Need thinner recoil lug

T

terry sims

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I attempted to install a new takeoff barrel on a Remington action. Using a go-gage the chamber appears to be .008 long (4 layers of Scotch tape). I should just cut the shoulder back, but the barrel is short for my head stock and and I have no 30 cal pins for alignment. I was wondering if one can purchase a recoil lug ground .008 thinner than the existing lug and just screw the barrel on. I checked, the bolt to barrel distance will be OK.
Terry Sims
 
Two options here:

1) Take the recoil lug to a local machine shop and have them surface grind .008" from the thickness.

2) Buy or make a lathe mandrel to hold the 700 action (Brownell's) and face .008" off the front of the receiver.

Better yet, combine 1) and 2): Have the machine shop just clean up both sides of the lug so everything's parallel to within maybe .0002". Then take measurements and face off the receiver the remaining few thousandths to get your .008". Not only will you have your barrel fitted, but you'll have done a couple of "nifty accuracy things" in the process.... Oh, yeah... before you do these, use something like shim or gauge stock instead of scotch tape when trying the go gauge... better yet, take all measurements with a good depth mike and forget the shims.
 
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You are not concerned about the printing on the barrel? Where it ends up?

You will also have about 2 thou compression when you tighten the barrel...

I would suggest using a live center as well as a steady rest for the machining ... you don't need to worry about dialling it in...
 
Terry,
If you will give me the exact measurement that you need, I will surface grind one of mine and send it to you for postage.
Butch
 
recoil lug

Butch. You are a prince! That is a vary generous offer. I measured the existing lug and its mikes at .1898. I would think a .183 thick lug would work. It may end up 1 or 2 thous long but I think it will be OK. First let me try Dennis's suggestion and see if the shoulder will dial in flat with a live center. If it will, I will just make some chips and be a happy camper.
Terry Sims
 
If the barrel is screwed into the action farther, what about front of bolt lugs and front of bolt nose clearances? Would the normal factory clearances be large enough that with the barrel .008 farther in things still wouldn't touch?
 
I'd just cut a center on the headstock, then hold the barrel between centers using a lathe dog on the muzzle end to keep the barrel from turning at the headstock and take the .008" off the shoulder going little by little and trying it with a go gage until the chamber has a slight feel on the go gage. If you have to take more out of the counterbore, run the threads on the steadyrest to recut the counterbore. You can pull the lathe dog against the dead center in the headstock with a bungee cord or clamp the muzzle end in the chuck without the center to recut the counterbore. The counterbore isn't critical except for setting for minimal gap between the end of the bolt nose and counterbore of the barrel.
 
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Remington dimensions

This turn out to be a real education. Boyd and Mike brought up the bolt face to recess issue. So I measured all of the dimensions (three times) on the two Remington barrels a 243 that was on the receiver and the 308 take off. To my disbelief I have .175 between the end of the bolt and the end of the recess on the 243 barrel. The only barrels I have worked with thus far have been around .005. To check my measurements I mounded a pile (~ .070) of grease on the front of the bolt and closed the bolt. No contact with the recess. I then checked the expansion at the web on a once fired piece of 243 factory brass ( .003). The 308 barrel has similar dimensions except for the long chamber. So I am going to do what Dennis suggested and set the shoulder back on the 308 barrel to fit the go gage. Have any of you experienced such sloppy dimensions on Remington 700 rifles? :eek:
Terry Sims
 
More than not..

The rule of consistancy with Remington factory guns is there is no consistency. Id your bolt face clearing the tenon by at least .005. If so you could turn or lap the lugs until you have bolt closure.
Rustystud
 
terry sims said:
To my disbelief I have .175 between the end of the bolt and the end of the recess on the 243 barrel. Terry Sims
Click to expand...

Terry

I, like you, find that hard to believe. Very hard. A bolt nose normally measure about .145" to .150" long and the recess (counterbore) is usually a little more, maybe .155" +/-. So, either you measured wrong, you got your decimal in the wrong place, or you have the world's sloppiest Remington. :eek:

Since you obviously have a lathe and know how to use it why don't you simply treat this as though you're fitting a new barrel?? :rolleyes: Make all adjustments to the barrel itself otherwise you going to end up with all kinds of off-standard dimensions on the receiver, lug, bolt, etc. which will only make the next re-barrel job that much harder.

