trouble throwing charges

Wilbur

The box in the picture, came especially fitted with screw in latches. I didn't do it. Wouldn't know how. The box closes tightly and stays that way. To lock the box,Screw the latches in snug and remove the Key.




Glenn
 
I have never tried to throw h4198 sc, so I cannot speak to that, but there are a couple of things that are worth saying. Take a look at the records with the understanding that many were shot BC (before Chargemaster) and all of Ococks current records were shot with thrown charges. Also, a getting good with a measure can take a lot of time, and some aptitude, just because an excellent shooter admits to mediocre results does not mean that a thing cannot be done. Shooting and powder throwing are different, if related skills. If you are not getting the results that you would like, the first thing that you need to do is to admit that you may have some learning to do. That may be a lot harder than learning how to do a better job of throwing powder....egos being what they are.
 
Sir,

Boyd Allen said:
I have never tried to throw h4198 sc, so I cannot speak to that, but there are a couple of things that are worth saying. Take a look at the records with the understanding that many were shot BC (before Chargemaster) and all of Ococks current records were shot with thrown charges. Also, a getting good with a measure can take a lot of time, and some aptitude, just because an excellent shooter admits to mediocre results does not mean that a thing cannot be done. Shooting and powder throwing are different, if related skills. If you are not getting the results that you would like, the first thing that you need to do is to admit that you may have some learning to do. That may be a lot harder than learning how to do a better job of throwing powder....egos being what they are.
Click to expand...
I will be the first one to admit that the thrown charge method requires work on my part. I also have to admit that not having accurate charges is especially frustrating. All the prep etc. yet to perform poorly and not be able to identify the cause detracts from the enjoyment.. The learning curve for this entire Bench Rest/ supreme accuracy endeavor is not linear and I think that I am possibly one third up the scale. Faith in my own aptitude abounds. I spent my entire working career as a master of things much more difficult than throwing a consistent powder charge. Simply trying to make some headway. While, especially in this endeavor, it's the trip, not the destination, sometimes eliminating a hassle or two can be prudent. I doubt if I would have made this statement as a 45 year old but the 65 year old me can allow himself to possibly take the easier path. Scoring with the likes of current record holders seems way way far away. I simply like to bust shells, try to correctly read conditions and do my best.Spending a day or two with shooters, especially the one's who run the shoots make this pastime what it is for me.I have to say that over the years I have found your posts to be most informative and ones that I take as gospel. Never questioning, just read and learn.
Tim Thompson
Hanover PA
 
My understanding

jackie schmidt said:
You would need about 150 Vials, if you do not plan on changing the load.

The thing about Vials is you don't need so many pieces of brass made up. But,you can be assured that all of the charges are exact.

But, just like pre-loading, if the load doesn't seem right, you are back to square one.

I shot Pre-loaded rounds for the Crawfish, at times I shot very well, at others, I stunk it up.
Click to expand...

is that one could pre-load for a 30 br much easier than a 6 ppc or Beggs. Having never been to a group match there is a lot I do not know, however from what I read and heard, changing loads is pretty much required. I will probally go to on or two matches pre-loaded to get the jist of things and take it from there, as I don't even know how much of a change to make. I hear that some guys change charges, neck tension and seating depth depending on what? Long way to go for this feller.

LASER
 
It sounds like you hare having a great time. Good! Figuring this stuff out is the fun. BTW I have absolutely no problem with using Chargemasters, it is just that I managed to stumble on a better way to throw. My primary motivation is not wanting to haul another box to the range. On tuning changes I suggest that you never practice preloaded. Take your loading equipment and fired cases to the range and go from there, taking notes as you go. Above all, try a bunch of stuff to see what happens, that is the only sure way to know. This applies to wind as well. Take some shots in conditions that you know will not work with a center hold for producing another wallet group, just to learn how a particular condition moves a bullet. Better yet, shoot some video of the flags while you shoot one shot per aiming point under different conditions, with a tuned up load, and a good still air zero. I really like your enthusiasm. The context is a very different, but the words fit.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hRX6hSGeZs4
 
you talk about poor reading skills...
i thought we were talking about scales...in grains and .1's of a grain .
all the sudden francis is talking about PERCENT

wtf francis
 
We use digital scales every day while making cores, they are temperature sensitive, require warm up, ( we leave them on 24/7) vary because of a number of other reasons, even a cell phone close by seems to make them go crazy. We use three different scales, trying to find out which one is lying and they are always lying, we consistently use check weights and re-calibrate. When they are good they are very good, but when they are bad, your screwed.
So my question is this, if I can buy a $300 loadmaster and the scale be perfect and right all the time, why wouldn't I buy one to use in our core making business?
Charlie
 
Depending on what....?

Depending on placement! If you're winning, don't change anything. If you're losing, change enough stuff so that it will goof you up for two or three matches at the least.
 
