who else. I don't know of any in the Top 20, but I may be corrected on that.
S
scootertrash
Guest
I also only saw two tuners in use.
Mike
Mike
Bob Brushingham
Member
Charles Huckaba used one also to get in the top 20
Lawrence W.
New member
Yeah but, the way Charles shoots he would be in the top 20 with or without a tuner!
Dick Wright
New member
I didn't go looking for...
tuners but I did see that Hal Drake was shooting one as was Greame Smith. Beggs had one and so did I.
Drake shot his HV gun with a tuner, the same 30BR he shot a .150" agg with at Fairchance.
Dick
tuners but I did see that Hal Drake was shooting one as was Greame Smith. Beggs had one and so did I.
Drake shot his HV gun with a tuner, the same 30BR he shot a .150" agg with at Fairchance.
Dick
jackie schmidt
New member
Tuners
I am sorta hoping that in the coming months, everybody in Benchrest will decide that Tuners are just not worth the effort. Everybody that is, but me........jackie.
I am sorta hoping that in the coming months, everybody in Benchrest will decide that Tuners are just not worth the effort. Everybody that is, but me........jackie.
Probably not a good idea to monitor the use of tuners at a big tournament like the SS, because the top 20, those most watched and successfull, probably own hundreds of barrels each, and are able to find a barrel that is competitive at a big national shoot without the added variability and complexity of having a tuner attached.
Of course this all goes out the window if the overall winner or the majority of top 20 uses a tuner..............then tuners would become the new 6ppc of BR......................Don
Of course this all goes out the window if the overall winner or the majority of top 20 uses a tuner..............then tuners would become the new 6ppc of BR......................Don
Eddie Harren
Member
Tuners at the SS
Charles Huckaba told DJ and I, "I don't know if they work or not, but I've got one on every gun I brought with me".
Charles Huckaba told DJ and I, "I don't know if they work or not, but I've got one on every gun I brought with me".
M
mike in co
Guest
so why aren't you using a 222 instead of a ppc ??
its called change........some are followers some are leaders.
rather than put ones foot in your mouth , why not wait and see ?
the negatives i see in this sport is amazing.....lemmings...lemmings......
mike in co
jackie schmidt
New member
Why Argue About It
There are shooters who do all sorts of things differently in Benchrest.
Many use to the set statement, "Tony doesn't use a tuner, so why should I". That is a good point. What you are comfortable with is what you should go with.
The fact is, The NBRSA now has a pretty liberal tuner policy, so many of us see the worth in it, and have taken advantage of it.. Afterall, the thing that really counts is the agg.
If you use a tuner, and win, then you will probably continue to use a tuner.
If you do not use a tuner and win, then you will probably not be switching over any time soon.
I am not forcing anybody to use a tuner, and nobody is forcing me to take mine off. So where is the arguement??.......jackie
There are shooters who do all sorts of things differently in Benchrest.
Many use to the set statement, "Tony doesn't use a tuner, so why should I". That is a good point. What you are comfortable with is what you should go with.
The fact is, The NBRSA now has a pretty liberal tuner policy, so many of us see the worth in it, and have taken advantage of it.. Afterall, the thing that really counts is the agg.
If you use a tuner, and win, then you will probably continue to use a tuner.
If you do not use a tuner and win, then you will probably not be switching over any time soon.
I am not forcing anybody to use a tuner, and nobody is forcing me to take mine off. So where is the arguement??.......jackie
B
Bryce
Guest
Hal,
You are reading WAAY to much into Francis's comment !
He simply said that a top shooter would still be a top shooter with or without the tuner. They will win DESPITE the tuner not BECAUSE of it !
He didn't insinuate anything at all and I saw no comment about it being some kind of cheating.
He is dead right. Read what you just wrote above, you have shot a lot this year and you work hard at it, right ! Does the success you have had come only from the tuner or is the tuner just another piece of your system and any success you have is the result of overall good management and work ?? Do you think you could have had just as much success if you didn't use a tuner and worked just as hard at your overall shooting sysytem ? If the answer is yes then you really contradicted your own arguement, if the answer is no then you are probably giving more credit than is due to the tuner and not enough to yourself and the work you have put in.
Bryce
You are reading WAAY to much into Francis's comment !
He simply said that a top shooter would still be a top shooter with or without the tuner. They will win DESPITE the tuner not BECAUSE of it !
He didn't insinuate anything at all and I saw no comment about it being some kind of cheating.
He is dead right. Read what you just wrote above, you have shot a lot this year and you work hard at it, right ! Does the success you have had come only from the tuner or is the tuner just another piece of your system and any success you have is the result of overall good management and work ?? Do you think you could have had just as much success if you didn't use a tuner and worked just as hard at your overall shooting sysytem ? If the answer is yes then you really contradicted your own arguement, if the answer is no then you are probably giving more credit than is due to the tuner and not enough to yourself and the work you have put in.
Bryce
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Pete Wass
Well-known member
Personaly speaking
It makes more sense to me to use a tuner if they will simplify things and if they will take Tune thing out of the mix, to some extent. Some of those making tuners say they are able to do as I mentioned. Rather or not folks want to simplify their life or reduce the need to buy as many barrels as they do is strictly up to them. Me, I love new stuff.
It makes more sense to me to use a tuner if they will simplify things and if they will take Tune thing out of the mix, to some extent. Some of those making tuners say they are able to do as I mentioned. Rather or not folks want to simplify their life or reduce the need to buy as many barrels as they do is strictly up to them. Me, I love new stuff.
B
Bryce
Guest
Hal,
Francis simply said .......