Ray
 
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Cheechako said:
Terry

I, like you, find that hard to believe. Very hard. A bolt nose normally measure about .145" to .150" long and the recess (counterbore) is usually a little more, maybe .155" +/-. So, either you measured wrong, you got your decimal in the wrong place, or you have the world's sloppiest Remington. :eek:

Since you obviously have a lathe and know how to use it why don't you simply treat this as though you're fitting a new barrel?? :rolleyes: Make all adjustments to the barrel itself otherwise you going to end up with all kinds of off-standard dimensions on the receiver, lug, bolt, etc. which will only make the next re-barrel job that much harder.

Ray
Click to expand...

Yah! and the prize goes to Ray for the only logical answer..............all those other suggestions about action and lug alterations, youve got to be kidding!

Machine the barrel and keep the action to factory specs. so future chamberings are to spec.
 
correct measurements

Ray, I can assure you that my measurements are correct. So I can feel proud to be the owner of the world sloppiest Remington. What is interesting is it did not shoot factory 243 ammo all that bad. This is a discounted J-lock for which the sporting goods store charged me less than three hundred. I bought for the action. For the time being I will fit the 308 barrel and use it as a back up deer rifle.
Thanks to all .
Terry Sims
 
Just to verify what Terry has stated, I to had the same thing this past winter. Working with a vintage 700 of my own, early 70’s, I purchased a takeoff .243 Varmint barrel of late production to play with. My measurements were almost a carbon copy of Terry’s; I would guess that that his barrel had rolled threads as mine did?

Rick
 
Mike Bryant said:
I'd just cut a center on the headstock, then hold the barrel between centers using a lathe dog on the muzzle end to keep the barrel from turning at the headstock and take the .008" off the shoulder going little by little and trying it with a go gage until the chamber has a slight feel on the go gage. If you have to take more out of the counterbore, run the threads on the steadyrest to recut the counterbore. You can pull the lathe dog against the dead center in the headstock with a bungee cord or clamp the muzzle end in the chuck without the center to recut the counterbore. The counterbore isn't critical except for setting for minimal gap between the end of the bolt nose and counterbore of the barrel.
Click to expand...

I was kinda thinking through you and Dennis' suggestions, and both seem the most logical.

But since he's not rechambering, and just reducing headspace, wouldn't it make the most sense to put the muzzle in a 4 jaw and breech in a live center? or, if he wanted to ream, put the breech in a steady rest?

I was thinking that putting a barrel between centers could damage the crown? Which he could not reface in his lathe.
 
Ben,
The bore at the muzzle will not be concentric to the OD of the barrel. That is why Mike suggested doing it that way. He can then turn it around and recrown it if he wants.
Butch
 
I am done

An end to this adventure. I measured the bore to outside to the barrel at the muzzle,6 thou off. Set it up as Dennis suggested between chuck and live center, wobble ,wobble, as measured off the unthreaded portion of tenon. So I took Mike Bryant’s advice and set it up through the headstock. First I made a new spider by drilling and taping the outside spindle. Then I turned a pin to just fit the bore. Indicating mid way up the chamber and off the pin in the muzzle I dialed the barrel dead nuts. The tenon was 4 thou out of alignment with the chamber. Took a skim cut on the tenon and cut the shoulder back 10 thou to just close on the go gage plus one layer of tape. Put the barrel on and tighten to 120 f/lb for a good fit on the go-gage. To all of you gunsmith this may be just an every day kind of occurrence and I did nothing that has not been discussed on this forum. Thank all of you for making this such a great place to learn.
Terry Sims
 
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Butch, The excessive bolt nose clearance is still a concern although shortened by 10 thous by the shoulder cut. The recess cut is .249 deep on both barrels leading me to suspect that they use a reamer that indicates of the end of the barrel to make this cut. The bolt nose is only 84 thous into the recess. I do not have a 308 reamer to correct this problem. This sort of thing seem common in Remington’s as of late, but hay, I have 3 rings of steel! Seriously I will not let this rifle out of my hands in this configuration. I will use Lupua brass with moderate loads and keep a close eye on the web expansion. Mickey if this gun came into your shop you would wonder what knucklehead did this. The stamping is a ¼ turn off and no way to correct this without a reamer. If it will shoot a minute of deer I will be happy.
Terry Sims
 
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