FBecigneul said:
Without ever having a Chargemaster, I have suspected the same for a long time. After all, a scale commands the operation. One can't call a single standing scale inaccurate and then call the Chargemaster accurate, can they? We messed around with a friend's Lyman system a few years ago and re-named it Liar. It was off more than our Harrel, our Pact, and our balance beam. Drop them carefully and watch your flags closely.

I hope this satisfies MikeInCo.
Click to expand...

Francis, I see shooters at matches place a case on a electronic scale and "zero" it, throw a charge, place it on the scale, take it off to add a tad of powder, and it weighs less when they put it back on. Real reliability.

They only place I trust a scale is in the controlled inviroment of my living room.
 
Francis,
I noticed you ignored the issue.
Choose to call me names rather than man up and admit you are wrong.
Typical behavior by loosers....change the subject and call people names.

And as i suggested, you did not attack jackie on his position, but only me.

Keep calling me names, it does not change your error nor your poor behavior.
 
Laser...some good advice even if it doesn't sound like it

Those that begin shooting Benchrest often see it as a big deal when it really isn't. The folks that are winning have one thing in common. All the others have something else in common. The winners have a rifle that's capable of winning while the others don't. No, I don't know why a rifle will or will not win but I know this to be true. Never stop trying to find a winner or quit working on the rifle at hand until you have a rifle that's capable of winning. The differences in a winner and a loser are often difficult to see. Look at the score sheets rather than the bullet holes - always.
 
2:45AM est

Boyd Allen said:
I have never tried to throw h4198 sc, so I cannot speak to that, but there are a couple of things that are worth saying. Take a look at the records with the understanding that many were shot BC (before Chargemaster) and all of Ococks current records were shot with thrown charges. Also, a getting good with a measure can take a lot of time, and some aptitude, just because an excellent shooter admits to mediocre results does not mean that a thing cannot be done. Shooting and powder throwing are different, if related skills. If you are not getting the results that you would like, the first thing that you need to do is to admit that you may have some learning to do. That may be a lot harder than learning how to do a better job of throwing powder....egos being what they are.
Click to expand...

Sat STRAIGHT UP IN BED!!! H4198 SC??? Hobbled out to the garage and into my gun room. Sure enough... two jugs of H4198. NOT SC!!!! Starts to make sense. Seems I was throwing charges while cutting powder. I had to have read discussions on this issue. Wonder why it never occurred to me? Probably as a kid loading for my hunting guns it never mattered and I never used a thrower for long range BR. A 65 year old man should know better than to tell somebody how smart he is! Back to the drawing board. Will proceed with plans to load at the range with the Chargemaster. A nice project. Probably get a brand new one. Let one in the gun room for long range pre-loading like I have been and build stuff for short range loading at the range. Will get some SC and practice with the Harrell. I like the idea of not hauling the charge master around and the Culver type is way faster.... I also like to be confident that at least my powder charges are consistent. Plus I have lots of powder. Thank you Boyd! Thank you all for the input. Acquired lots of good advice from this thread.

"What a revolting development this is"
William Bendix in "The Life of Riley"
 
One can say

What they want about thrown versus weighed charges. For myself it is all about piece of mind for me.

I will agree that matches are won in that 7 minute time frame but I think you need to be in a good psychological state of mind. If that means throwing and weighing charges so be it.

I wish I could trust thrown charges but I cannot. That is me. I have my routine and I do not to **** with it. I may not have all the time to sit and watch flags before my match but my thinking is different. I do not care what the wind is in the match before me, it matters for my match.

My take, do what makes you feel the most comfortable.

Calvin
 
Trouble Throwing Charges

This discussion and my experience throwing powder at matches,makes me want to go back to shooting Rim Fire BR. Been thinking about it lately.

The last time I was at a Rim Fire Match,I saw Rifles with tuners on tuners attached to the barrel. :(

Its a tough game,anyway you look at it.



Glenn
 
Last edited:
Most

FBecigneul said:
I think it was Dick Wright who said some years ago that the nice thing about rimfire was that you could watch the spent case bounce on the concrete and not have to pick it up. It is an option, I guess Glenn. I think too that too many make too much of too many of the variables of Centerfire.
Click to expand...

ranges ask rimfire shoots to sweep up after themselves. Human nature being what it is, some do and some don't. Me? I sweep up, save the casings and sell them as scrap from time to time. Helps me buy more rimfire ammo!
 
LASER - please keep in mind in your quest for accuracy/precision. Many times people will spend many hours trying to get that extra .0XX of an inch (or less) only to lose .X of an inch (or more) because they didn't spend the same amount of time practicing shooting in the wind. I think thrown vs weighed charges falls in the category of .0XX.

Stanley

P.S. Francis isn't a loser. He just looks like one
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top