"Right on the mark, Lawrence and that is what I've been saying right along; the guy with a tuner will be "up there" with or without."
Meaning that the shooter that placed up in the top 20 with a tuner would have been in the top 20 without a tuner as well, it is the shooter making the small groups and not the tuner, pretty simple.
And then followed up after your comment with ......
"I don't shoot rimfire and I've never even seen a tuner in the flesh. I tune my centerfire rigs with a powder measure and with neck tension and seating depth. I do things the old fashioned way. I work at it."
What part of his first comment infers anythig at all ? Isn't it true that a good shooter will be a good shooter with or without a tuner ? Are you a good shooter Hal ? Do you owe all of that to the tuner ??? Of course not !! I don't see the issue here.
The only bit that anything at all could be inferred from is the "I work at it" and I think Francis is clever enough to know that if he saw a tuner as being such an advantage as to be borderline cheating he'd be using one himself !! He certainly wouldn't see them as such an advantage as to be "cheating" and then say that a good shooter will win with or without the thing, that just doesn't make any logical sense.
Like I said, in my opinion, you are getting yourself all wound up about nothing here, but if you want to you go right ahead.
Francis simply said .......
"Right on the mark, Lawrence and that is what I've been saying right along; the guy with a tuner will be "up there" with or without."
Meaning that the shooter that placed up in the top 20 with a tuner would have been in the top 20 without a tuner as well, it is the shooter making the small groups and not the tuner, pretty simple.
And then followed up after your comment with ......
"I don't shoot rimfire and I've never even seen a tuner in the flesh. I tune my centerfire rigs with a powder measure and with neck tension and seating depth. I do things the old fashioned way. I work at it."
What part of his first comment infers anythig at all ? Isn't it true that a good shooter will be a good shooter with or without a tuner ? Are you a good shooter Hal ? Do you owe all of that to the tuner ??? Of course not !! I don't see the issue here.
The only bit that anything at all could be inferred from is the "I work at it" and I think Francis is clever enough to know that if he saw a tuner as being such an advantage as to be borderline cheating he'd be using one himself !! He certainly wouldn't see them as such an advantage as to be "cheating" and then say that a good shooter will win with or without the thing, that just doesn't make any logical sense.
Like I said, in my opinion, you are getting yourself all wound up about nothing here, but if you want to you go right ahead.
J
j mckinnie
Guest
Chill out
Hal the tuner is in the rules if you like them use them.Any rimfire guy will not shoot without one,but I'm not a rimfire guy & at present I do what Francis does.
He coats his booollets I dont is he cheating?He also loads at the range?
You read stuff that isn't there BR has so many variables that are being explored all the time,if or when tuners are proven to win we all will use them.
You bite well I bet Francis is getting a giggle out of this thread.
good shootin & good luck Jim
Hal the tuner is in the rules if you like them use them.Any rimfire guy will not shoot without one,but I'm not a rimfire guy & at present I do what Francis does.
He coats his booollets I dont is he cheating?He also loads at the range?
You read stuff that isn't there BR has so many variables that are being explored all the time,if or when tuners are proven to win we all will use them.
You bite well I bet Francis is getting a giggle out of this thread.
good shootin & good luck Jim
jackie schmidt
New member
Jj
I believe the statements you are referring to are being made by some shooters who do not compete in 100-200 yard Competition.
Any shooter who has has success with tuners in Competition, (I suppose I am one), will tell you that it is simply another way to tune the Rifle. In my opinion, you cannot make a barrel shoot any better with a tuner than it would with the more conventional methods.
I still have to arrive at a load that is pretty close to what the Rifle likes. Being able to stick 29.0 grns of powder in, seat a bullet, and tune strictly with the tuner is wishful thinking. You might be able to get it to shoot pretty good, but in todays game, just "pretty good" usually isn't good enough.
But, once I have that load pretty close, I can do all of the fine tuning with the tuner, never touching anything else.
So, what is the advantage of using a tuner?? One. That being, you can change the tune at the line, emmediately, when the need arises.
There are drawbacks. One, in the 10.5 pound classes, you have to get the weight, (usually 5-6 ounces) off some where else. Second, the cost of the tuner, plus the added work in machining the barrel to accept it.
Tuners are simply another way to arrive at a common end, that keeping the Rifle in a competitive tune. Learning how to use one, and knowing what to do, can be just as difficult as using the more conventional methods.......jackie
I believe the statements you are referring to are being made by some shooters who do not compete in 100-200 yard Competition.
Any shooter who has has success with tuners in Competition, (I suppose I am one), will tell you that it is simply another way to tune the Rifle. In my opinion, you cannot make a barrel shoot any better with a tuner than it would with the more conventional methods.
I still have to arrive at a load that is pretty close to what the Rifle likes. Being able to stick 29.0 grns of powder in, seat a bullet, and tune strictly with the tuner is wishful thinking. You might be able to get it to shoot pretty good, but in todays game, just "pretty good" usually isn't good enough.
But, once I have that load pretty close, I can do all of the fine tuning with the tuner, never touching anything else.
So, what is the advantage of using a tuner?? One. That being, you can change the tune at the line, emmediately, when the need arises.
There are drawbacks. One, in the 10.5 pound classes, you have to get the weight, (usually 5-6 ounces) off some where else. Second, the cost of the tuner, plus the added work in machining the barrel to accept it.
Tuners are simply another way to arrive at a common end, that keeping the Rifle in a competitive tune. Learning how to use one, and knowing what to do, can be just as difficult as using the more conventional methods.......jackie